User talk:Martinevans123

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Peace is a state of balance and understanding in yourself and between others, where respect is gained by the acceptance of differences, tolerance persists, conflicts are resolved through dialogue, people's rights are respected and their voices are heard, and everyone is at their highest point of serenity without social tension.

Martin, As you archive so regularly (unlike some editors ...) I thought that this would
a) Brighten up your page, and
b) Add a serious tone amidst all the hilarity.
All the best to you and yours –
 – Gareth Griffith-Jones |The Welsh Buzzard| 11:08, 24 December 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you. A lovely picture. Martinevans123 (talk) 23:03, 26 December 2012 (UTC)[reply]
I have made a little seasonal update - hope you don't mind! Martinevans123 (talk) 09:02, 31 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Not at all. The snow has almost vanished.
A Christian feast commemorating the resurrection of Christ; the first Sunday following the full moon that occurs on or next after the vernal equinox, neither earlier than March 22 nor later than April 25.
I hate this BST ... why can't we stick with good old GMT? (... it follows the sun after all)
Gareth Griffith-Jones – The WelshBuzzard – 10:27, 31 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]
now, I ask you, what kind of alphabetical (or significance) order is that?!!
Yours, aye John Lemon
Have always loved that record. Good compilation of photographs ... who is the geezer in the middle — at 1 min 32 secs? –
 – Gareth Griffith-Jones |The Welsh Buzzard| 20:28, 31 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]
For some reason, he always reminded me of Nixon!
Oh! Of course. I knew that really –
 – Gareth Griffith-Jones |The Welsh Buzzard| 20:47, 31 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]
... my own personal permanent fixture tribute...
You turn your back for a just a second and some strange Swedish person sneaks in and steals your records!!

November music[edit]

November songs
story · music

Hevenu shalom aleichem is my story today. -- Gerda Arendt (talk) 21:42, 2 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Possibly missed by some today, for his most significant achievement. Martinevans123 (talk) 22:11, 3 November 2023 (UTC) 'Cause out on the edge of darkness[reply]
I am quite proud that the hook - not by me, but 4meter4 who wrote the serious part of the article - mentioned that achievement. I had reason to look at our conversations about The Rite of Spring today, - interesting ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 09:32, 4 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
A nice hook; he deserves to be remembered. We haven't seen User:Ruhrfisch around for a while. Martinevans123 (talk) 09:43, 4 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I added some images from Aachen, taken 21 Oct. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 22:06, 3 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks, Gerda. Some beautiful images! Martinevans123 (talk) 22:12, 3 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you, more to come, but article writing and reviewing first, and hopefully resisting the temptation to argue on a noticeboard ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 09:34, 4 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Now a few more from the trip. - My story today is about my song of defiance, - it was a great pleasure to hear it performed today! The line "Ich steh hier und singe" (I stand here and sing) is in the movement with the music pictured, which begins with "Trotz -- Trotz -- Trotz", sounding much tougher than "defiance" ;) - in this YouTube it's at 4:55. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 23:11, 4 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you, Gerda. A great rendition. Martinevans123 (talk) 13:49, 5 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I agree! - Want to help (refs, detail) with (Welsh) Ryland Davies? Same recording as my recent Isabelle Sals, you can plunder there ;) - I'll look at him tomorrow, just nominated today's. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 14:48, 6 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks, Gerda. Martinevans123 (talk) 20:26, 6 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
What should I think of this? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 13:33, 7 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Looks convincing. They certainly ought to know about him being "Professor of the “Alfredo Kraus” Fundación Ramón Areces Voice Chair at the Reina Sofía School of Music, where he had previously offered masterclasses." There's also this obituary which I have added as a source. Martinevans123 (talk) 14:07, 7 November 2023 (UTC) p.s. Blaenau Gwent was created only in 1974. In 1943 Cwm was still in Monmouthshire. [reply]
Can you perhaps add from it? And perhaps solve the riddle how he made his debut in Glyndebourne as Almaviva, when there's nothing of that in the Glyndebourne archives (that I just added), which see him in the chorus that year, and Rossini's work not once in his impressive singing there from 1965 to 2001? He needs more lead. I trust that we'll make him fit for the Main page, where I have Lea Ackermann right now, and a DYK and an OTD entry ;) - I couldn't avoid that notice board, first couldn't take misrepresentations any longer, secondly pinged. Such a waste of time. Whoever still "fight" infobox wars, missed some history. Bach and the Schumanns (on the Main page) all have an infobox, Clara even from 2012, - they really came to be the normal accepted thing to have. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 14:30, 7 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, that's a slight riddle. Perhaps we should add only material supported by more than one source? A image of Davies might be preferable to an infobox for such a short article, although we are unlikely to find one, I suspect. What is "the normal accepted thing to have" on Wikipedia is still a bit of a riddle for me, alas. Martinevans123 (talk) 15:17, 7 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
We have several sources for that Almaviva because they copy from each other (and from Wikipedia), but I'm tempted to drop it as not in sync with the rest of the bio, - unless that was something like a student performance, outside the festival. He'll have an infobox, really no problem for opera singers (did you know that the recommendation "better without" was officially removed from the guidelines in 2019?), and I bet Storye book will find at least a fair-use pic. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 15:52, 7 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I agree it could be dropped. And I did not know that! ... so box away, I guess. I do hope Storye book can find one. Martinevans123 (talk) 16:00, 7 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I will. - I looked again, and thanks for the parents, but the source given supports only his marriage. For ITN, everything must be sourced. I can't read the Times obit, - can you? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 15:38, 8 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
OK, I see that was a simple explanation, the writer of his obit was the same person (last year) as now his. Happy to have found his! So nice stories, such as the cognac for Caballé, - I hope readers will get to it. Do you think the Times obit (that I can't see) is the same as in The Guardian? Anyway, only recordings missing, then I'll nominate. I'm always reluctant when I have someone "on" who will be pushed out by the next. We have a few days left, 12 Nov would be last day. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 18:11, 8 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Glad you found it! No, I can no longer read The Times. User:AirshipJungleman29 tells me there is a clever trick one can do with archive versions, but I'm not sure how that's done... It seems both Barry Millington in The Grauniad and whoever it is in The Times have used the same 2003 photo of Davies as Monostatos as their lead image. I think the lower b/w image of Davies during a rehearsal at Leeds Town Hall in the 1970s, by Jeremy Fletcher/Redferns, is particularly good. Yes, it's somehat difficult to ever know how an RD entry will last at ITN! Martinevans123 (talk) 19:29, 8 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
The Guardian is fine, no need for anything else, - I just wondered. "somehat" is a lovely word! The shortest RD was 5 hours (not mine or I'd have protested), the longest I remember the recent Zdeněk Mácal, a full week. Lea Ackermann has two days now, and I wish her more ;) - She has attracted 10k+ readers yesterday! --Gerda Arendt (talk) 20:23, 8 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, I invented that one specially for the occasion. I'm so glad, Gerda, that someone round here knows the Queen's English. Martinevans123 (talk) 22:44, 8 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I'm so glad someone knows the language to expand the sad cy stub ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 22:51, 8 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, thanks to Deb, it's a start. My Welsh is much worse than my English. Martinevans123 (talk) 23:10, 8 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I admit I have to use the translation function to help me along. But I'm better than I used to be. Frankly, I couldn't converse in Welsh with any fluency if it hadn't been for cy helping me along. Why don't we see you there, Martin? Deb (talk) 08:50, 9 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Too busy checking hundreds of English edits for possible copyright violation, for my sins. Martinevans123 (talk) 10:55, 9 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
It's not work, it's just practice (makes perfect). --ARoseWolf 12:02, 9 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Your Day! A day to remember the victims of wars, and for me St. Martin's day, matched as short as I could in a 2010 DYK remembered, - so basically about sharing. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 11:08, 11 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I began another day of vacation pics, with the deepest blue of the sea ;) - we celebrate the birthday of a friend who wrote quite a book about the compositions of a man who will turn 300 soon. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 15:24, 14 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I knew very little about Carl Friedrich Abel. Thanks for the link. Here's Petr Wagner with an arpeggio for solo viola da gamba in 2008. Quite breathtaking playing. Martinevans123 (talk) 21:00, 14 November 2023 (UTC) [1] wonderful sound recording[reply]
Thank you! - Next day begun --Gerda Arendt (talk) 18:56, 16 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
... and completed - today my topic is a soprano, with yt. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 21:44, 17 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Congratulations (belatedly) Gerda, for Rachel Yakar, a great-looking article. Nice clip too, thankyou! Martinevans123 (talk) 22:11, 17 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you! If you like to watch, there are several more on yt from that film. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 23:36, 19 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
My story today, Canticle I: My beloved is mine and I am his, - the composer, born OTD 110 years ago, didn't want it shorter (but the publisher), more here. I'm back to a good tradition: a Britten composition on his birthday. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 19:52, 22 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Many thanks, Gerda. It was Blue for Benjamin day today! Martinevans123 (talk) 20:04, 22 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
My system sees a security problem with the link, sorry. - 10 years ago, I made {{Benjamin Britten}} for his centenary. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 21:08, 22 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
How very odd. It is https. Congrats for 10 years ago! Martinevans123 (talk) 21:22, 22 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Which of the 3 yt for Canticle I speaks to you most? - What a story! --Gerda Arendt (talk) 22:03, 24 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
User Talk:Gerda Arendt#Mozart Requiem --Gerda Arendt (talk) 22:57, 26 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks for the links, Gerda! Martinevans123 (talk) 09:11, 27 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Today: in memoriam Jerome Kohl who said (In Freundschaft): "and I hope that they have met again in the beyond and are making joyous music together" --Gerda Arendt (talk) 15:12, 27 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks, Gerda. Yes, a great band! Martinevans123 (talk) 15:15, 27 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Disambiguation link notification for November 8[edit]

An automated process has detected that when you recently edited Portskewett, you added a link pointing to the disambiguation page Hardwick.

(Opt-out instructions.) --DPL bot (talk) 06:04, 8 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks so much, DPL, for your latest gos. But that's the only page that seems useful there. Martinevans123 (talk) 19:31, 8 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

extremely banned[edit]

It's a good job we can trust these Admin types. That's the last time I ever make a pilgrimage to take the grotto cure. Martinevans123 (talk) 20:01, 8 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Well it's not like our admin's are from the gods or anything. Wait you take pilgrimages? Is that like an annual salmon run? Those can be fun, for the bears, like tourist season for the local shop's where I used to live. For the local non-shop owners, however, it can be quite unbearable. --ARoseWolf 12:27, 9 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
LOL. "As flies to wanton boys are we to th' gods: They indef us for their sport." -- Johnny Bunions 123 (talk) 12:50, 9 November 2023 (UTC)
Not in the mood. I liked what I saw of Wifione. I liked what I saw of Lourdes. I saw too little obviously. Music to be had at Rossini's talk. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 12:55, 9 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, actually, Lourdes seemed really helpful. Am thinking of turning this Talk page into a help-centre for disgraced Admins. Martinevans123 (talk) 13:05, 9 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Almost a selfie of my disgrace
Can I sign up for that even though I'm not an admin? I am perceived to be the blacksheep of the family. --ARoseWolf 14:21, 9 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I'll drink to that! But obvs, the choice is yours... Martinevans123 (talk) 15:54, 9 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

ITN recognition for Ryland Davies[edit]

On 9 November 2023, In the news was updated with an item that involved the article Ryland Davies, which you updated. If you know of another recently created or updated article suitable for inclusion in ITN, please suggest it on the candidates page. Scientia potentia est, MonarchOfTerror 09:43, 9 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you, MonarchOfTerror. --Martinevans123 (talk) 19:16, 9 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
No problem. Great work updating the article! Scientia potentia est, MonarchOfTerror 20:59, 9 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Yes indeed, boyo. According to James, Sean and Nicky, libraries gave us power.... [2]. Martinevans123 (talk) 21:14, 9 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I expanded the Glyndebourne section by many famous colleagues, directors and conductors. On a train ride yesterday, I had time to read the Duffie interview completely: enjoyable! Could you add more from that to the article? Especially those things taken from it to the Millington obit? I also had the chance - different IP - to see a bit more of The Times: it's different but nothing special. I'll turn to recordings. 9,4k+ views yesterday: let's entertain them. He will be good for GA. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 11:29, 10 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Will try and have a look. Yes, it's a good interview. Thanks for clarifying about The Times. Martinevans123 (talk) 18:24, 10 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you! Four recordings, need food before the next ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 19:04, 10 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I added Le Duc in Massenet's Chérubin, with the quote, also at Covent Garden in 1994, and Podestà in La finta giardiniera. Montserrat Caballé and the cognac is a great story. As is the 1983 opening night of Otello in San Francisco with Margaret Price, Silvano Carolli, and Marek Janowski in the Bruce Duffie 1998 Chicago radio interview. Here he is in Donizetti's Lucia di Lammermoor at the Royal Opera House, Covent Garden with Richard Bonynge in 1972. Truly wonderful stuff! Martinevans123 (talk) 20:47, 10 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you! - The cognac story is already in Caballé's article but for him, after DYK please or they will want nothing than that ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 20:52, 10 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
That would certainly be a strong contender! Probably a slam dunk... Millington mentions his "vocal breakdown that occurred in the early 1980s". I'm not sure if that should be included, or where, or how. He describes it himself in the Duffie interview: "... having had such a big bite of those lovely roles I did for twenty-six years, ... It's that sort of business." Martinevans123 (talk) 21:48, 10 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I think we don't need to be more explicit than we already are, - with years without performances and several "later he returned". - I found a nice obit by Cooper, added, which would be good for more recordings. Too tired now, perhaps tomorrow, when I also plan to get the references away from the text and nominate for GA. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 21:57, 10 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, looks useful. Mentions also ".. the Shepherd in Tristan und Isolde", although not sure when that was. Martinevans123 (talk) 22:06, 10 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
... the smallest of the small roles ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 22:47, 10 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, just 20 lines in two scenes, it seems. Perhaps too small to be worth any mention. Martinevans123 (talk) 08:06, 11 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

And death shall have no dominion

Though they go mad they shall be sane,
Though they sink through the sea they shall rise again;
Though lovers be lost love shall not;
And death shall have no dominion.

