Wikipedia:In the news/Candidates/March 2020

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March 31[edit]

Business and economy

Disasters and accidents

Health and environment

International relations

Law and crime

Politics and elections

Science and technology

Sports

(Posted) RD: James A. Redden[edit]

Article: James A. Redden (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Portland Tribune
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: American judge & politician, District of Oregon Chief Judge. Non-COVID. - Indefensible (talk) 23:59, 1 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

  • Weak support it's okay but who (or what) determined which cases were "notable" for inclusion? The Rambling Man (Staying alive since 2005!) 08:57, 2 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Posted - with no opposition and a support (albeit weak), this seems just about good to go. The structure is a little odd, with his death folded into the "federal judge" section but not the "notable cases", but looks OK to me as well otherwise.  — Amakuru (talk) 14:36, 2 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

(Stale) RD: Pape Diouf[edit]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.


Article: Pape Diouf (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): BBC News
Credits:
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: President of Marseille Football club dies of coronavirus Pharaoh of the Wizards (talk) 21:09, 1 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Weak oppose weak article, several dead links and some citation needed. The Rambling Man (Staying alive since 2005!) 08:58, 2 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support - Added a ref to address the 1 cn tag. Even with the dead link tags, there are other refs which cover. Seems to meet the minimum requirements. - Indefensible (talk) 04:18, 3 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

(Posted) RD: Abdul Halim Khaddam[edit]

Article: Abdul Halim Khaddam (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Huron Daily Tribune
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Syrian politician, Vice President of Syria and interim President. Non-COVID. - Indefensible (talk) 16:59, 1 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Gita Ramjee[edit]

Article: Gita Ramjee (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): BBC
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Top news on BBC. Sadly, the article was created recently. Covid-19 related. Sherenk1 (talk) 12:18, 1 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

(Stale) RD: Wallace Roney[edit]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.


Article: Wallace Roney (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): New York Times
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: Covid19 death, noted worldwide. Still some things to source, but article is almost there after a lot of work (not by me, by others!). Fram (talk) 09:03, 1 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

(Closed) US offers Venezuela power-sharing deal[edit]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.


Article: Negotiations during the Venezuelan crisis (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ The United States proposes a new diplomatic solution to the Venezuelan presidential crisis, suggesting a power-sharing deal between government factions in the country. (Post)
News source(s): BBC
Credits:

Article updated
Nominator's comments: Alt blurbs and anyone who can identify the ref issues will be appreciated Kingsif (talk) 22:06, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Wait If VZ accepts the deal, that would be reason to post. --Masem (t) 22:09, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Wait per Masem but an interesting development. --LaserLegs (talk) 23:25, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment Agreed with the two above. The article is not in great shape. I would normally suggest that these go into a more general article, like Government of Venezuela or Politics of Venezuela, but those are both orange tagged and I suspect changes to them would be contentious.130.233.2.31 (talk) 06:10, 1 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose don't post proposals. The Rambling Man (Staying alive since 2005!) 09:23, 1 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose posting a mere proposal- if accepted, that would merit posting. 331dot (talk) 09:24, 1 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose. It seems extremely unlikely that Maduro will agree to any American proposal. Diplomats airing ideas without practical effect does not justify an ITN blurb. Modest Genius talk 11:09, 1 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose I'm sure Maduro will happily agree to a deal with the country that wants to arrest him for drug trafficking.--WaltCip (talk) 12:34, 1 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

(Stale) RD: Pierre Bénichou[edit]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.


Article: Pierre Bénichou (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Le Monde, Archyde
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: French Journalist, Columnist Manish2542 (talk) 09:09, 1 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

(Posted) RD: Reimar Lüst[edit]

Article: Reimar Lüst (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Max Planck Society
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: German astrophysicist, Max Planck Society president, European Space Agency director general. - Indefensible (talk) 18:57, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

  • non-COVID related, it seems. --Masem (t) 19:43, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Weak oppose what's there is fine but for such an eminent astrophysicist, the article is weak. The Rambling Man (Staying alive since 2005!)
    I need a break, Penderecki and all!! Will do tomorrow, unless someone beats me to it. I neglected a GA review all these days. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 19:58, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    I found the ESA link and used it, please look again. Someone who knows astrophysics, please also look. I had no better way to summarize his achievements than putting it in quotation marks, - I'd have no idea how to rephrase it and still say the same. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 08:50, 1 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    Much better, needs the {{dn}} to be fixed but otherwise good improvement. The Rambling Man (Staying alive since 2005!) 09:31, 1 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    I dared to use the German WP for the dab ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 09:55, 1 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Dab? You're referring to the Dortmunder Actien Brauerei, nicht?Sca (talk) 14:35, 1 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Weak support – At 300 words it's thin, but for a non-Anglo expert in a specialized academic field it may be just enough. (The footnoted Max Planck Society announcement is fairly extensive, and is in English.) Duly copy-edited. – Sca (talk) 21:17, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support Brief, but what's there is referenced, and there do not appear to be any major chronological gaps in his biography. Hrodvarsson (talk) 02:12, 1 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support It was recently expanded. Article is sourced. TJMSmith (talk) 02:44, 1 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • (Posted to RD)  — Amakuru (talk) 10:44, 1 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: James T. Goodrich[edit]

Article: James T. Goodrich (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): [1]
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

 Natureium (talk) 15:34, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

  • COVID-related --Masem (t) 17:32, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support barring that one marked CN (about his influence from Olser, which I'm unable to find a source for immediately - however, there's still news reports coming in on his death so may be sourcable). That line's not needed immediately otherwise this seems ready to go. --Masem (t) 17:32, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support - Meets the requirements. - Indefensible (talk) 18:00, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support per Masem's assessment. TJMSmith (talk) 18:01, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Awaiting missing reference (or removal of sentence if not required) — Martin (MSGJ · talk) 18:08, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
I removed the uncited statement. TJMSmith (talk) 18:19, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

March 30[edit]

Armed conflicts and attacks

Business and economy

Health and environment

Law and crime

Politics and elections

Sports

(Closed) Amazon warehouse protests[edit]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.


Article: Amazon (company) (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ Workers protest at Amazon warehouses in the US and Europe over safety policies; one protest organizer in New York is fired by the company. (Post)
News source(s): BBC
Credits:

Article updated
Nominator's comments: Weak nom, vaguely interesting company news. Dedicated article section at Amazon_(company)#Employee_protests_during_Covid-19 Kingsif (talk) 21:45, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose rather trivial in the grand scheme of things. – John M Wolfson (talkcontribs) 21:48, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment this is going to die in a hail of "we already have a COVID-19 banner" but otherwise I think it would be notable enough to post on it's own. --LaserLegs (talk) 23:24, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose Really? WaltCip (talk) 23:38, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose - very trivial at the moment (compared to COVID) RedBulbBlueBlood9911 (talk) 07:33, 1 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose Too trivial at the best of times, let alone at the moment. - SchroCat (talk) 09:35, 1 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose a lot of people are upset about the behaviour of a lot of companies (and a lot of heads of state) in a lot of countries. This is trivial. The Rambling Man (Staying alive since 2005!) 09:35, 1 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

(Posted) RD: Joachim Yhombi-Opango[edit]

Article: Joachim Yhombi-Opango (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Le Figaro (French)
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Congolese president & prime minister. COVID-19. - Indefensible (talk) 02:14, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

  • Weak oppose it's justifiably tagged as poorly constructed, but once that's resolved, it might be suitable. The Rambling Man (Staying alive since 2005!) 09:49, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support Will fully support this as soon as the career section is broken up into digestible sections. TJMSmith (talk) 11:24, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment - Yhombi-Opango was the prime minister and president of the Republic of Congo. Should this be a blurb? TJMSmith (talk) 11:44, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    • Unfortunately I don't think the quality of the article leads it to reach that level of posting. SpencerT•C 14:11, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    (edit conflict) Probably not. Based on the lack of consensus to blurb Daniel arap Moi, a twenty-year Kenyan president who also died of old age recently, it's unlikely there'll be consensus for this one in a non-English-speaking country... I'm guessing we will end up posting blurbs for the likes of Jimmy Carter, John Major, John Howard etc, but that's just the way it is. Also, the quality needs to be fixed up before it can even go to RD.  — Amakuru (talk) 14:13, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    • Heads of state/government in non-English speaking countries tend to have a higher bar to clear for blurb status, which I don't believe this passes. – John M Wolfson (talkcontribs) 17:01, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support satis. – John M Wolfson (talkcontribs) 17:01, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Added sections per The Rambling Man, TJMSmith. - Indefensible (talk) 16:43, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks Indefensible! TJMSmith (talk) 16:59, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support RD only. Past sitting president of a non-G20-type country is ..at least at this point, not high priority for ITN. But otherwise looks good. --Masem (t) 17:04, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  •  Posted — Martin (MSGJ · talk) 18:02, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Lorena Borjas[edit]

Article: Lorena Borjas (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Advocate
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Mexican/American transgender rights activist. COVID-19. - Indefensible (talk) 02:09, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Arianne Caoili[edit]

Article: Arianne Caoili (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Public Radio of Armenia, chess24
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Filipino/Australian Chess Woman International Master. - Indefensible (talk) 02:01, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

(Needs editor attention) Viktor Orbán rule by decree in Hungary[edit]

Article: Viktor Orbán (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: Hungarian Prime Minister Viktor Orbán is authorized by parliament to rule by decree indefinitely (Post)
Alternative blurb: Hungarian Prime Minister Viktor Orbán is authorized by parliament to rule by decree indefinitely
News source(s): CNN, Politico, DW, Washington Post, Business Insider
Credits:

Article needs updating

Nominator's comments: Related to the coronavirus pandemic, but is more connected to the general shift towards authoritarianism under Orbán. A very significant focal point in that regard, and will have profound impacts on Hungarian politics. Articles needs updating and check for quality. ― Hebsen (talk) 22:57, 30 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

  • Oppose Lots of countries have been imposing decrees and states of emergency which have been criticised as threats to liberty. This doesn't seem very different and the article hasn't been updated. Andrew🐉(talk) 11:51, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment I want to support this - it's a huge victory for right wing authoritarianism - but the target is orange tagged and there is no update. Maybe COVID-19 in Hungary is a better target? Is anyone contesting this (I smell a constitutional crisis brewing). --LaserLegs (talk) 11:52, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose – Hungarian political machinations, however ominous they may sound, generally lack wider significance. (Blurb lacks period.)Sca (talk) 14:18, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Please do not... "oppose an item because the event is only relating to a single country, or failing to relate to one. This applies to a high percentage of the content we post and is unproductive." --LaserLegs (talk) 14:19, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Going to the infallible rule book again, are we? Use your head. The item is of scant interest to a majority of Eng.-lang. readers, esp. in the current news environment. – Sca (talk) 14:36, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
How did you make that determination? 331dot (talk) 14:39, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
(edit conflict) I used my head. It's chock full of empirical guidance. – Sca (talk) 14:57, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Did you survey all English speakers in the world? I wasn't called. Seriously, what was your guidance? 331dot (talk) 14:59, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
AUT TACE AUT LOQUERE MELIORA SILENTIO.Sca (talk) 15:08, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support on the merits. A legislative body voting to surrender its authority with no end date is unusual. 331dot (talk) 14:42, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose As noted, we haven't actually got any content on the issue at hand. Nigej (talk) 16:25, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support on merit, oppose on quality the "indefinite" part is the newsworthy item, however there are quite a few uncited paragraphs and a lot of citation needed tags, and an orange tag. Also, it hasn't been duly updated for this event. – John M Wolfson (talkcontribs) 16:28, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support and suggest alt-blurb - A formerly democratic European country sliding to dictatorship is a big fucking deal. That said, Victor Orban isn't the best target - I suggest instead 2020 coronavirus pandemic in Hungary#State of emergency. Rami R 17:09, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support in principle, agree with above that the target should be changed from Orban Kingsif (talk) 18:09, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Week oppose This seems like yet another coronavirus article we're highlighting, and we have a permalink in the ITN box for a reason, to avoid incremental and local updates on the issue, which would overwhelm the ITN box. --Jayron32 18:21, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    I don't feel there's much point to ITN if we don't occasionally highlight coronavirus related events - the permalink doesn't really cover everything, and completely ignoring individual events feels like we're ignoring the elephant in the room (think banner blindness). More specifically, it's very easy to miss local developments from the permalinks - local developments which nonetheless have global implications, such as these Hungarian developments. Rami R 18:36, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    Every country in the world is doing something unprecedented and with long-term and global implications. Hungary is not particularly unique or unusual in this regard. While every single country may be doing different unprecedented things, they're all doing something which would be unusual, noteworthy, or maybe even outrageous in normal times. These are not normal times, and while not every country is responding in exactly the same way Hungary is, they are all doing something to which your argument could be applied. --Jayron32 18:42, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    COVID is just a pretext; this has been in the offing for years. --47.146.63.87 (talk) 20:53, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    That's as maybe. I can see he has dictatorial tendencies but its not our business to prejudge. Nigej (talk) 21:01, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    Right, my point is, I think that just because there's some COVID aspect doesn't mean it should automatically be relegated to the COVID pages and barred from ITN. At some level we're always judging whether something is "newsworthy enough" for ITN. --47.146.63.87 (talk) 23:49, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    • This is a big deal independent of the pandemic and isn't "just another country's response" . It is a)an indefinite state of emergency b)voluntarily granted by the legislature c)in a western country with a track record (admittedly not the best; if this were the US we probably would have already posted it by now) of liberal democracy. Also, I do highly suspect that Orban's been planning this for a while and is using the pandemic as a reason, but it'd be nice to get a reliable source to that effect; if we do that's all the more justification to post this (EDIT: to show significance outside of the pandemic, not to right great wrongs on Orban's behavior). (In retrospect this is a bit harsh.) – John M Wolfson (talkcontribs) 21:29, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
      • That said, I do not agree with Rami's argument that we should disregard the banner and post stories better suited for it willy nilly per IAR. While we'd all agree that this would be blurb-worthy without the pandemic, my argument is that even with it it's still a significant episode of democratic backslide. – John M Wolfson (talkcontribs) 21:32, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support alt blurb; the "indefinite rule by decree" part is unusual and ITN-worthy independent of the coronavirus pandemic, but the article on Orban still needs cleanup. Titoxd(?!?) 21:38, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support alt blurb per above. Davey2116 (talk) 22:09, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support alt blurb. Hungary is not a banana republic. It is a member of the EU and it just became a de-facto dictatorship. This is a highly significant event. -Ad Orientem (talk) 00:00, 1 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose A parliament approves an indefinite state of emergency in response to a crisis of indefinite duration. I would support if it spices up and the EU imposes some sanction(s) against Hungary but it is a little underwhelming at the moment considering many other governments are exercising emergency powers. Hrodvarsson (talk) 01:46, 1 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    • The pandemic isn't particularly of an "indefinite duration"; most think that it'll largely be over by the summer and most states of emergency (at least in the US) end at that time. Even if it goes on longer the standard practice is to have a sunset clause that can be renewed if need be, something that the opposition in Hungary wanted but which was rejected by the government. – John M Wolfson (talkcontribs) 02:21, 1 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
      • It definitely is indefinite. (If you have knowledge of an exact date when the pandemic will subside, please tell me so I can make some bets on the market.) Hrodvarsson (talk) 01:36, 2 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose I am unsure why this article should be blurbed given the already-special attention given to COVID-19 in ITN. The notion that this is somehow out of the ordinary for these times is just not true. Germany has banned export of PPE, France has seized pharmaceuticals and banned them from export, every single EU state has imposed some sort of movement/expression/gathering prohibitions. All of these fly in the face of long-established (and once dearly defended) priciples of the EU, and could reasonable be characterized as "sliding to dictatorship". And they're all also covered in the COVID-19 ongoing special box.130.233.2.31 (talk) 05:39, 1 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    Enough with this false equivalency: France and Germany did not suspend parliament and cancel elections. No EU member has done this other than Hungary. Rami R 07:30, 1 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Strong Support Whenever a democracy suspends elections, no matter where they are, it is notable. This in particular is a brazen power grab that should be broadcasted to many people. Swordman97 talk to me 16:59, 1 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support Significant political development amid the COVID outbreak. Gotitbro (talk) 17:22, 1 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support per Rami and 331dot. ——SN54129 17:32, 1 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • I wanted to post this, but there's still sourcing issues on Orban's article. – Muboshgu (talk) 17:41, 1 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose on quality, sadly. I have been through Orbán article and added citation needed templates to all the claims that were unreferenced. We cannot post it unless those are fixed, especially because it is a BLP. Honestly, I don't think we can fix it before this going stale. ― Hebsen (talk) 22:18, 1 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment Orbans article has more orange banners than ever and bold or not we can't link to a BLP vio from the main page. --LaserLegs (talk) 22:30, 1 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment I would like to know which elections have actually been cancelled. The next scheduled elections are for 2022. The same for referendums. Even if the bolded article were better quality, we would still have to find some reason why this rises above the content in the already-very-prominent COVID-19 banner.130.233.3.161 (talk) 07:12, 2 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    • During the state emergency, by-elections and national and local referendums cannot take place, and deliberate bodies of a local governments and national minority self-governments cannot be dissolved (source). Unless I read the law wrong, elections to both the National Assembly and to the European Parliament will still take place. ― Hebsen (talk) 15:23, 3 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment: rm attention needed. While there does appear to be consensus in favor of posting, concerns about the target article remain. SpencerT•C 14:23, 3 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    Spencer, that's why I had put "needs attention" there, not "ready". It needs editor attention, not admin. – Muboshgu (talk) 15:27, 3 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    Ah I see, I've gone ahead and re-added it. I'm so used to seeing those tags be used to get an admin's attention. SpencerT•C 15:31, 3 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) The Parsonage Garden at Nuenen[edit]