Dylan Thomas, The New English Weekly, 1933

Brand new cabinet

Constructed very quickly, by a Mr R Sunak of Westminster, this charming period piece wins this week's glittering Restoration Award on The Slightly Repaired Shop. Martinevans123 (talk) 18:48, 17 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Hi there Martin! Not sure if you have watch-listed Google Glass, so I thought I would send you this example of how I would re-work this content to make it more copyright compliant. Diff of Google GlassDiannaa (talk) 18:38, 19 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Hello Diannaa. Thanks very much, that's a great improvement and a very good example. I was slightly unsure if it was a smartphone or just a "smartphone-based messaging interface". I'd have to check beyond the abstract on the details. Maybe you've already been able to do that. Either way I guess, a smartphone was used. That article was not on my watchlist, but I came across it because of KJP1's continued efforts at the CCI.[a] It seems to be largely a one-person task for him at the moment. Thank you again for the very useful re-write. Martinevans123 (talk) 18:58, 19 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
There's a nice summary of the journal article at which is what I used to do my re-write. Based on the info in that summary, my feeling was that "smartphone-based messaging interface" was just a pretentious way of saying "sent a text message using a smartphone". — Diannaa (talk) 19:06, 19 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Similarly, I understood "passive cost" to mean that the simple fact that the device is in place on one's face causes a certain amount of distraction. — Diannaa (talk) 19:12, 19 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, that's the Abstract that's available to any reader via the reference. Scientific abstracts are generally freely available to anyone at no cost and without any institutional affiliation. I'd agree about the meaning of "passive cost". But I'm not sure that Ben Sawyer, Associate Professor at the University of Central Florida, or his associates at Wright Patterson are necessarily being "pretentious" lol. If it was simply a smartphone, it would have been a hand-held device and that may have imposed a further cognitive cost on the driving task. I also wasn't sure of the message modality - was it text, or voice, or a combination of both? I guess such details might not matter for the purposes of the Google Glass article? I can get access to Human Factors, but I don't have it on a continuous basis. Thanks again for the edit and for your friendly and encouraging message here. Martinevans123 (talk) 19:44, 19 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
  1. ^ (KJP please select which barnstars you wanted, which can send alongside the usual £50 on PayPal, cheers!)

England Expects ...[edit]

It's time for another entrant in our current round of unelected PMs, and as we've mentioned before, your CV fits the bill. You have exactly the right amount of hands-on governmental experience and glib self-assurance. We're slotting you in in mid-December, when everyone is distracted by the holidays, for a run of, well, maybe a year or so if past trends hold. England Expects That Every Man Will Do His Duty. Signed, Charles Rex

[Softlavender (talk) 08:22, 20 November 2023 (UTC)][reply]

Cheers Chazza, me ol' china. Yes, it's nearly the most wonderful time of the Parliamentary Year, again. And it's beginning to look a lot like recess! Soon time to break out those go to Seasonal treats..... over-cooked Brussels Sprouts, the kangaroo anus and, of course, pigs in blankets. Yum!! Martinevans123 (talk) 10:33, 20 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Alas, here in the colonies, all we get are two servings of old and spoiled leftovers. But anyway Martin, you have my vote! --Tryptofish (talk) 20:07, 20 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
"PM still confused on different types of test. He holds it in his head for a session and then it goes." (- private diaries of Sir Patrick Vallance, Chief Scientific Adviser)
... and yet, over here, we were comparatively lucky:
"And then I see the disinfectant where it knocks it out in a minute. One minute. And is there a way we can do something like that, by injection inside or almost a cleaning?" (- Donald Trump, White House coronavirus task force briefing, live on national television, 23 April 2020)
And some of you guys actually want him back?? Sheesh. Martinevans123 (talk) 21:26, 20 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I can't make sense of it, either. In Argentina, at least they can blame it on 140% inflation. --Tryptofish (talk) 21:36, 20 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Don't you worry.... as soon as we've removed all the ACM cladding, and replaced all the RAAC in our schools, hospitals, court-rooms and theatres, and got HS2 back on track and under budget, and sent all the boat people to Africa... we'll have a good three weeks left to grow the economy, reduce debt and cut NHS waiting lists. If not, we'll all get nice cushy jobs as presenters on GB News!! -- The Good Old Days 123 (talk) 21:50, 20 November 2023
Yeah, but can you make Mexico pay for it? --Tryptofish (talk) 21:53, 20 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
hmmm, good point. I think we'll just settle for making Australia pay for it! --Matty and Nigel's Excellent Adventure 123 (talk) 22:01, 20 November 2023 (UTC)

Breaking news[edit]

Did you know ...

Disambiguation link notification for November 21[edit]

An automated process has detected that when you recently edited Giorgio de Chirico, you added a link pointing to the disambiguation page Paramnesia.

(Opt-out instructions.) --DPL bot (talk) 06:09, 21 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

"Hey bot"... I can't help feeling I've seen your notifications before. And I've got this sneaky feeling you've posted this exact same thing somewhere else!! Martinevans123 (talk) 12:13, 21 November 2023 (UTC) [3][reply]

3 down and less than 3 to go![edit]

So, Sections 4/5/6 down. I’ll take a look back at 1 next, where lots of work’s already been done. Then, 2, where less has moved, and finally the rather daunting 3, where b@gger all’s happened. There’ll be a slight hiatus coz I’m away again next week, and then we’ve the big move in early December. But by Christmas 2024 we’ll be clear! KJP1 (talk) 12:13, 23 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Cool. I'm sure hundreds of other editors, inspired by your efforts, will soon rush over to help out. Alternatively, the imminent creation of copy-vio-bot will soon decimate the CCI listings. But seriously, your efforts are very much appreciated (by me at least). Martinevans123 (talk) 12:18, 23 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Are my edit summaries of any help at all? Would anything else be more useful for you? Ironically, as an unblocked editor, I am now freely able to wander over to any other CCI and decide if it's content needs any deletion or re-wording. Obviously I am disinclined to do that, or indeed to make any decisions on my own edits. As far as I can see, no advice is given on this aspect in the CCI guidlelines. Martinevans123 (talk) 15:32, 23 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
To be honest - and to save you time - not really! You still have to review the diff, then review the page as it now is, then review the source, then make a judgement call, and then either close it as Red XN or make any necessary tweaks. The summary is really just another thing you have to read/be cognisant of. What is really needed is the Frankenstein monster AI Bot that can tell if it’s a false positive or not. I’ve been looking over the Project pages and there have been prior discussions on this, and some WMF funding for tools that improve the workflow. But I’m sure that some of our tech-savvy colleagues (and I don’t include either you or I in that!) could develop something that would really help. I’ve flagged the issue so we can see what transpires. KJP1 (talk) 17:27, 23 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Fair enough. I won't bother. Obviously you can ask me to rewrite, but it's generally going to be about 10 times quicker if you simply just do a tweak (or a presumptive tweak) as you go along, just as you have been doing. Martinevans123 (talk) 17:34, 23 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]


Martin, Where I could use some help is with Medlar-with-Wesham. It's largely yours. Aside from reading like a Yellow Pages entry, and with a wealth of unsourced local colour; the "war memorial enjoys attractive floral displays throughout the year"!?WTF!?; it has two big bits on buildings, the Mowbreck Hall bit, and the whole section devoted to the workhouse. Neither is sourced, but both have the "ring" of having come from somewhere. "a fine edifice of red brick" / "faced with Accrington red-pressed bricks, and stone dressings". Any ideas as to where? What it really needs is a through copy edit/trim. KJP1 (talk) 09:23, 24 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, I'll have a look. But feel free to remove anything that looks suspect. Martinevans123 (talk) 09:26, 24 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Many thanks. Does the workhouse (later Wesham Park Hospital) even exist any more? The 2020 newspaper article says it was scheduled for demolition. KJP1 (talk) 09:32, 24 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
The site is now mostly a housing development. The last little bit of the former hospital, which was being used by the NHS, was indeed demolished in 2020 and half of the site is now taken up by a purpose-built residential care home for the elderly. Martinevans123 (talk) 09:48, 24 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I've added a book source from 1912 (Brownbill and Farrer (eds): The Victoria History of the County of Lancaster Volume 7). Is that still covered by copyright? Martinevans123 (talk) 11:18, 24 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

A la Ronde[edit]

Another one is A la Ronde. I think you said you still had the guidebook. Swathes of it are uncited, and much of it reads like a "lift". Other stuff we think comes from the Searle blog - or did he copy from us? What it needs is a thorough trim, and a check against the guidebook to ensure that any close paraphrasing is eliminated. KJP1 (talk) 10:14, 24 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, I agree. Since my contributions, User:Murgatroyd49, User:Rupples and User:Jack1956 have all made useful substantive edits. I wonder if any of them also have a copy of the guidebook. Martinevans123 (talk) 10:28, 24 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I have a copy of the guidebook (published 1991) Murgatroyd49 (talk) 10:32, 24 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I've got an edition revised in 2008. Martinevans123 (talk) 10:36, 24 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Quick check, mine is revised 2018, thought it wasn't that old. Murgatroyd49 (talk) 10:53, 24 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Cool. Doubt that our editions differ that much (mine has 32 pages). KJP says of the article: Swathes of it are uncited, and much of it reads like a "lift". So looks like we all ought to have a go at improvements, if we can? Martinevans123 (talk) 11:03, 24 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
What I haven't got is the Rough Guide where some of it may have come from, looking at the current refs. Murgatroyd49 (talk) 11:41, 24 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Nor me. Martinevans123 (talk) 11:55, 24 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I think the first thing to do is go through and identify all the material covered in the guide book and properly reference it with page numbers. I'll make a start on that later on. (Have shopping to do first!) Murgatroyd49 (talk) 12:05, 24 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Terrific - many thanks, both. What I'd also like to see is what Pevsner says. But that can wait, and will have to until my books are finally out of the bloody boxes. Unless, of course, either of you or a TPS has the updated Devon. KJP1 (talk) 12:21, 24 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
If it's of any use, I can dig out my old Devon Pevsner. Ghmyrtle (talk) 15:29, 24 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I'm sure it would be very useful if you could add that as a source for anything that's currently unsourced, although there's not a lot of architectural detail? Martinevans123 (talk) 16:05, 24 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Ghmyrtle - as Martin always says, any Pevsner is better than none! KJP1 (talk) 16:16, 24 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
errrrm, what I actually said was "any Prosecco is better than none." But never mind. Your can't beat some good Pevs. Martinevans123 (talk) 16:25, 24 November 2023 (UTC) [reply]
I've now added a few words from Pevsner (technically, Cherry and Pevsner). Ghmyrtle (talk) 13:20, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Many thanks, Guy. I do hope you won't he accused of Cherry picking. "fnaar, fnaar!" Martinevans123 (talk) 13:24, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

A thought occurs, while I wait to go to the library to check the ODNB entry for Jane Parminter; there is a separate article about the cousins at Jane and Mary Parminter which more or less duplicates the history section. Would it be worthwhile merging the two articles while we are in the process of a relatively major edit? Murgatroyd49 (talk) 13:14, 25 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Hi Murgatroyd. That might be a good idea. Another strategy might be to move all the biographical material from A la Ronde to Jane and Mary? Let's see what KJP1 thinks. Martinevans123 (talk) 13:42, 25 November 2023 (UTC) p.s. I can access the ODNB, using by library card number, from home.[reply]
It's just that there is a large overlap, most of the J&M article is about A la Ronde anyway. Murgatroyd49 (talk) 14:09, 25 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, I agree. The two articles should certainly be rationalised in some way. Martinevans123 (talk) 14:12, 25 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Have commented at the Proposal. I understand the rationale, but have a concern re. removing an article about 18/19th century women. KJP1 (talk) 17:28, 25 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Lionel Blair[edit]

Hi there. Just to let you know that the fountain is still there, or was the last time I looked. It's tucked away in the small open triangle - Seven Dials Close, behind Sainsbury's where Las Iguanas is situated. It was largely the opposite side of Saw Place that was redeveloped. Mighty Antar (talk) 14:42, 25 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Ah thanks for telling me, Mighty Antar. I was actually looking for a source that gave the location. The caption "Blair's handprints in Bath, UK" looked a bit vague and puzzling to me, especially as the image isn't explained anywhere in the text. In fact, that's the only mention of Bath - I wonder did Blair have some connection with the city? Many thanks. Martinevans123 (talk) 18:15, 25 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]


Lemon external surface and cross-section
Mr Waxey-Lemon at his "million-seller" book signing, feeling a little bitter...
Mr Big Stuff [dubious ][citation needed]
(Nigel Farage with the giant kangaroo anus, part of his Bush Tucker Trial)

Information icon There is currently a discussion at Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. Thank you. Pegasussy (talk) 22:41, 26 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

It seems that that discussion has now "run its course". It's not always a good idea to go running off to AN/I after less than a minute. I'd like to apologise to any of my fellow editors who may have felt obliged to defend what may have been seen as "ill advised" comments. But I'm not prepared to compromise on my personal view of Mr Yaxley-Lennon. The suggestion that he has written "... best selling books, which have sold millions" is a complete joke. Martinevans123 (talk) 08:50, 27 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I think it is most unfair that WP:BOOMERANG-generating ANI threads happens when I'm off-wiki. What am I supposed to do with all this popcorn? On-topic for the discussion though; there used to be a bit of graffiti on the western exit to Ashford International railway station that proudly said "Free Tommy" which has since been defected to be illegible, and erased by the council. Of course, this could be simply a campaign to re-instate Mr Boyd on children's television again and I've completely misunderstood. Ritchie333 (talk) (cont) 12:37, 27 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I bet you feel a right lemon. "Rock on, Tommy!!". Martinevans123 (talk) 12:47, 27 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
RIP Jean Knight (1943–2023): seems somehow appropriate. Martinevans123 (talk) 13:04, 27 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Stephen Yaxley-Lennon[edit]

I missed the fun at ANI, I see! But I actually came here to ask you to mind your tone on that ... gentlemen's talk page. I share your utter contempt but Wikipedia is not the place for our opinions and talk pages are for discussing articles, not subjects, and even people we don't like enjoy the protection of our BLP policy. Thanks, HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 18:24, 27 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I hope you saw my apology to fellow editors above? I'm sure I would not have shared by views so quickly if I had not been provoked by some pretty ridiculous claims. Martinevans123 (talk) 18:28, 27 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I saw. And I'm late to the party. I just wanted to remind you of the purpose of talk pages and the importance of BLP so we don't have any more issues in the future. :) HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 18:46, 27 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I can assure you it was no party, or even any fun, for me. I think Threesie might have some left-over popcorn to share if you're peckish. But thanks for the reminder. Martinevans123 (talk) 19:04, 27 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
If Martin, Harry, or Ritchie want to take a walk on the colony-side, do come and see Jacob Chansley. (The hatnote at the top of that page is worth the price of admission.) --Tryptofish (talk) 19:35, 27 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Sheesh. I'm sure Jacob and "our Tommy" would get along like a house on fire. But remind me not to do too much walking over there! Martinevans123 (talk) 19:41, 27 November 2023 (UTC) A hustle here and a hustle there??[reply]
Careful with that walking thing. Crossing the road is illegal over there! ;) That's possibly the second-funniest hatnote I've ever seen. This one has to be my favourite though. HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 19:50, 27 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Oh, that's definitely the winner! I laughed out loud. But for the distant second, I think the wolves should sue, but not the Rose one. --Tryptofish (talk) 19:58, 27 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Careful with that walking thing. Crossing the road is illegal over there! Funny story, my first time encountering a crosswalk. We don't have many roads to worry about. --ARoseWolf 21:07, 27 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Walking?? Isn't that something you Yankees do when you're finally too old to drive? Martinevans123 (talk) 21:15, 27 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Nope. We just sit on the couch and shout at the TV. --Tryptofish (talk) 21:21, 27 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Ah, not so different then, after all. Martinevans123 (talk) 21:33, 27 November 2023 (UTC) [4][reply]
I only just went to get my drivers license a few years ago. I have only driven an automobile a few times since then. Yankee?? I am not from New York but I did have an encounter with a lamp pole in Times-Square when I visited. Probably best to leave that experience in the locked box, Asareel. --ARoseWolf 21:28, 27 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
If you don't like the way I drive, stay off of the sidewalk. --Tryptofish (talk) 21:34, 27 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
"And if you don't like the way I insult people, stay off of the Talk page!" Martinevans123 (talk) 21:39, 27 November 2023 (UTC) .... don't be a dummy, just take your meds[reply]

ArbCom 2023 Elections voter message[edit]

Hello! Voting in the 2023 Arbitration Committee elections is now open until 23:59 (UTC) on Monday, 11 December 2023. All eligible users are allowed to vote. Users with alternate accounts may only vote once.

The Arbitration Committee is the panel of editors responsible for conducting the Wikipedia arbitration process. It has the authority to impose binding solutions to disputes between editors, primarily for serious conduct disputes the community has been unable to resolve. This includes the authority to impose site bans, topic bans, editing restrictions, and other measures needed to maintain our editing environment. The arbitration policy describes the Committee's roles and responsibilities in greater detail.

If you wish to participate in the 2023 election, please review the candidates and submit your choices on the voting page. If you no longer wish to receive these messages, you may add {{NoACEMM}} to your user talk page. MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 00:26, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

User:Lourdes not running this year? Well maybe, I guess. Martinevans123 (talk) 11:53, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Actually no woman, and Opabina regalis dropped out. And none of the candidates even understood my question, but what's new? - Ten years ago, an arb voted to ban an editor citing a diff in which he had uncollapsed an infobox and brought it back from the bottom to the normal position. None of the colleagues called him out on it. None of them had understood the diff which superficially looked as if he had added the box. I don't think they ever realised their mistake. My friend was not banned only because one of the arbs generously changed his vote (days later, heavy days for me), arguing that he didn't want to be the one voice needed to ban a prolific content editor. The whole thing made me mistrust arbitration. The best reply this year was "better make music than edit when angry" ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 12:27, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Not sure I'm quite ready yet to be ticking any of their boxes. I'm making a list and checking it twice.... Martinevans123 (talk) 12:32, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Simplified guide to arbitration I continue to live by: Don't. --ARoseWolf 12:50, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Ok, if you say so. But it's always great to have a committee, isn't it. Martinevans123 (talk) 13:20, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I know one committee that is very useful and fun (opinion), apparently until three users leave the same message on a user talk page. --ARoseWolf 15:06, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
One can't have too many birthdays, can one? Martinevans123 (talk) 15:15, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
The "Don't." is from Hammersoft, and best advice. I am tempted not to vote. 8 of 10. None of them will brake the Wiki, but none of them looked at detail, and none at the broader context. May they be praised for volunteering to do a dirty job.--Gerda Arendt (talk) 16:29, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I'm starting from a default "Oppose" for all ArbCom candidates. I'll review them, but it'll be difficult for any of them to move the needle off of oppose for me. ArbCom needs to go. It is a toxic boil on the heart of Wikipedia and a distinctly negative presence on the project. If it were an editor rather than a committee, it would have been banned from the project a long time ago. Failing candidates advocating significant reform, I see no reason to support them. --Hammersoft (talk) 18:08, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Sure we can't we tempt you off the fence on this one, Hammersoft? I'm willing to start from a default "Oppose" for all candidates, but then swiftly move to something more negative. "I didn't get where I am today by having toxic boils in my heart, Reggie!" Martinevans123 (talk) 18:16, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Ha! :) I love it! --Hammersoft (talk) 18:27, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I voted oppose on all candidates and will change it if something a candidate says or has said alters my position as I go through their answers and even look at past discussions they have had. It is nothing personal to any candidate, several of which I have admired for their work here, only that is always my default setting for all arbitration. --ARoseWolf 18:37, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Could we not have four columns: Oppose, Neutral, Support and Dismiss? Might speed things up. At least HJ Mitchell took the trouble to come to my Talk page to scold me personally. Martinevans123 (talk) 18:42, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Three columns suffice - neutral is good for nothing. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 19:02, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Fair enough. Although I'd be prepared to change "Dismiss" to just "Gunge". Martinevans123 (talk) 19:06, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Ah! Harry is a good one. He is principled even if we don't agree on everything. Most of us wouldn't agree on everything, like our favorite football squad (Juve), but most of the people I gravitate to in life, there must be something my Gift finds appealing about their principled nature, my Song finds resonates with their Song on some level, and my Life is irrevocably altered by the force of their impact upon me and my trajectory on my journey. --ARoseWolf 19:25, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Harry won my heart when, after this desolation, he returned among the first, but to be arb it takes more than winning my heart. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 20:16, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I had some great conversations with Dreadstar in private. He was a nice guy. Bit of a hothead (even by my standards when I was a decade younger) but he cared about what he was doing and wanted to make Wikipedia a better place. Not sure how he would have felt about Molly delivering the news of the desysop—he once told me he had a soft spot for her! That we (Wikipedians) are still arguing arguing about infoboxes a decade after the original arbitration case tells me that (some) people just like arguing. That's as true on Wikipedia as it is in life.
And for what it's worth, count me as a member of the "wish there was no ArbCom" party. The two or three cases a year that don't involve admin status could be handled by another body (perhaps a group of trusted editors appointed ad hoc to deal with a single case); I'd love to see an admin review board with powers to desysop for cause if warranted and issue findings on admin actions ranging from fully endorsed to outright admin abuse via "that was silly" and "good faith but could have been handled better". That still leaves some privacy and ban appeal functions but they don't have a lot do with "arbitration" (cf. second bullet here). HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 20:40, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
And this just makes me appreciate you more, Harry. I don't ever want a candidate to think my oppose vote is because I don't appreciate them as an editor/admin or as a person. I inherently don't trust bodies of arbitration whose inner workings are not expressly open to public scrutiny. This latest issue has only confirmed my concern.
We, as editors, devote a large portion of our time to the encyclopedia and community. It is an investment. I have tried to follow the conversation and discussion and decipher where I may stand on the issue. Private warnings, private disclosure and keeping evidence private against other fellow editors, outside that which may out someone's personal identity, with no avenue for the community to have access or judge conduct for themselves only invites distrust.
It leads me back to the same conclusion and the philosophy which Hammersoft, through Gerda, helped me form early, whether that was their intended purpose or not, that the best guide to arbitration is Don't. I know admins do not really have that luxury, per se, because of agreements they made to be an admin. We editors (only) don't have that same responsibility. And I will not leave the potential future of my editing on Wikipedia to a body I frankly don't trust whose process of evidence gathering to arrive at their decisions is not always in the open nor is the execution of their decision always known. How can I trust that they would be fair with the potential evidence gathered against or for me in those instances unless it was provided in the open, again keeping private only that which could out a persons identity? If it came to that I would be the one to decide my fate even if forced into it by the situation. --ARoseWolf 13:00, 1 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I can understand the mistrust of a body that is not transparent about their decision-making. But it seems to me that the solution is not "Don't", because that does nothing to solve the problem. I get it, that trying to get involved and fix what one can does not amount to fixing the things one cannot control. But fixing some things is better than fixing nothing at all. From my own experience, I've seen first hand where I've tried to help someone and was unsuccessful, so I can understand the skepticism there. But I've also been able to help someone, and been successful, multiple times. If I had decided instead to "Don't", I would not have helped those people. That's not nothing. It seems to me that "Don't" is ultimately the lazy way out. --Tryptofish (talk) 20:58, 1 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
You are entitled to your belief, Tryp. I never would try to change your opinion on the matter. I am truly happy you were able to do good and help someone. I honestly believe there is no greater thing a person can do in life than help their fellow man in whatever capacity. --ARoseWolf 21:33, 1 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
OK, then, I guess we can leave it at that. Good to share views, and I don't want to hijack Martin's talk any further. --Tryptofish (talk) 21:53, 1 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Quite funky, actually! Get down! Martinevans123 (talk) 22:47, 1 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Yeah! Like Boney M. with a splash of Downy! --Tryptofish (talk) 22:52, 1 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Downy?! lol. In the UK it's branded as Lenore.... quite rocky haha. Martinevans123 (talk) 22:58, 1 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Ah! The lost Lenore! Quoth the Raven, one more time! (No wisecracks about the bust of Paris, now.) --Tryptofish (talk) 23:11, 1 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
errrrm, was a track on the 1976 album Tales of Mystery and Imagination by The Alan Parsons Project, if I remember correctly! ... a bit spooky Martinevans123 (talk) 23:23, 1 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
"HJ Mitchy" is currently 9/4 odds on favourite.
Please could you hang around in paddock a while, HJ, while I install my own private set of Arbcom voting buttons. I'm hoping to really cash in this year. Thanks. --Honest John 123 (talk) 21:01, 28 November 2023 (UTC)
Harry, did you know that the original case was (or rather: should have been) about infobox opera, because that was new and not wanted by some? It's in more than 1.000 operas now. - If it was only arguing, those who enjoy that could keep doing it without causing harm. But Dreadstar was desysopped for having protected an article because of an edit war over the wording of the hidden message, - Wikipedia lost a good content editor. Another good editor left because she didn't want an infobox for a book. It still has no infobox. I worked on Kafka which really helps ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 21:40, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Gerda, what are we going to do with you?! I suggest we just get you in the ring with WP:WikiProject Composers and let you go the distance... Martinevans123 (talk) 21:55, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I went into the ring, in 2016. It still hurts. (My father died, Nikolaus Harnoncourt, Pierre Boulez and Dreadstar. And then that. It still hurts.) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 22:59, 29 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
My mistake. I'm sure you wouldn't want to do that again. Martinevans123 (talk) 17:37, 30 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Hammersoft has many principles which I have coalesced with principles which I have held since before coming to Wikipedia to form my own Wiki-philosophy. Chief among those being that the system that is Wikipedia sustains itself on vaguely worded policies, inconsistent decisions and a complete lack of general direction. It's why it will never die or go away but will be relegated to leisurely spiral in the realm of relevant irrelevance. I apologize, Rod. --ARoseWolf 18:28, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Ooooh... I can already hear the music! kinda spooky!! Martinevans123 (talk) 18:33, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I knew Rod through one handshake :) Not old enough to say I actually met him though. --Hammersoft (talk) 18:34, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
As it happens, one of the Arbs has been suspended. --Tfish
I'm going to push back against some of the discussion in this thread. Pretending that every candidate this year is indistinguishable from the rest, or that opposing everyone will make the community abolish ArbCom, or that taking the position that one will never participate in a case means that one will never find oneself drawn into a case against one's wishes, is childish. The grown-up approach is to recognize that ArbCom is, like every page in Wikipedia mainspace, a work in progress, and that taking the time to improve what's there is generally more helpful than blanking the page. A valid analogy is when people don't bother to pay attention to elections in the real world, and wind up with Donald Trump in the White House. --Tryptofish (talk) 20:43, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Or even a Yellowstone Wolf on Arbcom?? Martinevans123 (talk) 20:52, 28 November 2023 (UTC) [reply]
Little do you know! He's already on it. --Tryptofish (talk) 21:03, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Phew!! What a relief. Martinevans123 (talk) 21:06, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
[5]. --Tryptofizz (talk) 21:09, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Ah yes, thank you. A very timely word there from our Arbcom sponsors. -- Vincent vance Gopher 123 (talk) 21:17, 28 November 2023 (UTC)
Tryptofish, Awwww, does this mean I need to put away my TNT? --ARoseWolf 21:18, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Well, if you could get by with Alka-Seltzer... --Tryptofish (talk) 21:23, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I use good old-fashioned pseudoscience for headaches and, in times past, perhaps a case vodka. Just incase any arbitrator is looking to bribe me. ;) --ARoseWolf 21:30, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Currently trailing at 50/1. Martinevans123 (talk) 21:35, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
"O ye'll tak' the high road,
and I'll tak' the low road,
And I'll be in ArbCom afore ye..."
I prefer whisky. ;) HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 21:37, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I always had you down as a bit of a Talisker man, HJ. Except when you're a bit grumpy, of course. Martinevans123 (talk) 21:46, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
By the way, when you get to be my age, you start drinking the old person's cocktail: rum and prune juice. --Tryptofish (talk) 22:04, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Talisker's nice. Jura is a good one, Laphroaig is a favourite. Grouse is tolerable; it has Highland Park in it which is nice and smooth. I can't say I drink it very often. In a pub, I usually follow WereSpielChequers' advice and pick the ale with the silliest name! HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 22:19, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
The good thing about Laphroaig is, it's so peaty, if you get cold, you can cut off a slice and put it on the fire! I promise not to blackbush you. Martinevans123 (talk) 22:28, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I love the imagery of cutting off a slice of Laphroaig! --Tryptofish (talk) 22:34, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
And in the, um, spirit of the aforementioned Mr. Chansley, lovers of the maraschino cherry (or those who consider it a vegetable) will enjoy a Crossfire Hurricane. Those with good taste, however, should know that it's every bit as disgusting as it sounds. --Tryptofish (talk) 22:43, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Did someone say maraschino? "Ah! I'd love a Babyshambles!" (please note YT poster, lol) --Libertine 123 (talk) 22:54, 28 November 2023 (UTC)
I think that YT poster is in for a very rocky maraschino. --Tryptofish (talk) 23:08, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
And now even a campaign song. --Tryptofish (talk) 21:54, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
* please see below! Martinevans123 (talk) 22:31, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Let's hope none of the candidates appear as brazen as BBC presenter Maryam Moshiri. Martinevans123 (talk) 20:36, 7 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Too late…. Moneytrees🏝️(Talk) 20:42, 7 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, I know. See "extremely banned" above ..... That's the last time I ever make a pilgrimage to take the grotto cure, haha. Martinevans123 (talk) 21:10, 7 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Disambiguation link notification for November 28[edit]

An automated process has detected that when you recently edited She Blinded Me with Science, you added a link pointing to the disambiguation page Radio Silence.