Proposed image
Article: The Parsonage Garden at Nuenen (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: Vincent van Gogh's painting The Parsonage Garden at Nuenen (pictured) is stolen from the Singer Laren museum in the Netherlands. (Post)
Alternative blurb: The Parsonage Garden at Nuenen (pictured), a painting by Vincent van Gogh, is stolen in the Netherlands.
News source(s): (Artnet news), AP, BBC, Reuters, DW (Eng.)
Credits:

Both articles updated

 Mjroots (talk) 16:57, 30 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

  • Comment – Support in principle, but target article(s) need expansion, esp. The Parsonage Garden at Nuenen, which probably should be the primary target. – Sca (talk) 17:42, 30 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    • Yeah, expansion's going to be critical here, without that... --Masem (t) 17:52, 30 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Instead of Singer Laren, the emphasized article could be changed to Vincent van Gogh, which is a Featured Article. Then it probably would be post-worthy on quality. - Indefensible (talk) 23:10, 30 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    • Added an altblurb to this effect. Support nomination for posting. - Indefensible (talk) 23:13, 30 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
      • @Indefensible: - I've tweaked your altblurb to bold the painting article, which is in a reasonable shape and is the main reason for the blurb. Mjroots (talk) 06:16, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
        • Only one link is to be bolded, reverted. --qedk (t c) 09:29, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
          • In which case, I Oppose the alt blurb, as the painting is the story, not the artist. Mjroots (talk) 11:47, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
            • Switched the emphasis from the painter to the painting in the altblurb. This way also works fine in my opinion. - Indefensible (talk) 15:32, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
          • Can't multiple articles be emphasized? This was the case with recent entries, e.g. the Turing Award. - Indefensible (talk) 15:30, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
            • WP:ITN always uses the "an emboldened link" terminology. In rare cases, if the article of focus (which would be the Turing Award) is not at par with ITN standards, it can be relegated and better, related articles should be used as the bolded link on an WP:IAR basis. --qedk (t c) 18:58, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support original Article has been expanded, only the painting should be bolded. Brandmeistertalk 10:58, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support First Blurb per Brandmeister. Kenmelken (talk) 12:26, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • A few more cites needed, and support the original blurb once those are fixed. Per Masem and Brandmeister, it's the painting is the subject, not Vincent Van Gogh. It's debatable whether the theft should even be mentioned in the artist's article, and we don't generally choose the bolded article on the basis of whether it's an FA or not.  — Amakuru (talk) 14:06, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Question why is this notable? Seems like a non-violent petty theft of something a handful of people consider very important. If we could put a value on it, then it could be evaluated against something like the Dresden heist --LaserLegs (talk) 14:13, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support either. – Grabbing a multimillion-dollar painting is hardly "petty theft," and Van Gogh is a headline name. Good nuff to go. – Sca (talk) 14:26, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Weak support once the cn tags have been addressed. This is an obscure early Van Gogh, not a hugely influential work, so in normal times I would oppose. But we need to put something up on the template and this is the best nomination we've had for several days. Modest Genius talk 15:14, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • References have been added.  Posted — Martin (MSGJ · talk) 17:52, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Van Gogh: VW


  • Post-Posting Comment – I'm guarding my own rather obscure Van Gogh (left) – and my remaining rolls of TP – with my life. In the present crisis, both must be considered priceless. – Sca (talk) 22:21, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

(Closed) RD: Hau Pei-tsun[edit]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.


Article: Hau Pei-tsun (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.
 Ythlev (talk) 08:03, 30 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

March 29[edit]

Business and economy

Disasters and accidents

Health and environment

International relations

Politics and elections

(Posted) RD: Francis Rapp[edit]

Article: Francis Rapp (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): DNA.fr, Archyde
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: French historian, Knight of the Legion of Honour. Died from COVID-19. - Indefensible (talk) 20:17, 30 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Philip Warren Anderson[edit]

Article: Philip Warren Anderson (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Santa Fe Institute, Physics World
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: American physicist, Nobel laureate. - Indefensible (talk) 17:54, 30 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

  • non-COVID related (it appears) --Masem (t) 17:34, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support - Article is sourced and in depth. TJMSmith (talk) 19:44, 30 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Posted to RD Sourced, and unlike many scientist bios is well fleshed out about his contributions to his field. SpencerT•C 21:58, 30 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

(Stale) RD: Ken Shimura[edit]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.


Article: Ken Shimura (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Variety
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: Japanese comedian. COVID related. Article needs several sourcing fixes. Masem (t) 05:23, 30 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

(Posted) RD: Isaac Robinson[edit]

Article: Isaac Robinson (politician) (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Crain's Detroit, SFGate
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Suspected COVID-19 death DannyS712 (talk) 03:21, 30 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Article is short but well referenced DannyS712 (talk) 03:37, 30 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support - This article was recently expanded and is well sourced. TJMSmith (talk) 03:54, 30 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support - Seems to meet the requirements. - Indefensible (talk) 05:15, 30 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support good to go. The Rambling Man (Staying alive since 2005!) 08:12, 30 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose I refuse to believe that a member of the US government less than 50 years old does not have a certain date or location of birth. There's more information in his mother's BLP. And blind speculation about his death as well? The two most important facts in a person's life and our BLP cannot even manage those.130.233.2.84 (talk) 12:36, 30 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose Rm ready; insufficient depth of coverage. In terms of his political career, article is a resume in prose format. There is only 1 sentence describing what he did as a politician, and that is related to coronavirus legislation. SpencerT•C 15:32, 30 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment I just got the feeling that, with no disrespect, he was just a "meh" minor politician who warranted an article purely based on arbitrary notability criteria and who really hadn't done anything politically notable in his career. Maybe that was an oversight. The Rambling Man (Staying alive since 2005!) 15:39, 30 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment I checked Newspapers.com and Google for DoB and didn't find anything. Maybe someone else will have more luck but I am not sure it was ever published. Kees08 (Talk) 16:43, 30 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose - Although I know that any person with an individual article is technically eligible for RD, the article reads like an obituary. Reliable source coverage will be needed to confirm this individual's notability pre-obit.--WaltCip (talk) 17:01, 30 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Added a source. Seems to have decent coverage now. - Indefensible (talk) 17:22, 30 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment There doesn't appear to be a single source actually about him apart from the news reports on his death (and all the others are local news sources). That doesn't exactly yell "notable" at me. Black Kite (talk) 17:31, 30 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose Members of state legislators are not notable enough, especially ones that haven't even served a complete term. It is not known if he died due to coronavirus and even if so that would still not make him notable enough for a recent death mention. - Jon698 (talk) 12:06, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    Jon698, all U.S. state legislators are notable through WP:NPOL, and all notable individuals qualify for RD if the article is up to par. – Muboshgu (talk) 18:25, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • You can't just give out recent death notices to every random state legislator that dies. He had an unremarkable tenure of less than one term. - Jon698 (talk) 19:55, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    Jon698, why not? Our policy is that anyone notable can be posted at RD if their article is good enough quality. – Muboshgu (talk) 20:15, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • This article isn't high quality enough. His unremarkable tenure has lead to there not being anything to add to his page besides minor personal life details and some bills that he created during his short tenure. I am currently the main contributor to the article and I have spent hours looking for sources to expand this article and I found barely anything excluding the endless amounts of articles from two days ago at max restating the same information. - Jon698 (talk) 20:18, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose Article has large gaps in coverage which makes it ineligible for quality reasons for the main page. --Jayron32 18:23, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    Are you able to prove a negative? This individual apparently meets WP:N but yet his career (with all due respect etc etc) appears to be completely unremarkable. If you can find bits that are missing from the coverage, could you point to them? The Rambling Man (Staying alive since 2005!) 19:13, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support Not quite sure why this article is attracting such spurious opposition; it is not a stub and it is sourced, so it meets RD standards.-- P-K3 (talk) 19:41, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support per above. As Muboshgu said, the policy is that all state legislators meet GNG. I agree with this policy, and editors who disagree should take it up at the appropriate place. There's not much that can be said about one year as a first-term legislator that isn't already in the article. What's there is of good quality and is thus ready for RD. Davey2116 (talk) 20:11, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Perhaps we need to look at WP:NPOL again when we can have an article like this which is pretty close to failing WP:GNG (his death would come under WP:BIO1E). But yeah, I guess it should be posted. Black Kite (talk) 20:20, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Posted Article is sufficient. – Muboshgu (talk) 20:25, 31 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment - I think it's time to make a change to our RD policy here at ITN. This is a flaw. We posted something that shouldn't have been posted.--WaltCip (talk) 16:49, 1 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Robert H. Garff[edit]

Article: Robert H. Garff (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): KUTV
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: 2020 coronavirus pandemic in Utah TJMSmith (talk) 02:24, 30 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Joe Diffie[edit]

Article: Joe Diffie (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): USA Today
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

 -Thechased (talk) 20:10, 29 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Alan Merrill[edit]

Article: Alan Merrill (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): BestClassicBands, RockMyWorld
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: American musician. Article has a couple cn tags currently but otherwise should be good, will try to ref or remove as needed. - Indefensible (talk) 19:35, 29 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Krzysztof Penderecki[edit]

Article: Krzysztof Penderecki (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): NYTimes, Guardian, Reuters, DW (Eng.)
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Polish composer and conductor, works have appeared in many modern films such as the Shining and Exorcist. I spotted one CN tag but otherwise well sourced. Masem (t) 15:06, 29 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

  • Non-COVID related death --Masem (t) 20:51, 29 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support - Already a class B/C article. sentausa (talk) 15:27, 29 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment Could use a citation for the paragraph He was an Honorary Member of and for some in the awards list. RD is a little backed up right now so maybe post tomorrow after improvements? Otherwise we can drop Michael Sorkin off the list but I just added it a few minutes ago. Kees08 (Talk) 16:27, 29 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose needs refs. The Rambling Man (Staying alive since 2005!) 16:28, 29 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support Blurb on Principle oppose on quality. He was one of the greatest living composers of classical music at his death. Here is Reuters calling him "one of the world's most celebrated composers;" and this is the Hamburg Philharmonic calling him "one of the greatest living composers of classical music." Similar claims are being made on his obits today. NorthernFalcon (talk) 19:02, 29 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose for now on quality as NorthernFalcon wrote above; Oppose blurb. This is the issue that highly described subjects have; the more content there is, the more there is to maintain at the same quality level and therefore the more potential tripwires there are. - Indefensible (talk) 19:27, 29 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    What I see now: the awards are almost completely referenced (5 or so missing, which could probably be dropped). The use in films is not referenced yet, but all these films have articles, so it shouldn't be too difficult, and I believe whether his music was used in films or not really doesn't make him any greater. The section about the St Luke Passion is little referenced, but it has its own article and doesn't need detailed treatment in the composer's article. What else? - Btw, once upon a time the article had a decent infobox ;) - We faced the same sourcing problems for Jessye Norman, remember? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 20:09, 29 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    Support - Looks good enough now even with a couple cn tags per updated referencing as Gerda Arendt wrote. - Indefensible (talk) 21:15, 29 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose for now. Some work needed to get it up to speed, but should be easy enough to fix before posting. RD ONLY, OPPOSE BLURB. Not a big enough individual to warrant a blurb. (and why the continued obsession to mention IBs? why, oh why, oh why...) - SchroCat (talk) 20:26, 29 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Throwing my Oppose blurb as nominator. I don't believe he rises to that level based on the NYTimes article. --Masem (t) 20:47, 29 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support – RD only. Not widely known enough in Eng.-speaking world for blurb. – Sca (talk) 21:52, 29 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support RD Referencing has improved. Spengouli (talk) 22:02, 29 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support referencing has improved and will improve some more. Very significant composer. Krzysztof Eugeniusz Penderecki (Polish: [ˈkʂɨʂtɔf pɛndɛˈrɛt͡skʲi]; 23 November 1933 – 29 March 2020) was a Polish composer and conductor. Among his best known works are Threnody to the Victims of Hiroshima, Symphony No. 3, his St. Luke Passion, Polish Requiem, Anaklasis and Utrenja. Penderecki composed four operas, eight symphonies and other orchestral pieces, a variety of instrumental concertos, choral settings of mainly religious texts, as well as chamber and instrumental works. Levenson, Eric (March 29, 2020). "Krzysztof Penderecki, composer of works in 'The Exorcist' and 'The Shining,' dies at 86". CNN. 7&6=thirteen () 01:44, 30 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support Well referenced. The "Use in film" section would benefit from more citations, but it is uncontroversial content. Hrodvarsson (talk) 02:09, 30 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support Looks like the cn tags were addressed. Great work. TJMSmith (talk) 02:53, 30 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • This one is Ready to go, I think. Hopefully will be posted soon. - Indefensible (talk) 05:32, 30 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  •  Posted --qedk (t c) 07:32, 30 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