(Opt-out instructions.) --DPL bot (talk) 06:09, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

"Good heavens, Miss Sakamoto". Martinevans123 (talk) 11:39, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Rufus Harley[edit]

One of his best, I think: "Scotch and Soul" (2006 Remaster), originally the title track for Scotch & Soul (1966): Rufus Harleybagpipes, Oliver Collins – piano, James Glenn – bass, Billy Abner – drums, Robert Gosset – congas. Martinevans123 (talk) 20:41, 28 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]


Now preparing for a major re-work of the Sun article, thanks to this recently discovered source. Thank you, Gary Larson! Martinevans123 (talk) 20:36, 30 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Whole Lotta Love[edit]

Sadly insufficient secondary sources for an entry at List of cover versions of Led Zeppelin songs: alas. Martinevans123 (talk) 22:24, 7 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Now booking: Winter Cruises[edit]

HMS "Sue Ellen" Braverman

All aboard for new exciting Winter Earlyish Summer possibly Cruises!! Good Cap'n Jolly Jenrick Mikey welcomes you aboard. Calling at: RAF Scampton, MDP Wethersfield, South Georgia, Ascension Island, Albania, Saint Helena and Kigali. Cost: £240 million. A room of your own or your money back! (well some of it, anyway). Martinevans123 (talk) 08:24, 8 December 2023 (UTC) (Note: sorry, "drop off" at Stockton no longer available)[reply]

With these luxurious accommodations this appears to be a steal. --ARoseWolf 19:40, 8 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
H.M.Government advice: please keep your passport handy and try not to wear a pink shirt. --World leadin' partnership 123 (talk) 19:58, 8 December 2023 (UTC)

RIP Shane Patrick Lysaght[edit]

RIP Shane: [6]. from Rum Sodomy & the Lash (1985), vocal: Cait O'Riordan. Martinevans123 (talk) 10:02, 8 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Elgin marbles spat[edit]

Hello there I reverted your addition of a Sunak quote at question time because history suggests this will just lead to some supporter of the Greek position adding a counter quote etc. I think we should avoid this article turning into a forum where editors engage in a running commentary on political squabbles about the marbles. I think the significant fact is that a scheduled meeting was cancelled due to comments about the marbles. The rights and wrongs of this and who said what to who and who was grandstanding (they probably both were) will be an endless debate. Happy to discuss. Aemilius Adolphin (talk) 22:15, 29 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for your message. I have no desire to see the "article turning into a forum", thanks. I think the exchange at PMQs was notable and provided Sunak's side of the story (it's now on TV again on the BBC News at Ten programme). It's obvious that the row is essentially a political one, given that Starmer hastily met with Mitsotakis and then boasted about it at PMQs. I doubt it will be in the news again for a while, so this part of the "debate" will hardly be "endless". Regards. Martinevans123 (talk) 22:23, 29 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

December music[edit]

December: story · music · places

Today's story is about Maria Callas, on her centenary. - Aaron Copland died OTD, and Jerome Kohl (mentioned in November) said something wise on Copland's talk, - yes, regarding a soft(er) stance towards infoboxes. -- Gerda Arendt (talk) 16:50, 2 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Ah yes, La Divina. Matchless really. Martinevans123 (talk) 20:47, 2 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
25k views. A new church year began (listen), - a new era? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 18:03, 3 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Heard this on the radio this morning and thought of you. Martinevans123 (talk) 18:28, 3 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you! - Today's story is about parts of my life. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 18:25, 4 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
And here's Dr. Feelgood playing "She Does It Right", live on Tyne Tees' The Geordie Scene in 1975: [7]. It really does have everything: Brilleaux with a top-mixed, hard-hitting vocal; Wilko on fire (complete with basin-cut and duckwalk); Sparko and The Big Figure beating it out; hundreds of teenage girls not really sure what they are happily dancing to. In fact, a strange juxtaposition between Brilleaux's "She works hard every night just to make me feel alright" and the dancing teenagers. But still a classic. Martinevans123 (talk) 21:18, 5 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you! - Looking for something for St Nicholas, - nobody made a DYK for Britten's - can you believe it? - we'll sing my (user's) infobox for Christmas, DYK? - announced the day you mentioned Schütz (first and last movement, - the quote is from the last). I hid a little Mozart on my user talk. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 21:34, 5 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Ha! What a coincidence. Sounds good! Martinevans123 (talk) 21:47, 5 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Today, I managed to get the pics to snow (on 28 Nov), and heard a lovely concert, after listening to a miracle of meditative dreaming on 6 December (or just click on music). --Gerda Arendt (talk) 22:03, 8 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
magical Have long been a fan. Martinevans123 (talk) 23:25, 8 December 2023 (UTC) p.s Luca Sestak was a genius 16 years ago, when aged 12, but he's just got better.[reply]
yes - ... and today, to Paris (29 Nov) with a visit to the Palais Garnier, - to match the story of Medea Amiranashvili, - don't miss listening to her expressive voice. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 20:06, 9 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks Gerda, yes very expressive. I thought you might like this. As you may know, Josh Cooter is in The Gesualdo Six. Martinevans123 (talk) 17:13, 10 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, I like it! - My story today is about Michael Robinson, - it's an honour to have known him. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 15:10, 13 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Pics up to 3 December (with my shadow in one of them), and a story about Beethoven in memory of his birth. When the arb who wrote the infoboxes case installed the community consensus - in 2015! - I hoped these infobox wars were over, really. - What do you think about writing The Sleeping Child (Chilcott) together? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 23:03, 16 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Ah well, at least we know you aren't a true vampire! Happy to help out, if I can on Bob Chilcott. Is there enough for an entire article? Martinevans123 (talk) 10:31, 17 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
New pic, cake (home-baked but not by me) before that dream of a concert - today's story about the woman who directed today's Aida, with a trailer of her work. - I'll check tomorrow about the Child, - it doesn't take much to write an article. Chilcott needs more sources - go ahead ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 22:57, 17 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
About the Sleeping Child: I planned it tentatively for 25 Dec when I may not get to editing at all ... - Minor request: in your most wonderfully pictured greetings, you closed some "br" but not one of them which I fixed on my talk. Just in case you want to prevent "all-pink" in edit mode of complete pages (instead of helpful editor colours) ... --Gerda Arendt (talk) 12:46, 21 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Oh dear, thanks for telling me. It was my Christmas Puzzle. Hours of fun! Martinevans123 (talk) 12:52, 21 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
... while my "card" is already above, I just update - story each day, music almost each day. If you follow the diary ("places") today you see an amazing colour coordination of the Gothic church and the table cloth that evening. It was also amazing music! --Gerda Arendt (talk) 14:34, 21 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Today, I have a special story to tell, of the works of a musician born 300 years ago. Don't miss the little doggie, painted by someone famous. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 09:42, 22 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I don't think he did many dogs. But that's a very nice one! Meanwhile, I have been listening to a lot of Jephtha lately, like this gem. Martinevans123 (talk) 22:54, 22 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Didn't manage the Sleeping Child, - will try tomorrow. - Christmas music pictured --Gerda Arendt (talk) 23:41, 25 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Child now sleeping ;) - help wanted. - I try to finish uploading images of 2023 before it ends, and reached 17 December. Happy to see Rebekka Habermas on the Main page. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 22:48, 29 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Lesley Joseph[edit]

Hi Martinevans123, I apologized for myself putting the wrong category "comedian" for Lesley Joseph and thank you for your understanding for explanation about her. She's just a comic actress. Ernestine Sanchez (talk) 14:35, 4 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

No worries, Ernestine. It's a bit of a grey area, isn't it. Comic actresses don't tell jokes but they can still make us laugh. Martinevans123 (talk) 15:21, 4 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, I agree with you, Martin. Ernestine Sanchez (talk) 15:24, 4 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]


Hello...thanks for the cited needed tag[8]; now met. That makes you a gentleman in my mind - its always good when tage are added to specific claims rather than, euf, leaving an overbearing and large template at the top. Ceoil (talk) 00:28, 6 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

No worries. Thanks for adding that source. I didn't look like a very controversial claim. I rather hid that tag under my link addition! Cheers. Martinevans123 (talk) 08:34, 6 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

RIP Benjamin Obadiah Iqbal Zephaniah[edit]

Observations on Brexit, on BBC's Question Time (2018) and performing "Money" in Newcastle in 1991 Martinevans123 (talk) 22:26, 8 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]


please make sure cwm updates are correct (talk) 05:50, 12 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry, IP 93. Not sure I get what you mean. Martinevans123 (talk) 08:21, 12 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
A case of mistaken identity? --ARoseWolf 13:09, 12 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Looks like it. I'm only guilty of reminding everyone that Cwm Albion F.C. are "UK's 'worst performing football team'"!! Thanks for the suggestion, A Rose. Hope you are well. Martinevans123 (talk) 13:14, 12 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
A common theme in Wikipedia involves innocent victims dealing with deranged adversaries, as seen in Hitchcock's film Rebecca (1940), where Mrs. Danvers tries to persuade Mrs. De Winter to leap to her death.
I am well, thank you. I hope I find you the same. If I haven't said it enough, I'm thrilled you back to editing. Our light-hearted conversations have always been a delight of mine and high point of my day. --ARoseWolf 12:43, 13 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Awwwww, that's so nice of you. Glad to be of service, haha! Martinevans123 (talk) 13:23, 13 December 2023 (UTC) [9][reply]
Hey, when a guy throws Hitchcock at me it's most definitely getting serious. Ha! All kidding aside, you are appreciated. Now let me find a window. --ARoseWolf 14:17, 13 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Ah yes, try and find a high one. You'll get a better view! Martinevans123 (talk) 21:37, 13 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]


--Tryptofish (talk) 21:22, 14 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Ah right. Still alive, then. Shucks, there goes another tenner.... Welcome back, buddy!! Martinevans123 (talk) 22:14, 14 December 2023 (UTC) and here's those wonderful ballad-blastin' pop-tastic crooners Peters and Lee for ya! not 'arf, pop-pickers!![reply]
Never bet against a fish (unless you're one of those hookers). But I won't interrupt you any longer, since you appear to have a mess to clean up below. --Tryptofish (talk) 22:38, 15 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
"I went diving with Dean Martin and got attacked by an eel. "What the hell was that?", I screamed... he turned to me and said "that's a moray". Ah thangu! Martinevans123 (talk) 23:04, 17 December 2023 (UTC) p.s. I'm also quite cool with, like, a gay tarantella. Or, in fact, really any 2SLGBTQ+ arachnid-inspired Italian folk dance.[reply]
And I thought I was the one on drugs... --Tryptofish (talk) 23:12, 17 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
"You know when they have a fishing show on TV? They catch the fish and then let it go. They don’t want to eat the fish, they just want to make it late for something." - Mitch Hedberg. -- Martinevans123 (talk) 23:21, 17 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
He's been hooked! --ARoseWolf 12:57, 21 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Ever since Martin was promoted to Dean, he's been sitting in a dive bar. (As in Dean Martin Evans 123, diving for a moray... Oh, never mind...) --Tryptofish (talk) 23:50, 21 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
"There's a ghost fish in my house, I can't hide!" -- R. Dean Evans 123 (talk) 00:04, 22 December 2023 (UTC) [10]
Shocking! --Tryptofish (talk) 00:10, 22 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Ah-ha! Now we're talking!! [11] Martinevans123 (talk) 00:16, 22 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
His fins are made for walking --ARoseWolf 14:46, 22 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
.... and cue Nancy Fish.... [12]! Martinevans123 (talk) 16:04, 22 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
By the way, that YouTube video of Stingray is not to be missed. Here in the colonies, all I had in my fry-hood was Soupy Sales: [13]. --Tryptofish (talk) 20:22, 22 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Wow. That also explains a lot.... but I guess stereo Pie in The Face looks much better on the radio! Martinevans123 (talk) 20:38, 22 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Ha, I bet it does explain a lot. When I was little, I loved that show! Take a quick look at Soupy Sales#New Year's Day incident. (Sounds ominous, doesn't it?) I still remember when that happened, and crying in my mother's arms because the show had been taken off the air for Two Whole Weeks. (Now, it sounds like something Trump would do, except not as a joke.) --Tryptofish (talk) 20:44, 22 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Ah yes. Something very similar happened in the UK when it was discovered that Spotty Dog ("the very biggest spotty dog you ever did see") was found to be an undercover KGB agent. Pre-school children all over Britain has to send in Transnistrian rubles to get him released from the BBC dog pound. Martinevans123 (talk) 21:02, 22 December 2023 (UTC) I really must try and find a better source for that fact .....[reply]

May need you input.[edit]

Hello @Martinevans123, on article Douglas Murray (author), in the lede section third para contains info about his admirers and critics. So when I included a brief line "He has been accused of being Islamophobic by academics and journalists." with WP:RS sources since it was WP:Notable, another editor removed it. I was thinking maybe you could provide your input if it escalates to edit-war. (talk) 23:46, 13 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Hello IP 182. I don't think I've ever seen that article before, so I'm not really familiar with the material. But the main aim, on any article, is to try and avoid edit warring. Thanks. Martinevans123 (talk) 08:42, 14 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Amess murder article talk[edit]’s_behaviour? I have added talk discussion on my edit. (talk) 13:12, 15 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Many thanks for telling me. Had you considered creating an editor account? It's very easy. Regards. Martinevans123 (talk) 13:24, 15 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I know it has been months, but I don't feel like doing it but feels that if anyone thinks that the revision I made could be used for any revisions in the future, albeit with better written paragraphs or if they are worth expanding, please feel free to do so, I had long added "further explanation needed" in the last paragraph of the "attack" section; as I am a resident of Southend, I feel that this is better suited to users here, especially as I sadly never knew Amess' name before he died (I guess politics is not my thing and I have autism); regardless of what he was like or what controversies he may have had in life, what happened to him is a terribly sad story. I feel for how much he must have suffered, and certainly for his wife and children. It also helps people to remember there are real families involved, that the man was a people’s relative, their blood, and not just names for amateur sleuths to fuss over. As I mentioned before, I just didn't want to stir up any more pain and trouble for the Amess family." (talk) 15:25, 8 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Hello IP 92. I have responded at Talk:Murder of David Amess. Thanks. Martinevans123 (talk) 20:23, 9 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Merry Christmas![edit]

A very happy Christmas and New Year to you!