March 28[edit]

Armed conflicts and attacks

Business and economy

Health and environment
International relations

Politics and elections

(Posted) RD: David Schramm[edit]

Article: David Schramm (actor) (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Deadline Hollywood
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Best known for role on the TV show Wings but also a theater actor. No cause of death given. Article in surprising decent shape. Masem (t) 23:41, 29 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Jan Howard[edit]

Article: Jan Howard (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Tennessean
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: American musician and author. - Indefensible (talk) 04:06, 29 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Thomas Schäfer[edit]

Proposed image
Article: Thomas Schäfer (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): DW (German)
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: German politician, Minister of Finance for Hesse - Indefensible (talk) 00:22, 29 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

  • Support - New article but looks like the content is sourced. TJMSmith (talk) 04:13, 29 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose - It was sickening to work on, and I'd prefer to not see it in the news. I just tried to make the article decent. Thank you for more, Williamsdoritos. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 05:37, 29 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support - Per improvements made. RD ready.BabbaQ (talk) 08:57, 29 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support getting English-language coverage and article is satis. The Rambling Man (Staying alive since 2005!) 09:00, 29 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    I just try to imagine I was his daughter ... - also: he gets all the press coverage anyway, but how about Huisgen (below)? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 09:41, 29 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  •  Posted — Martin (MSGJ · talk) 09:49, 29 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    sigh, after three days of dealing with four recent deaths, I wanted to write about a soprano today, on Sunday. Instead, more work to make this halfway decent. What do we know yet?? - Read Jessye Norman today, please. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 11:05, 29 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    sigh more, will you please help me watch the article? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 11:20, 29 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    sigh even more: Krzysztof Penderecki --Gerda Arendt (talk) 11:24, 29 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Tom Coburn[edit]

Article: Tom Coburn (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Sputnik
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: He was indeed a public figure that has been revered by many Americans. RekishiEJ (talk) 15:51, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

  • Oppose much unreferenced. The Rambling Man (Staying alive since 2005!) 16:07, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    • The article does contain unsourced statements, yet it is not the reason why Tom Coburn should not be mentioned in "Recent deaths" section.--RekishiEJ (talk) 16:54, 28 March 2020 (UTC) Replaced the first "not" with "contain" 17:06, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
      • Oppose on the contrary- it is a valid reason why he should be omitted, and the sole matter of concern in a RD nom. GreatCaesarsGhost 19:27, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Significance is not an issue, but does not meet quality requirements yet, per The Rambling Man's comment. - Indefensible (talk) 17:08, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support pbp 18:05, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment – Since when is 'Sputnik' considered a reliable source? – Sca (talk) 22:01, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose The article is missing citations in several locations. TJMSmith (talk) 03:02, 30 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support The missing citations have been resolved. Spengouli (talk) 18:35, 30 March 2020 (UTC)([reply]
  • Posted in spite of the MOS:LEADCITE problem the sourcing has introduced. – Muboshgu (talk) 18:42, 30 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support - Looks good now per above. Added updaters. - Indefensible (talk) 18:45, 30 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

(Stale) RD: Azam Khan (squash player)[edit]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.


Article: Azam Khan (squash player) (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Geo News
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: He won the British Open four times between 1959 and 1962. RekishiEJ (talk) 16:30, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose one unreferenced "Family" section and one section of "quotes about the subject", not good enough. The Rambling Man (Staying alive since 2005!) 16:32, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    • The celebrity's importance should be the only judgment whether he should be included in the "Recent deaths" section.--RekishiEJ (talk) 17:06, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose Article is missing citations and a Career section. TJMSmith (talk) 03:04, 30 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

March 27[edit]

Arts and culture

Business and economy

Disasters and accidents

Health and environment

International relations

Sports

(Posted) RD: Robert Campbell[edit]

Article: Robert Campbell (California politician) (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): East Bay Times
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: American politician - Indefensible (talk) 04:14, 29 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Joseph Lowery[edit]

Article: Joseph Lowery (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): CNN
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Civil rights leader – Muboshgu (talk) 17:14, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Daniel Azulay[edit]

Article: Daniel Azulay (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): band.com.br (Portuguese), Globo.com (Portuguese)
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Brazilian artist. - Indefensible (talk) 16:37, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Les Hunter[edit]

Article: Les Hunter (basketball) (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): ESPN
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: American professional athlete, restaurant owner, and community college teacher. - Indefensible (talk) 06:02, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) North Macedonia joins NATO[edit]

Article: North Macedonia–NATO relations (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: North Macedonia joins NATO after a year-long negotiations process. (Post)
News source(s): DW
Credits:

Nominator's comments: First enlargement of NATO for years. A bit of non-COVID news for a change. EternalNomad (talk) 21:41, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

  • Support Article looks in good shape --Masem (t) 21:45, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support although I would just call it NATO and not expand, the common name is NATO and I'm certain the majority of our "overseas" readers would understand that and not the expanded variant. The Rambling Man (Staying alive since 2005!) 21:46, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
This. NATO, NASA, EU, UK, US, are the abbreviations I'd expect any English reader should be familiar with (though linking will always help). --Masem (t) 21:49, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support, have abbreviated NATO in the blurb. – John M Wolfson (talkcontribs) 22:29, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support as per The Rambling Man Joseywales1961 (talk) 22:35, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support Looks fine, decent news story. Kingsif (talk) 22:43, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Can someone add a ref for the first part of the History section? Would think should be easy enough to find for the 1995 and 1999 items mentioned. - Indefensible (talk) 22:53, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support article looks good to go for posting. important news.BabbaQ (talk) 23:06, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support, I have NOTHING against Slovak Prime Minister Mr. Igor, but his face has been here for long, can't we replace it?. If not, no problem. ^_^ --CoryGlee (talk) 23:18, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support Just a comment on the blurb, I'm not sure when we are counting the negotiation process as starting, if we say it started in July 2018 with the invitation or back in 2008 and earlier, then maybe the blurb should say "multi-year negotiation process."-- Patrick, oѺ 23:42, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Posted -Ad Orientem (talk) 23:46, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • @Amakuru: I think I will change the image to File:History of NATO enlargement.svg as it seems more relevant (includes North Macedonia in 2020), does anyone have a problem? --qedk (t c) 09:26, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
@QEDK: Generally, purely decorative elements like flags or logos are not posted. --LaserLegs (talk) 09:59, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Fine by me to change it. A map also showing North America would be better IMHO, as it is misleading to focus only on Europe, but I don't have strong opinions either way.  — Amakuru (talk) 10:10, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
This is one of those cases where if we were tired of looking at that politician we should drag up and image from RD. The Macedonian flag doesn't offer any value for our readers, and a highlighted map of NATO wouldn't do great condensed into the box. --LaserLegs (talk) 10:16, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
The guidelines you linked above also suggest no maps, as they are hard to discern at small size. Stephen 11:15, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
@Stephen, Amakuru, and LaserLegs: I don't see any options which are not maps (treaty parties, enlargement, NATO members) or flags (NATO/North Macedonia), all listed in order of decreasing relevance. Both flags and the enlargement map are protected and good-to-go. --qedk (t c) 15:32, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
So then put Matovic back or get a suitable image from RD. --LaserLegs (talk) 16:12, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

The flag does seem inappropriate. It conveys no real visual information. (Also, my first association was the WWII Japanese war flag.)
Sca (talk) 17:12, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Would it not be appropriate to use the NATO flag or map of member states (with North Macedonia now included)? The image is now back to Mr. Matovič, but his news item was a week ago already and the nomination is not even on the page anymore. - Indefensible (talk) 04:39, 29 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
I don't think File:History of NATO enlargement.svg works in a small size. If there is clear map of NATO members (without all the different colours which will be hard to interpret without the key) that would be good. Otherwise I have added Joseph Lowery to the protected list. — Martin (MSGJ · talk) 10:28, 29 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
A NATO map without Canada and the United States is not a NATO map. --LaserLegs (talk) 11:18, 29 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Any comments on this one? — Martin (MSGJ · talk) 12:21, 29 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

(Not sure what country that is in South America? — Martin (MSGJ · talk) 12:28, 29 March 2020 (UTC))[reply]
French Guiana --LaserLegs (talk) 12:30, 29 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Added two maps to WP:CMP the one linked above with all countries, which has weird lines (I'm guessing it links it to the mainland, but it just looks bad). The other one is the North Macedonia highlighted among NATO countries (leaves out French Guiana but looks better imo) which I've placed right below it. --qedk (t c) 13:01, 29 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks qedk. I have added the green map. Improvements to the caption welcomed though — Martin (MSGJ · talk) 20:05, 29 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Bob Andy[edit]

Article: Bob Andy (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Loop Jamaica
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Jamaican musician, Order of Distinction member. - Indefensible (talk) 16:16, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

(Closed) Boris Johnson has tested positive for coronavirus[edit]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.


Articles: Boris Johnson (talk · history · tag) and Coronavirus disease 2019 (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: Boris Johnson has tested positive for coronavirus (Post)
News source(s): BBC
Credits:

Both articles need updating
Nominator's comments: While the coronavirus story is an ongoing event, this incident stands out as it involves a prominent head of state who is involved in mitigating the outbreak, which involves taking many measures that should prevent getting infected with this disease. Count Iblis (talk) 11:29, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose It is somewhat more anecdotal as he is not in a serious condition and will continue working. He is not the only head of government infected and surely there will be more. Alsoriano97 (talk) 11:38, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • I knew this would end up on ITN/C. Oppose at the moment. Tom Hanks also got COVID-19 but recovered from it. At the moment, this seems to be the rule rather than the exception. It would, of course, be notable if Boris Johnson became incapacitated from the virus.--WaltCip (talk) 11:48, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose. If a national leader dies from the disease that might be worth posting, merely catching it is not. Modest Genius talk 11:49, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose per WaltCip; nice idea though, an original nom. ——SN54129 11:50, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose per WP:SNOW. Is this some kind of a joke? If the disease forces him to resign, then we're going to post his resignation; if it leads to complications and he dies, then we're going to post his death. But the diagnosis with no follow-up or, at least, indication of a long-lasting impact per se is not notable at all.--Kiril Simeonovski (talk) 12:12, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Cripes! Crikey! Lugnuts Fire Walk with Me 12:18, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Weak Support We can't blurb every COVID-19 update but this one seems a bit noteworthy. --LaserLegs (talk) 12:19, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
How come? Because it's a head of state?--WaltCip (talk) 12:23, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Yep, head of a G7 and NATO state specifically. I'm not gonna die on this hill, the update is literally one sentence, but still interesting. --LaserLegs (talk) 12:46, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment Currently the top blurb in ITN is another PM – Igor Matovič – who is stale news from about 3 weeks ago and attracting very little interest from our readership -- just 10K views yesterday. Boris does better than that on a quiet day and I expect his article will be 1M+ on this news. If ITN keeps running the same stale blurbs then it is irrelevant and not helping anyone. Andrew🐉(talk) 12:37, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    No one has yet stopped you from improving OTHER Wikipedia articles on current events and nominating them, are you? Wikipedia is a volunteer organization that only works because people who care about something fix it all by themselves. Since you want to see new topics in ITN, you are responsible for making that happen. Browbeating other people to do that work for you is a waste of your time. --Jayron32 12:57, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    I'm afraid this isn't WP:TOP25. If you'd like to replace WP:ITN with WP:TOP25, please raise an RFC to propose such. In the meantime, please do stop complaining about page views, this is an encyclopedia, not a tabloid newspaper. The Rambling Man (Staying alive since 2005!) 13:18, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose currently precisely zero impact. The Rambling Man (Staying alive since 2005!) 13:22, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

March 26[edit]

Armed conflicts and attacks

Health and environment

International relations

Law and crime

Science and technology

Sports

(Posted) RD: Princess Maria Teresa of Bourbon-Parma[edit]

Article: Princess Maria Teresa of Bourbon-Parma (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): People
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: First royal to die from COVID-19, needs a bunch of work, she was quite notably outspoken but until recently her name redirected to her father's article. Kingsif (talk) 18:32, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

  • Oppose - Article is currently a stub that has a speedy deletion banner. - Indefensible (talk) 19:01, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose tagged stub. The Rambling Man (Staying alive since 2005!) 19:16, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment updated with translations from the French sister project. robertsky (talk) 21:09, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    • Article still could use work and may not meet the threshold of RD guidelines, but good work updating the article. - Indefensible (talk) 21:20, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment – Stubby. (And "whilst" – ??)Sca (talk) 21:57, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support - Article is much improved. TJMSmith (talk) 22:50, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support - Good enough for RD now.BabbaQ (talk) 23:10, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support - Marked as ready per above. Moved from the 28th to the 26th, as that is the correct date. - Indefensible (talk) 00:17, 29 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support - ready to post MurielMary (talk) 05:06, 29 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Posting. --Tone 10:14, 29 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Michael Sorkin[edit]

Article: Michael Sorkin (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Quito, Anne (March 28, 2020). "Michael Sorkin, architecture's brilliant sage, has died of complications from Covid-19". Quartz – via Yahoo!.Gibson, Eleanor (27 March 2020). "'Fierce and brilliant' architect and critic Michael Sorkin dies of coronavirus". Dezeen.
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Important architect, urban planner. 7&6=thirteen () 18:47, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

  • Has a couple cn tags which should be addressed, in particular the orange banner should be resolved. Looks good otherwise. - Indefensible (talk) 19:07, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
 Fixed 7&6=thirteen () 19:46, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Support per above fixes. - Indefensible (talk) 21:24, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
I know your default position, but article has now been referenced. User:The Rambling Man what is it you think is presently lacking? 7&6=thirteen () 11:22, 29 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
What's happening about the dubiously "useful" "Reporting, selected" section? Most of it is unrerferenced, and I'm not convinced I can see any value in this, do we normally list a "selected" (by whom, what criteria? One suspects, just whatever someone kind find...) list of mentions of someone? The Rambling Man (Staying alive since 2005!) 11:36, 29 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
User:The Rambling Man Per your suggestion, I removed the section. 7&6=thirteen () 12:16, 29 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Support looks fine. The Rambling Man (Staying alive since 2005!) 12:28, 29 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Posted though technically stale, due to four from the 27th and four from the 28th. Kees08 (Talk) 16:19, 29 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Rolf Huisgen[edit]

Article: Rolf Huisgen (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): chemistryviews.org
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Chemist with a reaction named after him, 99. - Expanded stub. Gerda Arendt (talk) 16:44, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