Have a great Christmas, and may 2024 bring you joy, happiness – and no trolls, vandals or visits from Krampus!


SchroCat (talk) 15:20, 18 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Cheers, SchroCat!! Eeeeeewww, reminds me of that episode. But thanks for the very timely warning about the inherent dangers of unsupervised cornucopia usage on swings. Yours aye, with the rest of the Guardian-reading, tofu-eating wokerati... Martinevans123 (talk) 17:23, 18 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Seasons Greetings![edit]

Cool beans, Blowers me ol' china. Vey nice to hear from you! Thanks. Martinevans123 (talk) 21:10, 18 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]


Thank you so much for the lovely and colourful message! All the best to you and yours DBaK (talk) 19:35, 20 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Same to you[edit]

Another year. :)

Kieronoldham (talk) 01:07, 21 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]


I do confess to watching this video again this morning, and so I can't really justify editing Jacob Rees-Mogg as I'm concerned my POV might get in the way; anyway, I think the talk page discussion is worth having. Ritchie333 (talk) (cont) 14:18, 21 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Go for it, Caroline. Martinevans123 (talk) 14:23, 21 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
hmmm Ritchie333 (talk) (cont) 14:27, 21 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
... ah yes, did someone say "physical embodiment of arrogance and entitlement"? Martinevans123 (talk) 14:37, 21 December 2023 (UTC) ... why not treat yourself this Christmas? ... only £18.97 here!! (that's about three and a half hours at the new 18-20 National Minimum Wage of £7.49)[reply]
Oh and by the way, just remember...."someone who is always mildly sedated, can never realise there are better men out there". Martinevans123 (talk) 15:36, 24 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Big smiles[edit]

It's good knowing you're back!! Atsme 💬 📧 14:15, 22 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Brought big frowns and kicked over furniture to most, but whatever (and Merry Christmas to both of you). Randy Kryn (talk) 14:22, 22 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, am thinking of running next year. Hasta la vista, baby. And it's a fab chart-bound-sound from Arnold!! Martinevans123 (talk) 15:58, 22 December 2023 (UTC) p.s. Merry Crimbo, Mr Krynmeister![reply]

Best Christmas song[edit]

Is this the best Christmas song, or what? ♦IanMacM♦ (talk to me) 10:39, 25 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Of course. I'm surprised Wombling Merry Christmas doesn't make that claim" Perhaps Gerda could get in on Main Page? Martinevans123 (talk) 10:44, 25 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Chris Spedding and Clem Cattini play on this song, and very well.--♦IanMacM♦ (talk to me) 12:04, 25 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Ah yes, the wonderful Mr Spedding. "Let's stick a new oar in..." Superb solo! Martinevans123 (talk) 12:30, 25 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

ITN recognition for Henry Sandon[edit]

On 27 December 2023, In the news was updated with an item that involved the article Henry Sandon, which you updated. If you know of another recently created or updated article suitable for inclusion in ITN, please suggest it on the candidates page. PFHLai (talk) 07:44, 27 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Many thanks. Martinevans123 (talk) 10:39, 27 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

RIP Tony Oxley: Taunton 1991. Martinevans123 (talk) 10:42, 27 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Here's Derek Higgins talking about Tony: [14]. Martinevans123 (talk) 12:10, 28 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Unsourced content[edit]

Coconut ice (without sauce)
Coconut (without ice)

Rather than remove innocuous unsourced content and the resulting category, isn't it more constructive to do a quick search for sources? South African Coconut ice was easy to source. PamD 07:00, 28 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Coco (no nut)
Hello Pam. Thanks for your note. Hope you are well. Seasons Greetings to you too. Martinevans123 (talk) 09:52, 28 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
So it seems you had much better luck than I did in finding a source. I'd agree it was quite innocuous and I was a little surprised it had been unsourced for three and a half years. The problem with unsourced claims is that they might not be true. I generally have a look for some source(s) before deleting anything, but on this occasion was unsuccessful. I see there's also a recipe in The South African for chocolate ystervarkies ("little porcupines"). Let's hope they're not too prickly. 😄 Martinevans123 (talk) 10:12, 28 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Season's greetings[edit]

Christmas postcard featuring Santa Claus using a zeppelin to deliver gifts, by Ellen Clapsaddle, 1909
~ ~ ~ Merry Christmas! ~ ~ ~
Hello Martinevans123: Enjoy the holiday season and winter solstice if it's occurring in your area of the world, and thanks for your work to maintain, improve and expand Wikipedia. Cheers, Spread the love; use {{subst:User:Dustfreeworld/Xmas1}} to send this message.
CAPTAIN RAJU(T) 21:27, 28 December 2023 (UTC)
Thank you, Captain! Martinevans123 (talk) 21:54, 28 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Happy New Year 2024![edit]

Happy New Year!
Hello Martinevans123:

Did you know ... that back in 1885, Wikipedia editors wrote Good Articles with axes, hammers and chisels?

Thank you for your contributions to this encyclopedia using 21st century technology. I hope you don't get any unnecessary blisters.

CAPTAIN RAJU(T) 19:02, 31 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Spread the WikiLove; use {{subst:Happy New Year elves}} to send this message
CAPTAIN RAJU(T) 19:02, 31 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you so much. "Blistering Barnacles, Captain"! Martinevans123 (talk) 19:17, 31 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]


Like 2019, remember? -- Gerda Arendt (talk) 22:36, 1 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I have trouble remembering five days ago, let alone five years!! 😄 But thanks anyway. Martinevans123 (talk) 15:39, 3 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
That's why we have archives ;) - you click on the (former) image and get all names where it was mentioned. Longer story for Floq - don't want to type it again. - I have a poll on WT:DYK. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 17:09, 3 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The 2023 picture is from the Abel Fest in Köthen, celebrating the tercentenary of Carl Friedrich Abel, a viol virtuoso, composer and concert organiser in London (together with Bach's youngest son), born on 22 December 1723 in Köthen, where the new catalogue of his works was introduced, - my story today. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 21:53, 5 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks for the links, Gerda. Martinevans123 (talk) 22:05, 5 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I see that you don't remember five day's ago. You met the author 14 Nov, and the catalogue 22 Dec ;) - better late than never --Gerda Arendt (talk) 22:53, 5 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
On the Main page now: the person who made the pictured festival possible --Gerda Arendt (talk) 20:14, 16 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

January music[edit]

story · music · places

Thank you for memories! I remember Ewa Podleś on the Main page, and have - believe it or not - two musical DYK. Shalom chaverim. On vacation, with something for your sweet tooth --Gerda Arendt (talk) 09:35, 25 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for the links, Gerda. Happy Saint Dwynwen's Day! Martinevans123 (talk) 13:15, 25 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you. Today: Anna Nekhames, the article in which a reviewer found nothing interesting. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 20:38, 26 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Taking tons of vacation pictures, 23 chosen for 23 Jan, 6 uploaded, too tired for more - on my talk you see that it's the birthday of Mozart and our conductor ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 00:02, 28 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Sounds great. Thanks Gerda. Today also the birthday of the wonderful Robert Wyatt. [15] Jennifer Maidman guitar; Annie Whitehead trombone; etc. Martinevans123 (talk) 19:32, 28 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
well, I didn't realise it was already another day - being in a different time zone than normally - Mozart and conductor 27 Jan. - All 23 pics are there now, and I hope to manage the next day later today. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 19:41, 28 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Ah Gerda, you're such a jet setter! Gosh, we used to have four BBC channels... those were the days! Martinevans123 (talk) 20:10, 28 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Today a friend's birthday, with related music and a few new vacation pics --Gerda Arendt (talk) 21:52, 30 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

DYK for Ryland Davies[edit]

On 9 January 2024, Did you know was updated with a fact from the article Ryland Davies, which you recently created, substantially expanded, or brought to good article status. The fact was ... that a 1974 recording of Mozart's Così fan tutte with Ryland Davies as Ferrando was used in a 1995 film by the Salzburg Marionette Theatre? The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/Ryland Davies. You are welcome to check how many pageviews the nominated article or articles got while on the front page (here's how, Ryland Davies), and the hook may be added to the statistics page after its run on the Main Page has completed. Finally, if you know of an interesting fact from another recently created article, then please feel free to suggest it on the Did you know talk page.

RoySmith (talk) 00:03, 9 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Congrats (to you and to Gerda)! --Tryptofish (talk) 00:17, 9 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
As usual, that was about 95% Gerda. I put in the bit about him being a keen rugby player in his youth. But thank you. Martinevans123 (talk) 08:47, 9 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I like that to appear on my mom's birthday ;) - who introduced me to sing, sing. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 09:54, 9 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Perhaps you (all) can add to Chris Karrer whom I nominated for RD (where it found only one support). I am not sure how to word the Krautrock legend thingy. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 09:59, 9 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Happy to bask in the reflected glory, Gerda. Martinevans123 (talk) 10:03, 9 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I have a DYK on the Main page, but my story would be different, about Figaro, - this Figaro. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 15:12, 12 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Paula Vennells (but not really)[edit]

Thank you for your last message at Talk:Paula Vennells. I don't know what it is about that article, but it seems to cause an editorial dispute at every turn (not all involving you, I do acknowledge)!

I do feel as though we've got off on the wrong foot, which is a shame as I believe we edit some of the same topics and so should be Wiki-friends (or at least Wiki-acquaintances). For example, I can see you've been involved with listed buildings in Gwynedd and I've recently brought Criccieth Castle and Dolwyddelan Castle up to GA status. I hope that if we bump into each other again we can make a better go of it. All the best, A.D.Hope (talk) 13:51, 19 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you for such a friendly message. Don't worry, I appreciate your robust discussion! I'm sorry that I am forever trying to make jokes. Martinevans123 (talk) 13:59, 19 January 2024 (UTC) ...for a moment there I misread and thought you had bought Criccieth Castle and Dolwyddelan Castle! 😄[reply]
To be quite honest I think Wikipedia would be better if editors took themselves less seriously (and I definitely include myself there), so joke away. I reckon I'd have been more open to them if the discussion had seemed less... interminable, not that that's anyone's fault.
I don't think either castle would suit me these days, they're a bit open-plan for my taste! A.D.Hope (talk) 21:33, 19 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The joke that blew Paula's chances of Bishop of London
The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it.
Q: Why did I have to wait a long time at the post office behind Satan?
A: Because the devil can take many forms. Martinevans123 (talk) 21:46, 19 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I think that's your best one yet, Martin! A.D.Hope (talk) 13:12, 21 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Well, that’s not saying much! Lol. Notice I didn’t mention Horizon! Martinevans123 (talk) 17:26, 21 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

"Dat" (1976): "Rasta Ozzy from up the hill, Decide to check on him grocery bill..." Opal Records: PAL 5 Martinevans123 (talk) 19:18, 19 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Was the producer for "Midnight Rider" by Paul Davidson (1975).
Thank you for ITNN for him. I wanted to fix the bare url, and get a "Security risk" warning, although it is the same website as the notice of his death which I can see fine. "the late veteran ..." isn't exactly neutral language to me ... - Have you seen my story today? Also on ITNN, - no comment yet. I have other (DYK) stories the two next days. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 21:28, 19 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Peter Schickele, too. But I trust that PDQ lives on. --Tryptofish (talk) 21:40, 19 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks for spotting that, Gerda. It's a unsecure mobile version of the site. I'll have to look for a better source which gives the chart position. Martinevans123 (talk) 21:40, 19 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Here's a bit of Pluto's Little Weed from "Dat". Martinevans123 (talk) 12:14, 20 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you, lovely! - The composer is also on the Main page now, but I got nervous ;) - I have a pun on my talk, DYK, because St. Joseph is in Wedding. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 14:16, 20 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
A pun? Well done! But I have yet to find it, lol. Martinevans123 (talk) 21:26, 20 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I thought you'd look for "wedding". Shortcut to the wedding pun --Gerda Arendt (talk) 21:38, 20 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Ah yes, of course. Obviously too subtle for me! Let's hope they don't split. Martinevans123 (talk) 21:43, 20 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Supper in Moscow for Stenka
Meanwhile... back in 1967 Soviet Russia... here's the amazing Yuri Gulyayev. (A bit incongruous, I must admit: you're all sat down cosy, in a respectable little down-town Moscow supper club, and this guy suddenly gets up and starts wailing about a 17th-century Cossack leader who kills the beautiful Persian Princess he's just married and then throws her from his boat into the River Volga, " a gesture addressed to his disgruntled jealous comrades who accuse him of "mellowing down" after just one night spent with a woman." Let's face it, after a few bottles of 80 proof vodka with our mates, we've all been there, haven't we. [16]) Martinevans123 (talk) 22:22, 20 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
.... and here's the better known version. Incredibly sweet. Wonderful harmonies. So sad. Martinevans123 (talk) 23:09, 20 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

ITN recognition for Pluto Shervington[edit]

On 20 January 2024, In the news was updated with an item that involved the article Pluto Shervington, which you nominated and updated. If you know of another recently created or updated article suitable for inclusion in ITN, please suggest it on the candidates page. Stephen 01:30, 20 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you Stephen. Martinevans123 (talk) 12:09, 20 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]


"Follow the sources" is the default, but is a convention not a firm rule. In articles on UK railways, for example, the current consensus is to use imperial, despite the fact that railway engineering in Britain has been done exclusively in metric since 1975. So the disp=flip option in {{convert}} gets heavy usage .

So the choice also depends on existing use in the article concerned, hence the MOS:RETAIN reference. 𝕁𝕄𝔽 (talk) 15:28, 20 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, thanks. I had assumed that "Follow the sources" was written somewhere in policy. I was surprised to see hectares shown first at Open University. That's a perfectly reliable source from the OU itself there, of course; perhaps ecology at the OU is always done in metric? But if one were to find multiple other sources, all equally reliable, that used acres, or which put acres first, I'm not sure how it would be "gaming the system" to use them. Most geographical areas of land I've seen for UK articles put acres first. So I guess MOS:RETAIN could be balanced against overall consistency. Are acres still taught in UK schools? I must admit I don't know. Martinevans123 (talk) 21:25, 20 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I would call it gaming the system if someone actively went hunting for sources to support a specific POV.
AFAIK, schools teach SI as the foundation system but have to ensure that students are aware of common imperial measures in common use, like miles, feet, inches; stones, pounds and ounces; pints and possibly gallons. No doubt rural schools teach acres but I'd be surprised if urban schools bother much. Of course with lunatic ideas like pint bottles of wine being proposed in all seriousness, who knows what nonsense the DFE is demanding nowadays. 𝕁𝕄𝔽 (talk) 00:05, 21 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Bring it on, I say! I'm all for Letterbox wine! ...Red Wine and Hobnobs, anyone?? Martinevans123 (talk) 11:13, 21 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Laurie Johnson MBE (7 February 1927 – 16 January 2024) - composer of the theme for The Avengers (1965) and many, many more. Martinevans123 (talk) 14:37, 23 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

And Frank Farian. But we won't mention Milli Vanilli.--♦IanMacM♦ (talk to me) 14:54, 23 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Have always seen you, Ian, as a kind of Wikipedia Daddy Cool, lol. The theme from The Avengers must be one of the best ever. "Just wonderful, Mrs. Peel"! Martinevans123 (talk) 14:59, 23 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Farian had already done something similar with Bobby Farrell. I was shocked, shocked to learn that he did almost none of the male singing for Boney M, but it all went badly wrong with Milli Vanilli.--♦IanMacM♦ (talk to me) 15:19, 23 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I imagine you've got all the Farrell moves, too! Martinevans123 (talk) 15:25, 23 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
For the sake of completeness, it should be pointed out that Maizie Williams also sang very little if at all during the studio recordings of the Boney M songs. For some reason this never caused a controversy, although it did when Farian had the same idea with Milli Vanilli.--♦IanMacM♦ (talk to me) 10:13, 24 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, seems even though Morvan and Pilatus were "more talented musically than Bob Dylan, Paul McCartney and Mick Jagger", they only had a few Farrell sidestep moves... Martinevans123 (talk) 10:20, 24 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

RIP Melanie[edit]

Melanie Anne Safka-Schekeryk (February 3, 1947 – January 23, 2024): "Brand New Key". Martinevans123 (talk) 22:29, 24 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

"Brand New Key" was a number four hit in the UK, but The Wurzels reached number one with "The Combine Harvester". Life just isn't fair sometimes.--♦IanMacM♦ (talk to me) 08:30, 25 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
"Ooh-arh, ooh-agh". Yes, another work of genius. Martinevans123 (talk) 09:22, 25 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Rheidol Stag[edit]

Sorry about reverting your edit, I'm tryng to keep the image close to the relevant text. It actually worked better before a previous editor removed half of the explanation. Murgatroyd49 (talk) 12:17, 28 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Yes it did, but that may have been "copyvio", so I can't complain... Often a trade-off with stubs. "Snow biggie, dude". Martinevans123 (talk) 12:21, 28 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
That'd be me, I'm afraid! The difficulty was that the long explanation - some Martin's, some not - was not supported by the Coflein entry. This says, rather briefly, "Lead mine waste", and identifies it as a "Post-medieval Mining feature". And that's it. The long explanation of how the "head/body/legs" were formed just isn't there. Obviously, if someone can paraphrase a suitable RS which covers all this, then back in it can go. KJP1 (talk) 12:29, 28 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Sorry, I understand why, I was just looking at the visual effect! Murgatroyd49 (talk) 12:53, 28 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Who am I?[edit]

Apparenlty Big Brother. Slatersteven (talk) 15:03, 29 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Lol. Can you do the cat?? Martinevans123 (talk) 15:09, 29 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
How dare you the rumors are false (and there is a restraining order out anyway). Slatersteven (talk) 15:51, 29 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Huw am I?? (Warning: recycled joke from User:Ianmacm) Martinevans123 (talk) 15:57, 29 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The Popemobile[edit]

I'm just making a heavy-handed point to a new editor. Anna (talk) 15:22, 29 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I enjoyed it, anyway. Gambians are people too, you know! Martinevans123 (talk) 15:24, 29 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I'll stick with "Gambian school children" in future. For reference. Anna (talk) 15:32, 29 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Birth places in lead[edit]

Hi, just clarifying. Per MOS:BIRTHPLACE birth/death places are not put in the brackets with dates. Birth and death places, if known, should be mentioned in the body of the article, and can appear in the lead if relevant to notability, but not in the opening brackets alongside the birth and death dates. Executive zombie (talk) 15:29, 29 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Sounds entirely reasonable. Always great to see some useful trimming. Thanks. Martinevans123 (talk) 15:33, 29 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Glad to see we're not edit-warring...[edit]

over a packet of fags. I'm surprised that, by 2012, they could get away with heralding a packet of cigarettes as representing "20 years of quality"! ...lights another Malboro Gold and returns to task at hand. KJP1 (talk) 09:34, 30 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

"A good smoke at a fair price" (i.e. your lungs).... "No, you don't see many wild stallions any more." Martinevans123 (talk) 09:41, 30 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Martin - have to break off, as we're out to lunch. I need a way to make multiple references to the Stansfield article, but with different page numbers in each. I don't really want the article to appear multiple times in the Refs. I could do it if we were sfn, but we're not. Any ideas? KJP1 (talk) 11:51, 30 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, sfn would be the way to go, I guess. Article would need a slight overhaul? Martinevans123 (talk) 11:52, 30 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Well, they're all done now. If you had time to sfn it - as you say, the others would need doing to - that would be great. No worries if not, I'll put it on my To-Do list. Unless, any savvy TPSs know a better way to deal with multiple journal cites? KJP1 (talk) 16:52, 30 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Ok now? Martinevans123 (talk) 17:18, 30 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Muchas gracias - looks much better! Many thanks. KJP1 (talk) 17:24, 30 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
"No le gusta caminar, No puede montar a caballo, Cómo se puede bailar, Es un escándalo!" apologies, the only Spanish I can bring to mind.... Martinevans123 (talk) 17:27, 30 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Your edit here, Lady Park Wood National Nature Reserve, inspired me to create the above. I used to love running across that swingy bridge as a kid! KJP1 (talk) 10:30, 31 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Ah bless. Used to go hiking around there. Yes, very swingy, haha. Martinevans123 (talk) 10:38, 31 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Let's keep it clean, you two! --Tryptofish (talk) 22:16, 31 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I've already promised to show him my half hitches and lashings. Just leave KJP's woggle out of this, if you don't mind! Martinevans123 (talk) 22:43, 31 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
OK, I promise knot to do anything objectionable. --Tryptofish (talk) 22:47, 31 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
"She was only the scoutmaster's daughter, But couldn't she make a massive sheet bend!!" Hay thang-u!! etc. etc. Martinevans123 (talk) 22:58, 31 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
KJP1 came here looking for inspiration, but just found some lost souls. --That Fish Character
I come here to share some innocent childhood memories, and it's like a round of Innuendo Bingo! KJP1 (talk) 08:59, 1 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Ha, the lovely old Samantha (and good old Sven). Yes, I know, I blame that fish character. He's like the proverbial bad penny... Martinevans123 (talk) 09:26, 1 February 2024 (UTC) It's a case of "oh, ruddy Nora, not again!" And I don't mean that one. But it keeps me smiling lol.[reply]
It's all Martin's fault. And I have documents to prove it. --Tryptofish (talk) 01:02, 2 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I can assure all readers that this is a complete and utter tissue of lies and extreme fibs on stilts. Any more of this malarkey and I'll probably end up with the hives and the screaming abdabs!! Martinevans123 (talk) 14:02, 2 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
But at least your woggle will be OK. --Tryptofish (talk) 19:40, 2 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Hmmm. Not so sure about my wiggle... "It's A Wiggly Wiggly World." (... with special guest Rolf Harris!!!) Martinevans123 (talk) 22:05, 2 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I'm not so sure about it, either. But you can always fake it till you make it. --Tryptofish (talk) 00:03, 3 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Amelia Earhart[edit]

While following the recent news, I wonder if the Earhart article could use some clearing up to simplify the length or descriptions of events. The description of the main image is superfluous, saying "Earhart beneath the nose of her Lockheed Model 10-E Electra, March 1937 in Oakland, California, before departing on her final round-the-world attempt prior to her disappearance"; the words "before departing on her final round-the-world attempt prior to her disappearance" could be omitted as it would be very clear when the photo was taken and doesn't necessary relate to the vanishing as that was months away. The words "It is generally presumed that she and Noonan died somewhere in the Pacific during the circumnavigation, just three weeks prior to her fortieth birthday" are an odd placement to me, as in the event any of the theories (crash and sink or Gardner island castaway) are ever confirmed, it could be misleading, particularly if for the sake of argument, it is the castaway theory that is confirmed, it possible she would have lived to have seen her 40th birthday, if she had survived on Gardner for some time before perishing. Speaking of which, there is a possible article that could be used for the recent sonar discovery in which David Jourdan (himself a crash and sink theorist) cautions, "It is impossible to identify anything from a sonar image alone as sound can be tricky and the artifact could be damaged in unpredictable ways altering its shape. For that reason, you can never say that something is (or isn’t) from a sonar image alone,[1]~~ (talk) 22:17, 31 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I guess she might have had a caption premonition? Who knows....perhaps it was just a false alarm. And yes, very sad there was no cake. But your arguments all look pretty sound to me. [17] Martinevans123 (talk) 22:49, 31 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Amelia Earhart talk[edit]

I have taken my above paragraph to the Earhart talk page. It appears there is a discussion to split the article regarding the "vanishing" section. ~~ (talk) 17:07, 3 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for telling me. That's the best place for it! Martinevans123 (talk) 17:21, 3 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Phew, what an album.... "with songs that stick close to a vision of darkness, gloom, and noise." No-one else can really play like Thompson. He just seems to get better and better. "Her Love Was Meant for Me". Martinevans123 (talk) 20:23, 4 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

February music[edit]

story · music · places

My calendar story today is about Michael Herrmann celebrating his birthday. -- Gerda Arendt (talk) 23:17, 4 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Today I am happy about a singer on the Main page (at least for the first hours), after TFA the same day last year. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 15:32, 7 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks, Gerda. An interesting range. Martinevans123 (talk) 22:42, 7 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
you made my day ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 23:33, 7 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
And mine too, for proving my point. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 20:39, 8 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Well I am very glad to hear it! I had no idea, as I can honesty say... I am not really a Dedicated Follower of DYK! [18]. Martinevans123 (talk) 20:48, 8 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Which point, proved how? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 21:40, 8 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Here's the wonderful Planxty, featuring the amazing Liam O'Flynn (1945–2018): "The Jolly Beggar" (Child ballad 279). Martinevans123 (talk) 17:38, 9 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
thank you, some other day: Seiji Ozawa died, and I remember Haydn's Die Schöpfung, dress rehearsal in Tanglewood, as if it was yesterday. Kathleen Battle. Chorus all in white and singing from memory. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 17:47, 9 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Ah yes, three days ago. A famous family. Martinevans123 (talk) 17:50, 9 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
When I made today's story I was sure Alfred Grosser would appear on RD today, which may happen or not but I go to bed. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 23:30, 10 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks to Seiji Ozawa. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 22:00, 12 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
... and today a woman and her views --Gerda Arendt (talk) 22:07, 13 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Saw your name in the ITNN candidates, where I have (again) one lingering on the last day - could you check if you can support Rudolf Jansen? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 17:43, 19 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It wasn't me, honest. Just one of my socks with the same name... Martinevans123 (talk) 17:48, 19 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Now posted, I see. Martinevans123 (talk) 22:46, 19 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, 4 minutes before midnight. - The image, taken on a cemetery last year after the funeral of a distant but dear family member, commemorates today, with thanks for their achievements, four subjects mentioned on the Main page and Vami_IV, a friend here. Listen to music by Tchaikovsky (an article where one of the four is pictured), sung by today's subject (whose performance on stage I enjoyed two days ago). --Gerda Arendt (talk) 16:27, 20 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Listen to music from Ukraine if you like, - I heard it in 2022, and the November concert (at a different church) raised a truckload of winter clothes. My story today is also from my life: I heard the singer in 3 of the 4 mentioned musical items. I sang in yesterday's. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 10:49, 24 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks Gerda. Amazing singing. Martinevans123 (talk) 11:48, 24 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
They had to rearrange and adjust to the "cruel" situation of two altos and men, because many sopranos couldn't travel because there husbands were drafted and they had to serve the family. - Today's story celebrates a woman's birthday. She sat right in front of me when I took the picture at a lovely concert, celebrating her son's 60th. I thought she was 90 today, - no, 91 already. You can listen, starting at the piece he dedicated to her, Op. 1. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 22:29, 28 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
more music and flowers on Rossini's rare birthday --Gerda Arendt (talk) 15:44, 29 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks for explaining that about the cruel situation - it certainly worked out well. Ah yes, Rossini. You can't beat a bit of "shooting an apple off the head of your son Walter in a single attempt", can you. If he was alive today he'd only be 58! Martinevans123 (talk) 16:24, 29 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
;) - did you listen to the Kyrie with the rhythm that stays with you fo the rest of the day? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 08:53, 1 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Tin-foil hatter[edit]