  • Support - Meets the requirements, good work updating the article Gerda Arendt. - Indefensible (talk) 16:50, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  •  Posted — Martin (MSGJ · talk) 10:23, 29 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Balázs Csákabonyi[edit]

Article: Balázs Csákabonyi (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): kaposvarmost.hu (Hungarian)
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Hungarian lawyer/politician, High Commissioner of the Hungarian Bar Association. - Indefensible (talk) 16:24, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Naomi Munakata[edit]

Article: Naomi Munakata (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Folha pt
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Great woman, chorale conductor. VOVID-19 (my first) - The article was created in en and other languages the day she died. I could add recordings on demand, if needed. (See AllMusic link.) - I wonder if victims of the virus might appear within the box, if only to have some change there from time to time. Gerda Arendt (talk) 10:42, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Support per nom. Short, but with statements supported with references. robertsky (talk) 15:24, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • support: short but sufficient.BabbaQ (talk) 15:28, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support - seems to meet minimum requirements for RD posting. - Indefensible (talk) 16:14, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
 Posted. El_C 18:49, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

(Stale) RD: Jimmy Wynn[edit]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.


Article: Jimmy Wynn (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): ESPN, Houston Chronicle
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: Former professional baseball player. Three time MLB All Star, member of the Houston Astros Hall of Fame, jersey number retired by the Astros. Thrashbandicoot01 (talk) 21:41, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

(Posted) RD: John O'Leary (golfer)[edit]

Article: John O'Leary (golfer) (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): European Tour
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Some sourcing still needed in places DannyS712 (talk) 06:03, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Now reasonably sourced DannyS712 (talk) 06:32, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support as per nominator. short but decent article Joseywales1961 (talk) 10:02, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Weak support one citation missing as far as I can tell. The Rambling Man (Staying alive since 2005!) 13:23, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose for now - lead needs to be a bit longer, and the lead says he played in the 1975 Ryder Cup while the body says he missed it.  — Amakuru (talk) 13:33, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    @Amakuru: Can you take another look? DannyS712 (talk) 00:15, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    @DannyS712: it's already been posted anyway, but for the record it's all good now. Nice work.  — Amakuru (talk) 07:48, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support - Article seems to meet the requirements, the 1975 Ryder Cup detail per Amakuru's comment above seems to be consistent now. - Indefensible (talk) 15:10, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support - It is RD ready.BabbaQ (talk) 23:19, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  •  Posted --qedk (t c) 07:31, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    @QEDK: Would you mind posting the credit bit on my talk, so that I can claim this for the wikicup (unless not doing so was intentional)? DannyS712 (talk) 13:22, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    @DannyS712: New to the posting side of ITN. Sent! --qedk (t c) 13:31, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Curly Neal[edit]

Article: Curly Neal (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Deadline Hollywood
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Short but should be reasonably sourced. Masem (t) 01:10, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

(Stale) RD: Michel Hidalgo[edit]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.


Article: Michel Hidalgo (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): BBC Sport
Credits:
Article needs updating
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: French Football Manager won the Euro 1984. Pharaoh of the Wizards (talk) 18:48, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose there is only one reference in the article (which doesn't even mention his death) updated since I added oppose Joseywales1961 (talk) 19:27, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

(Stale) RD: Mark Blum[edit]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.


Article: Mark Blum (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Variety
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: COVID-related death. Article needs major improvements before posting. Masem (t) 18:02, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

(Closed) Nicolás Maduro indicted for drug trafficking[edit]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.


Article: Nicolás Maduro (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ Venezuelan President Nicolás Maduro and numerous high ranking officials are indicted by the United States Government on drug trafficking and related charges. (Post)
Alternative blurb: Nicolás Maduro and Venezuelan numerous high ranking officials are indicted by the United States Government on drug trafficking and related charges.
News source(s): NY Times, Guardian
Credits:

Article updated
Nominator's comments: Highly controversial head of state indicted for narco terrorism along with a bunch of other higher ups is highly unusual. Ad Orientem (talk) 16:31, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment. I think there is merit to posting this, but it is debatable as to if Maduro is the legitimate President or not, so I would suggest leaving his title out. 331dot (talk) 16:36, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
I agree with regard to his legitimacy, but most of the RS sources are referring to him as president so that's what I went with. -Ad Orientem (talk) 16:41, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Fair enough. Thanks 331dot (talk) 17:02, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
RS's call Maduro president when they want to throw shade, and call Guaidó president when they want to de-legitimize Maduro. --LaserLegs (talk) 17:27, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Please bear in mind WP:FORUM. --Jamez42 (talk) 17:30, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Sure, but it's relevant in this discussion given that for the last year RS has been calling Guaidó the legitimate preisdent of Venezuela and have suddenly changed their tune for this narrow case. --LaserLegs (talk) 17:58, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support on the basis that RSes are generally recognizing his legitimacy as president, that the indictments against a sitting world leader are a major news factor. Article seems fine, but it would be nice if in the blurb if there was any specific of the cases that we could link to - I can't tell immediately, for example, if this is related to Operation Car Wash or other similar things, just to provide better context. --Masem (t) 16:50, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • LMFAO (oppose). The absurdity of the rightists MDS notwithstanding, the target has a one-liner update, Maduro won't be extradited or tried in the United States, and we have a long standing (albeit a bit silly) policy on not posting indictments. It does bar him from attending the UN though. --LaserLegs (talk) 17:25, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support on grounds of notability and unusualness, which isn't the typical politician indictment for corruption. If it helps, I would like to note that the indictment refers to Maduro as "Former President". I have added an altblurb without a position to avoid disputes regarding his legitimacy. If I may, I would also like to support adding a related image in the Main Page. --Jamez42 (talk) 17:29, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Weak Oppose - What's the long-term impact of this event? Because maybe I'm just not seeing it. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Nice4What (talkcontribs)
  • Oppose-On the grounds that this is only of political relevance, represents an American viewpoint and Wikipedia should not engage in furthering political smears as it damages our image of neutrality. --Willthewanderer (talk) 18:27, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
These charges are being widely reported in RS sources. We don't refuse to post news because we don't like it. Your use of the word "smears " also suggests a certain bias. -Ad Orientem (talk) 19:11, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Willthewanderer As noted above, "Please do not oppose an item because the event is only relating to a single country, or failing to relate to one. This applies to a high percentage of the content we post and is unproductive." 331dot (talk) 19:44, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
If we are to accept national bias then I must object to the entire concept, we are not a news site and it shouldn't be up to us to dictate what is and isn't news- This is an encyclopedia. We leave ourselves wide open to accusations of national bias. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Willthewanderer (talkcontribs) 21:49, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose Maduro is never going to be put on trial in the United States, and we don't post indictments that are only for show. Even if Maduro is arrested, brought to America, and put on trial at some point in the future, then the circumstances that led to that (his removal from office) are what should be posted here, not this indictment. NorthernFalcon (talk) 19:20, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose - A pretty sad attempt at political histrionics to distract from COVID-19.--WaltCip (talk) 19:22, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose per WaltCip. It seems like a purely political ploy with no impact on reality for anyone in any way. – Muboshgu (talk) 19:40, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Question. How many nations have indictments against heads of state of other nations, even for 'political' reasons? 331dot (talk) 19:42, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
I seem to recall that one or two countries had charged George W. Bush with war crimes.--WaltCip (talk) 19:45, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
So it's a pretty rare thing, regardless of the reason? I mean, the US has not indicted Vladimir Putin for election interference. 331dot (talk) 19:48, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Surely there's a reason for that.... – Muboshgu (talk) 19:50, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Manuel Noriega was indicted in the US -- and then the US invaded and abducted him. I'd support posting that if they did it to Venezuela --LaserLegs (talk) 19:49, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
That would be incredibly newsworthy, likely for all the wrong reasons.--WaltCip (talk) 19:50, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose per above. Little chance of it being enacted, and not of lasting significance.  — Amakuru (talk) 19:54, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose for now, wait to see if anything concrete happens. This is clearly politically motivated, and we wouldn't post a drug dealer being charged if he wasn't the president of a country. The US has no way of arresting Maduro. If this turns into a major diplomatic incident then maybe it could be postable, but more likely everyone shrugs and nothing happens. Maduro's article is a POV nightmare and has just one sentence of update, with no more information than the blurb. Modest Genius talk 19:55, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose we might post sentencings or convictions but certainly not indictments. Banedon (talk) 21:20, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose per Modest Genius and WaltCip. Jusdafax (talk) 21:26, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose If we posted every time the US announced Maduro was guilty of something, the box would never be empty of one. If something happens, please post. (I have made an update to his article) Kingsif (talk) 22:41, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