Now, look where your seeking to engage with that tin-foil hatter on the Paula Vennels talkpage has got us to. They are now leaving Banning Notices on my Talkpage! Have you sorted your maths yet? KJP1 (talk) 12:53, 9 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Apologies, yes.... the contagion seems to be spreading. DYK..... that King Charles III is really a giant reptile? Yes, maths all sorted thanks. Martinevans123 (talk) 13:10, 9 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
A giant reptile, and in an illegitimate marriage. And me a sock puppet of Ghmyrtle. Who knew. KJP1 (talk) 13:24, 9 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I hear Windsor Register Office will do salamanders, on a Thursday, if you slip them a few quid. Martinevans123 (talk) 13:26, 9 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Nice usage of edit summary just now[edit]

I like it when folks swing their elbows widely. Thanks! BusterD (talk) 13:35, 9 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

That old Glasgow idiom springs to mind.... "ye cruisin' for a bruisin', laddie!" Martinevans123 (talk) 13:39, 9 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
You is.... rockin' like a Ninja, stingin' like a bee! (but don't quote me on that...) Martinevans123 (talk) 14:47, 9 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]


Whaaat?[19] Ceoil (talk) 14:11, 11 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I was in the middle of redrafting. I don't think the article is long enough to warrant that degree of duplication in the lead. Oh well, whatevs. Martinevans123 (talk) 14:22, 11 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Your right, but am working towards expanding the main body. As always, could really use your help here Martin. Ceoil (talk) 15:09, 11 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Gimme an hour or two, and then might ask for you egale eyes. ps, having been ispired during talk chit chat with Serial earlier this morning, myself and my brother bought tickers to see these Fall influenced merchants in London in mid march.[20]. Oh boy do I love one note music! Ceoil (talk) 15:10, 11 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
New to me. Are those gladiolis on the mic stand?? lol Martinevans123 (talk) 18:33, 11 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
An obv ref to Steven Patrick, which I think is nice. Ceoil (talk) 22:30, 11 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

RIP Damo[edit]

Damo Suzuki (16 January 1950 – 9 February 2024): "Spoon" (1971). Martinevans123 (talk) 20:16, 11 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Also "Paperhouse" from Beat-Club (also 1971).
Lets not forget poor Malcolm: Father cannot Yell, December 2017. Note the two bass players :) Ceoil (talk) 22:27, 11 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Best track on Ege Bamyasi? For me it's always "I'm So Green". A real groove. Martinevans123 (talk) 22:29, 12 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Only discovered this during the week Dizzy takes a while to get going but that is some seriously controlled funk. Maybe they didn't afterall completely loose it after Suzuki quit. Ceoil (talk) 00:29, 3 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Another favourite! At their best at that time, in my view. Soon Over Babaluma and Landed both great. Martinevans123 (talk) 09:11, 3 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Yerkes Observatory[edit]

Second-Largest refracting tele. Fact check lens size of Swedish 1-m Solar Tele —which is larger. Classact1000 (talk) 19:04, 12 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

You might want to ask at Talk:Yerkes Observatory? I've never seen that article before. Martinevans123 (talk) 19:11, 12 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

You can do these yourself, you know! KJP1 (talk) 08:35, 16 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Oooh... impressive! And well done. I won't even check it for coyvio. Martinevans123 (talk) 08:37, 16 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It could almost certainly do with a check for typos etc. It is also rather "thin". And it's a pity that we don't seem to have a photo of the Morgan Chapel. But it's a Start. KJP1 (talk) 08:41, 16 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I think it's a very good start! I'll try and make some tiny pedantic "improvements". Martinevans123 (talk) 08:42, 16 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Which reminds me, about five years ago!, we said we'd do something about Tredegar House. For one of Wales most important country houses, it's a pretty poor article. Shall put it back on the to-do list. KJP1 (talk) 09:12, 16 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

My present health state, and age (probably more the latter), means that I struggle to concentrate on matters for more than a few minutes. I wonder if you might have some interest in this outfit - if so, there has been a new, single purpose editor cutting a swathe through the article with editing comments such as "actual details incorrect and members incorrect . Incorrect place band formed , incorrect details how gee street was started incorrect description of band members".

I have not the time to investigate all those 'incorrect' amendments, but I did look long enough at Martin Strong's publication to note that he states the band formed in Clapham, not Brixton. Needless to say the editor does not supply any reference(s) to back up his claims. If you have the time and inclination, of course. Thanks - Derek R Bullamore (talk) 15:42, 17 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Hi Derek. I'll try and take a look. I see that Strong's The Great Rock Discography is available on line, but with no preview. But I see his 1996 The Wee Rock Discography also says Clapham. Martinevans123 (talk) 17:21, 17 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks for that. I should, perhaps, have made it clearer that I possess my own print copy of Strong's tome. So if you need to check anything there, I would be able to help. - Derek R Bullamore (talk) 18:54, 17 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Ah yes, I thought you might. By all means add a comment, if you want, to the Talk page thread, just to confirm it also says Clapham on page 935 of Strong (2000)? (I mean, this might be a POV thing, as Brixton and Clapham are right next to each other anyway? - it might have been at the Hope and Anchor, or anywhere on Acre Lane! Maybe Threesie has some ideas on that....?) But I think we can agree it wasn't in Nottingham. Martinevans123 (talk) 19:18, 17 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Nick seems to be a generally helpful editor, so maybe we can resolve some of his issues with the article. I suspect we may be short of WP:RS sources, that he will find frustrating. Martinevans123 (talk) 23:20, 17 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Quite probably. This is not the first time that I have had/witnessed correspondence with 'pop' musicians, but given the world of hype that they live in, they do seem to struggle with the notion of editing guidelines. Many thanks for your efforts so far. I have dug out Colin Larkin's The Virgin Encyclopedia of Popular Music - Concise Edition, pp. 1135/6, 1997 - ISBN 1-85227-745-9, which may prove useful moving forward, although I am loathe to make editing changes until and when Nick returns. The 'Concise Edition' is a misnomer - it weighs in excess of 6lb (don't know how much, as my wife's kitchen scales only go up that far) and makes my Collins English Dictionary look positively slimline. Regards, - Derek R Bullamore (talk) 19:58, 19 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
That sounds like a true heavyweight of a source. I wouldn't wait any longer than you want to. Nick has made it clear that he understands how editors work here. And, in any case, he said a month, but these rockstars have a habit of jetting off all over the shop, don't they. Martinevans123 (talk) 20:06, 19 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Yeah, they are rather prone to - although Nick is 63 now, surely a bit late to be "'aving it large" ?! Anyhow, just for an update, I have edited Stereo MC's as far as I intend to at this juncture. Also I have effected some changes at the associated articles for Gee Street Records, Cath Coffey (sister of Costa), and Brit Awards 1994. Do we now wait and see ? - Derek R Bullamore (talk) 21:02, 20 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Fair enough. I guess we can just wait, yes. Not Denise, then? Martinevans123 (talk) 21:14, 20 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

737 MAX Editorializing[edit]

Wrong venue
The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it.

Please examine the up-to-date information I have referenced in the talk page for the 737 MAX. It is factually incorrect in 2024 to imply that the Ethiopian and Indonesian crashes were purely caused by MCAS. Leaving out information that was discovered in the crash investigations and court cases does a disservice to readers. 2603:6080:5A07:C24C:2826:EC6A:8140:2117 (talk) 14:56, 19 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

You are edit warring, so I've added a warning to your talk page. If you persist, you are likely to be blocked. Regards. Martinevans123 (talk) 14:58, 19 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I really, really hope you see that it is wrong to block someone for simply trying to correct factually incorrect information. Please examine the information I have included in the talk page. 2603:6080:5A07:C24C:2826:EC6A:8140:2117 (talk) 14:59, 19 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
You have been invited to discuss your edits at Talk:Boeing 737 MAX. If you simply refuse, and continue to edit war, you'll be blocked. Possibly indefinitely. Thanks. Martinevans123 (talk) 15:02, 19 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I started the "Major Updates Needed" topic on the talk page 7 days ago. The information is there for you and other users to reference. It is publicly available information from official, reliable sources.
The sentence that you have continued to revert, "In 2019, the Boeing 737 MAX was grounded worldwide after a flight control system caused two new aircraft to crash..." is factually incorrect and my change to "In 2019, the Boeing 737 MAX was grounded worldwide after crashes..." simply removes the factually incorrect information. That requires no new source; the source referenced for that information is incorrect.
Please, please help correct the 737 MAX article to remove all instances of editorialization. 2603:6080:5A07:C24C:2826:EC6A:8140:2117 (talk) 15:10, 19 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
No, it's not factually incorrect, it's just a summary. If there had been no MCAS, these two crashes would not have happened and 346 people would not have died. You're meant to wait for consensus at the Talk page BEFORE you repeatedly restore your preferred wording in an article. Martinevans123 (talk) 15:18, 19 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Please, please examine the information I've referenced. I understand that many people feel very strongly about these particular crashes, but that should not override plain facts.
Both sets of pilots did not follow established standard procedures for a stabilizer trim runaway, this is fact. Investigations from the NTSB confirm that the pilots could have safely flown the planes, regardless of MCAS, if they had followed these procedures. 2603:6080:5A07:C24C:2826:EC6A:8140:2117 (talk) 15:32, 19 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Do you understand that the appropriate venue for discussion is Talk:Boeing 737 MAX, not here? Martinevans123 (talk) 15:34, 19 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I see you've now been blocked from Boeing 737 MAX. Martinevans123 (talk) 15:35, 19 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Heidegger edits[edit]

Hi @Martinevans123!

You recently restored chunks of a previous version of Martin Heidegger with the edit description "unexplained removal of sourced content". If you look back through the edit history, however, I think you will find that these are mostly my edits, and that I provided fairly detailed descriptions of non-trivial changes that I made as I proceeded piecemeal through the article (which is how I prefer to edit—in the interest of transparency and so that other editors can revert more selectively where they might disagree). At the same time, I was also active on the talk page with respect to any more general issues that other editors might wish to raise. It's always possible I made some bad calls, but I didn't just delete blocks of content without justification.

In view of this, would you kindly consider self-reverting? And to make your desired changes in a manner that is likewise easier to track? I don't have any strong vision for the article, and I think you'll find me a fairly easy-going collaborator if you intend to do more work on it (and it definitely does still need work—esp. post-BT!) I just find it hard to track what's being changed when so many changes are being made together in a single edit.

Cheers, Patrick J. Welsh (talk) 00:38, 21 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Hi @PatrickJWelsh, you mean this edit I made yesterday? Whoever that brand new anon IP was, they could have offered at least two edit summaries? Thanks. Martinevans123 (talk) 08:03, 21 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Mea culpa! I am even worse than I thought at interpreting diffs. I got to this through my watchlist and did not do my due diligence. You were reverting what I thought you were reinstating. That was the right call. I've reverted your self-revert with an edit description explaining that this was a misunderstanding, not a disagreement—and also inviting the IP editor to swing by the talk page if there are reasons to prefer the earlier version.
Thanks for being so gracious about this!
Cheers, Patrick J. Welsh (talk) 15:33, 21 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I must admit I was a bit bewildered. No worries. Martinevans123 (talk) 15:37, 21 February 2024 (UTC) "I wanted a woman, never bargained for you"![reply]

Lyndsay Hoyle (Speaker) lead[edit]

Hi, can you please explain why you removed important citation confirming 59 MPs have signed no confidence EDM in the lead? Please consider reinstating urgently. Thanks "The lead must conform to verifiability, biographies of living persons, and other policies. The verifiability policy states that all quotations, and any material whose verifiability has been challenged or is likely to be challenged, must include an inline citation to a reliable source that directly supports it." Jaymailsays (talk) 14:38, 22 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

As per my edit summary, it was in line with WP:LEADCITE. As this is a plain fact, I'm not sure it's controversial or contentious. The material is fully supported, with the same source, in the main body of the article. Martinevans123 (talk) 14:44, 22 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Who is likely to challenge a fact like that? Martinevans123 (talk) 14:45, 22 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Well, I was just about to challenge his date of birth but stopped when I saw that it had a handy cite in the lead!?! KJP1 (talk) 15:38, 22 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Errrrm. Well the source I removed still says "60 MPs sign no-confidence motion". So not the best source for this. Martinevans123 (talk) 15:46, 22 February 2024 (UTC) p.s. it's now 65, which is still only 10% of MPs. And there's no criterion level or agreed procedure for this. Someone would have to place another EDM asking for a vote of no confidence. Hoyle has already apologised to the house twice and he seems to have acted out of a very sincere fear that MPs are in danger of reprisals if they don't get an opportunity to have their say. A re-run of the debate is still a possibility[reply]
Sure - I wasn’t questioning the removal, just why somebody felt his DOB with a matter of sufficient controversy to warrant a cite in the lead. As to the shameful goings-on at Westminster, I think it’s pretty wounding for Hoyle. When was the last time a Speaker was faced with a No Confidence motion supported by 60+ MPs? Bercow? I don’t think even he faced that, and he was a hell of a lot less popular than Hoyle. KJP1 (talk) 18:56, 22 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I think a lot of editors add the source for date of birth to the opening line of the article to save putting it in the infobox. I tend to try and put it next to an entry in "Early life". Not sure what Wiki policy says about this. Yes, compared to Bercow, Hoyle is much more respected on both sides of the house. Ben Wallace tweeted: "I have served under three speakers. Lindsay Hoyle is head and shoulders above the rest. He is fair, kind and a protector of back benchers. He is not a bully nor a grandstander nor pompous. He has my full support." Martinevans123 (talk) 19:02, 22 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The date of birth should be cited in the body, then lead and infobox need no cite. Generally: The lead should only cite quotations and facts that only appear in the lead. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 08:51, 1 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

It's the time of the year[edit]

More leeks than the UK Border Force!!