(Closed) Guilty plea in Christchurch mosque shootings[edit]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.


Article: Christchurch mosque shootings (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ Brenton Tarrant pleads guilty to 51 counts of murder, 40 counts of attempted murder, and one count of terrorism in the Christchurch mosque shootings. (Post)
Alternative blurb: ​ The trial for the Christchurch mosque shootings results in conviction of the accused.
News source(s): CNN, AP, BBC, Guardian
Credits:

Article updated
Nominator's comments: This is equivalent to the point of conviction otherwise. the next step is the sentencing but which can't happen due to COVID-19, but we'd not post that. Masem (t) 05:55, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose although it is mildly surprising he changed his plea, it was 100% inevitable that he would be found guilty having filmed himself killing all these people. The initial posting of this crime is sufficient. The Rambling Man (Staying alive since 2005!) 08:22, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Calgary's deadliest massacre seemed 100% inevitable to be Calgary's largest murder when first news broke, too, but nope. InedibleHulk (talk) 10:39, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose per reasons above. Admittedly surprised the entire trial took over a year. Juxlos (talk) 09:08, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
The long and winding trial hadn't begun yet and won't now. That's why pleading guilty is noteworthy. Maybe blurbworthy. InedibleHulk (talk) 10:21, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support Effectively cancels the most high-profile trial in New Zealand and alt-right history, but without using the coronavirus defense. InedibleHulk (talk) 10:29, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support posting the resolution of this case(essentially a conviction). 331dot (talk) 10:31, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose – Per TRM. The ramifications of this plea were effectively a foregone conclusion a year ago. – Sca (talk) 13:36, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
A year ago, most figured we'd see a guy and his legal team try to justify this for a week or so. There were publication bans and controversial testimony in the works, the whole damn circus was coming to town. But that just changed forever today. InedibleHulk (talk) 13:59, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support Article is high quality, has a high quality update, and news sources are covering the story. Checks all of the boxes. --Jayron32 14:42, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support Well it's a turnout. And such a notable case, separate to the crime, that the surprise result is some news. Kingsif (talk) 15:09, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment – Dropping my opposition in deference to foregoing. However, the article's updates re plea are quite thin. More RS-documentation would be advisable. (Three offered above.) – Sca (talk)
  • Support per Jayron32. -Ad Orientem (talk) 16:57, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support article is pretty good, item is in the news. --LaserLegs (talk) 17:30, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose per TRM. There was never any doubt who did it, we posted the original story, this isn't really startling news in itself.  — Amakuru (talk) 18:32, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment - Suggest removing the suspect's name, replacing the appropriate section of the blurb with just "a suspect pleads guilty".--WaltCip (talk) 19:23, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    • There is zero point at this time to hide the name now that they have confessed. I could understand that if this was a trial just starting (which we would not be posting) we'd probably be careful, but the issue around naming the culprit that existed in the weeks after the event no longer exist here. --Masem (t) 19:34, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose in addition to the above, per NZ prime minister Jacinda Ardern, it's preferable not to speak this person's name or give him any publicity. Banedon (talk) 21:22, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    • Unlike past cases where the gov't courts or the like have had orders to keep the name private, PM Ardern's request is only a personal one and certainly one that RSes across the board are not following. --Masem (t) 21:53, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    • Without prejudice to the other arguments against this and not taking a position myself, this seems a bit like righting great wrongs given that the suspect's name is already publicly available and has been for a while. – John M Wolfson (talkcontribs) 04:18, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Added altblurb. The fact that he reversed and pleaded guilty is not the important part, the conviction is the noteworthy event per preceding nominations. Altblurb is more concise and anonymizes the name. - Indefensible (talk) 23:38, 26 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    • No, that's far too simplification of the news. As pointed out above, the suspect had been claiming not innocent, and there was a big gearing up for a major trial on this. Then suddenly he pleads guilty, out of nowhere. That's the story. Yes, on that, he's convicted, and sentencing will come later, but it's not simply a conviction as the altblurb suggestions. --Masem (t) 02:18, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
      • Not sure that is significant. From a distant observer's perspective, there was a crime, a guilty plea, and a conviction. Those are the key events thus far, and the ones that matter legally. That there was an expectation of a major trial and an unexpected guilty plea seems like trivia, it is ultimately unimportant to the resolution of the case. Since Wikipedia is an encyclopedia and WP:NOTNEWS, it does not seem like the drama should be the noteworthy aspect for expounding on. - Indefensible (talk) 03:41, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
        • And that's the problem to take "from the distant observers perspective". All court cases could be summarized "A criminal is convicted" which... yeah, is a massive understatement. The point is that the article on the shootings does explain that there was preparation for this trial to be a media circus and then for reasons we don't know, it suddenly didn't happen. We have to be a bit more aware of details to phrase it to draw interest on the main page, distant to be impartial but no so distant to be ignorant. --Masem (t) 03:56, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
          • There should be no penalty for being a distant, disinterested perspective, if anything it should be emphasized. 1) Most topics will be such for an editor because one cannot be everywhere, 2) an encyclopedia should be as objective as possible, and 3) being too close to the subject increases the chance of WP:COI. It is not true that all cases could be summarized as that, a case could result in acquittal and providing the outcome of conviction or acquittal is the key detail. That the article explains the details is exactly why it is okay to summarize concisely, because any reader can click the link to learn those things if they choose to. It is a slippery slope into click bait territory to try and make encyclopedic content overtly "interesting," and again Wikipedia is not primarily for news anyway. - Indefensible (talk) 15:30, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose altblurb 1, weak oppose overall Not only do I not agree with anonymizing the name as I said above, but a guilty plea is substantially different from a conviction, even if only for laypeople. As for this story overall, we posted the original shooting IIRC, and this seems more of a legalistic follow-up, although we have posted convictions on here before (but not generally sentencings or other post-trial legal stuff). – John M Wolfson (talkcontribs) 04:24, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    • Aside from preserving anonymity, the shooter is not notable enough to have his own article, thus my argument for not including him in the blurb.--WaltCip (talk) 11:49, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
He's notable enough, just that his notability is tied to events with a shared article, so a standalone bio would only be redundant to his article-sized biographical section. InedibleHulk (talk) 12:53, 28 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose: Per Amakuru. It's not like William Wallace pled guilty. It is just a mundane detail that ultimately changes nothing. It would be news if he walked free. Nobody that's not been watching this case closely, everyday since day one, is going to understand why this was posted on the main page. Best, Usedtobecool ☎️ 08:43, 27 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]