For this and this. ♦IanMacM♦ (talk to me) 07:21, 1 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Ah! So THAT'S what's occurin'! Thanks for the reminder. Martinevans123 (talk) 08:08, 1 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I wonder if people meet Ruth Jones and are surprised to find that she doesn't look a bit like Nessa.--♦IanMacM♦ (talk to me) 13:25, 1 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I often sees er down the slots, but she just ruddy blanks me. Martinevans123 (talk) 15:25, 1 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Happy St David's Day, from Tony and I! KJP1 (talk) 16:34, 1 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
And about time, too! What took you so long? "Dydd Gŵyl Dewi Hapus", as they say in Ystradgynlais!! The cheque's in the post... Martinevans123 (talk) 17:06, 1 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Absolutely. Middle name David. Due St David's Day 1948, arrived 3 days early. Never happened since. Good to see the copyvio project is completed; largely thanks to KJP1. Tony Holkham (Talk) 16:38, 1 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you so much, Tony! (That £100 Ann Summers voucher is on it's way! I won't tell anyone, honest.) Martinevans123 (talk) 17:11, 1 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
How did you know? :o( Tony Holkham (Talk) 17:18, 1 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I don't know if leeks can be winnowed (probably not), but I'm happy to see that winnowing fan at KJP1's talk. Yippee! --Tryptofish (talk) 21:42, 1 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
You too could have enjoyed multiple discount vouchers for the top Oxford Street stores ... and a year's subscription to riveting current affairs podcasts. It's a bit late now!! But thanks, anyway. Martinevans123 (talk) 21:54, 1 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Contributor copyright investigation closed which has thankfully become Gerda's Floral News Stand![edit]

Hello, this is a notification that the Contributor Copyright Investigation (CCI) that was opened into you has been finished, and the relevant pages have been courtesy blanked by an administrator or clerk. Feel free to ask me if you have any questions. Sennecaster (Chat) 02:29, 2 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

KJP1 did about half of the checks on his own, so deserves special thanks. Martinevans123 (talk) 10:28, 2 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
story · music · places
What a relief! On Smetana's 200th birthday --Gerda Arendt (talk) 12:05, 2 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I'm glad to say it was a day earlier, on Saint David's Day! But I'm sure Smetana would have been over-joyed either way. Martinevans123 (talk) 14:42, 6 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
sun&clouds pics --Gerda Arendt (talk) 14:38, 6 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
in memory of the birthday of a friend who showed me art such as this, and of Vami --Gerda Arendt (talk) 13:40, 7 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
on vacation, have something sweet - DYK that I invented 2 comments per discussion? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 00:12, 12 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Sounds like a very good idea. Martinevans123 (talk) 16:15, 12 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you ;) - Rossini's Petite messe solennelle was premiered on 14 March 1864, - when I listen to the desolate Agnus Dei I think of Vami. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 22:43, 14 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Many thanks for the links, Gerda. Martinevans123 (talk) 08:44, 16 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Here's Luca Sestak with Solfeggietto. Martinevans123 (talk) 22:22, 16 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Where? - Today, my story is a piece dear to my heart, still in memory. When I sang it first, a friend was in the audience with her husband who knew he was to die soon. She played a tape from the performance for his funeral. I may have told you before. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 16:23, 19 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, I think you told me before. That's very touching. Martinevans123 (talk) 19:05, 19 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you! - I uploaded vacation pics (from back home), at least the first day, - and remember Aribert Reimann. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 19:56, 20 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Next day, around Porto da Cruz, on Bach's birthday --Gerda Arendt (talk) 21:13, 21 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Happy Birthday, JS! "Was mir behagt ist nur die muntre Jagd" (Ellen McAteer, soprano) Martinevans123 (talk) 21:40, 21 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
a few new pics, and two people for DYK --Gerda Arendt (talk) 21:30, 26 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
still a few more (same day), a calf in the mist and chocolate cake, and a story of collaboration - do you think Pollini is ready for RD? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 20:38, 27 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Pollini looks pretty polished to me. Here he is playing a Chopin nocturne. Just utterly wonderful. Martinevans123 (talk) 20:46, 27 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you, and also for your click to Easter. Good to see three in a row for RD that we nominated. I have two more noms open in case you want to support ;) - listening to the Passion - still moving four years later. 31 new pics. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 09:20, 29 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I listen to Bach's St John Passion today a second time, now with chorus. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 20:00, 29 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Last news here: 2 days later in time, a different music, - Happy Easter listening! --Gerda Arendt (talk) 20:25, 31 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

ITN recognition for Dave Myers (presenter)[edit]

On 2 March 2024, In the news was updated with an item that involved the article Dave Myers (presenter), which you updated. If you know of another recently created or updated article suitable for inclusion in ITN, please suggest it on the candidates page. PFHLai (talk) 21:02, 2 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you, PFHLai. Martinevans123 (talk) 21:59, 2 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Lord Lucan discussion[edit]

I don't know, given your helpful work on the various Savile articles, if you have done anything on the Lord Lucan case, but in light of a recent article that notes a new possibility that the wife may have been overlooked as a suspect, I wonder if you know how I should have phrased the paragraph about it, or how the article should reflect her version of events, which has generally been accepted as fact. I hasten to add I am not casting aspersions on the late Lady Lucan's character.~~ (talk) 20:43, 3 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Ah yes, the famous DJ and charity fundraiser, bless him. My "work" on the Savile articles has been quite minimal. If I ever edited anything at John Bingham, 7th Earl of Lucan, it must have been via one of my less successful sockpuppets, who has since vanished without trace. If I ever manage to see the connection between these two luminaries of British culture, I may even be tempted to have a look. Kind regards. Martinevans123 (talk) 20:58, 3 March 2024 (UTC) p.s. wasn't Lord Lucan stolen by the IRA?[reply]
also "vanished without trace" Wait, what? You were Lord Lucan all along? This is very disappointing Martin, but trilling too. Your the head off 1984 Freddie Mercury. Ceoil (talk) 23:56, 3 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Ok, yes, I admit it. Me and Freedie did used to swap hot tache tips. Martinevans123 (talk) 08:48, 4 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks for explaining, ps I loved you at Live Aid. Ceoil (talk) 23:37, 6 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, "Hammer to Fall" was a real hit, wasn't it. Martinevans123 (talk) 13:59, 7 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Its all the rage at the moment, so have declared your COI on the Queen talk page. Ceoil (talk) 15:40, 9 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks so much. Hopefully no one will ever notice. By the way, that deffo wasn't me editing, as the anon IP from Outer Mongolia, over there! Few people realise that I'm actually 89 these days.... Lucky 123 (talk) 10:50, 10 March 2024 (UTC)

Orphaned non-free image File:Lightnin Slim.jpg[edit]


Thanks for uploading File:Lightnin Slim.jpg. The image description page currently specifies that the image is non-free and may only be used on Wikipedia under a claim of fair use. However, the image is currently not used in any articles on Wikipedia. If the image was previously in an article, please go to the article and see why it was removed. You may add it back if you think that that will be useful. However, please note that images for which a replacement could be created are not acceptable for use on Wikipedia (see our policy for non-free media).

Note that any non-free images not used in any articles will be deleted after seven days, as described in section F5 of the criteria for speedy deletion. Thank you. --B-bot (talk) 18:31, 4 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Oi, B-bot! Just mind you own business! Martinevans123 (talk) 18:51, 4 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

CS1 error on Pigcasso[edit]

Hello, I'm Qwerfjkl (bot). I have automatically detected that this edit performed by you, on the page Pigcasso, may have introduced referencing errors. They are as follows:

  • A bare URL and missing title error. References show this error when they do not have a title. Please edit the article to add the appropriate title parameter to the reference. (Fix | Ask for help)

Please check this page and fix the errors highlighted. If you think this is a false positive, you can report it to my operator. Thanks, Qwerfjkl (bot) (talk) 21:45, 7 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Monmouthshire coast[edit]

Feel entirely free to add to this, extolling the superior quality of the arable land! The difficult bit is finding specifically Monmouthshire sources. Since the growth of Newport, both east and west, that tends to dominate, e.g. Newport Wetlands. I suspect it will also be a difficulty when describing the wildlife under Biodiversity. KJP1 (talk) 10:49, 9 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Nah. As you knows, I'm just a lowly Newport lad. Not one of you posh "Shire brigade". lol. Concrete jumble, nothing in order, not far from the border! [21] Martinevans123 (talk) 11:42, 9 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I've managed to drop in a mention of Tregrug Castle. I knew there was a purpose to your creating that article. KJP1 (talk) 13:09, 9 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It looked so nice in 1793! Needs a bit work now, though. Martinevans123 (talk) 13:22, 9 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

March 2024[edit]

Your addition to Murder of Brianna Ghey has been removed or altered, as it appears to closely paraphrase a copyrighted source. Limited close paraphrasing or quotation is appropriate within reason, so long as the material is clearly attributed in the text. However, longer paraphrases which are not attributed to their source may constitute copyright violation or plagiarism, and are not acceptable on Wikipedia. Such content cannot be hosted here for legal reasons; please do not post it on any page, even if you plan to fix it later. You may use external websites or printed material as a source of information, but not as a source of sentences. This part is crucial: say it in your own words.

If you own the copyright to the text, and you want to allow Wikipedia to use it — which means allowing other people to modify it — then you must verify that externally by one of the processes explained at Wikipedia:Donating copyrighted materials. If you are not the owner of the copyright but have permission from that owner, see Wikipedia:Requesting copyright permission. Wikipedia takes copyright violations very seriously and persistent violators will be blocked from editing. Please do not restore text that contains a copyvio/CLOP issue to an article without change. Sideswipe9th (talk) 22:43, 11 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

And how would you rephrase that exactly, without changing the meaning? 22 of those 48 words are in quotes. And what is the purpose of this template warning? You think I'm unaware of your revert, when I have already responded at the article? Martinevans123 (talk) 22:46, 11 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It seems another editor was able to do it just fine. Restoring a copyvio after it's been removed, and was clearly marked as a copyvio in the edit summary without any modification whatsoever is disruptive. Sideswipe9th (talk) 22:50, 11 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I do not regard the original material as "a copyvio". Pasting a huge template warning here, without even suggesting or attempting a re-write is also "disruptive". What's the point of such petty scolding? Martinevans123 (talk) 22:54, 11 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I did regard it as a close paraphrase, as did a couple of CCI editors that I reached out to privately. WP:CV is pretty clear that when you're dealing with a copyvio on partial page content, you revert or otherwise remove the violating text. The person making the removal does not have to re-write it. Sideswipe9th (talk) 23:00, 11 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
You "reached out to a couple of CCI editors privately"? Thanks so much for your private diligence. Martinevans123 (talk) 23:03, 11 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, I reached out to a couple of the editors who have a great deal of experience in handling copyright issues at WP:CCI, as I wanted a second opinion on whether or not it constituted CLOP. After they confirmed that it was, I acted in accordance with the copyvio policy. Sideswipe9th (talk) 23:06, 11 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Please pass on my thanks to your private experts. Martinevans123 (talk) 23:10, 11 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
(edit conflict) I've looked very carefully at the edits, and at the cited source. Honestly, it would not have occurred to me that this edit was an issue, and I'm trying to be very sensitive to close paraphrasing issues. Having direct quotes from those people, presented as direct quotes, is not a problem. What I could agree with to some extent is that, in the first sentence, the two direct quotes also come from a single sentence in the source, although the source does not connect them via the phrase "and that she had shown". The source says: "who had shown". I'm not too bothered by the words "had shown". But I suppose that's it. --Tryptofish (talk) 22:57, 11 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The issue is that the quotes were presented in the exact same order, with the exact same juxtaposition as the source article. Some of that could have been summarised while being left attributed, as was done by another editor. Or other quotations and different juxtaposition from the source could have been used. Sideswipe9th (talk) 23:02, 11 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Presenting quotes in the "exact same order" is copyvio now? I see. Perhaps you'd like to test this one over at AN/I or something, just to to be sure? Martinevans123 (talk) 23:05, 11 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, close paraphrasing is a copyvio issue. If you want to go to ANI over this, we can, but I consider the immediate issue resolved and think it would be unnecessary. Sideswipe9th (talk) 23:11, 11 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Well, you know, an AN/I mountain always tends to get more eyes than a simple molehill. It's the bit about "Presenting quotes in the "exact same order" as the source" that I can't quite get my head around. It might be a public service for editors on the brink of a block for copyvio? Martinevans123 (talk) 23:16, 11 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
If you're concerned about avoiding this type of issue in the future, perhaps a discussion at WT:CCI or WT:CP might be more fruitful? The editors who watchlist those talk pages are those most likely to be able to give you good advice on avoiding this issue, as they are the experts in handling this type of problem. Sideswipe9th (talk) 23:25, 11 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Will they give me good advice or just slap a big template on my talk page? Thanks. Martinevans123 (talk) 23:27, 11 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I suspect if you started the discussion something like "Hey, an issue came up recently where another editor warned me about adding and restoring a close paraphrase copyvio to an article. Is there any advice you can give me for avoiding CLOP issues in the future?" then I suspect they will give you good advice. The only thing the CCI editors want to see happen is for people to stop adding copyvios to articles. An easy way to prevent that from experienced editors like all of us present in this discussion is to provide you some educational resources so you can learn how to not make the same mistake in the future. That way everyone wins, Wikipedia keeps a productive editor, and the number of copyvios decreases over time. Sideswipe9th (talk) 23:39, 11 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
(edit conflict) There's also that the quotes were "with the exact same juxtaposition", which I see as more to the point than simply the order in which they appeared. I can agree with that criticism, to some extent. The authors of the source chose to present the two quotes together in that particular way, and it can be argued that you copied that choice. Not block-worthy in my opinion. But something that I hope you can learn from, in terms of good writing style. --Tryptofish (talk) 23:27, 11 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Ah yes, what do original journalists know, heh? We have to try and improve on their choices? Martinevans123 (talk) 23:30, 11 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It's not about improving on their choices. It's about not copying their choices, improvement or not. --Tryptofish (talk) 23:37, 11 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
And if one considers their choices convey exactly the meaning intended? Martinevans123 (talk) 23:42, 11 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
FFF conveyed the exact meaning, without copying the way that the authors chose to convey it. --Tryptofish (talk) 23:47, 11 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I'm no longer sure about that. The authors chose to use exact quotes. I think FFF's edit was an improvement as it was more succinct. Martinevans123 (talk) 23:50, 11 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I'm trying to make a point, one that I am sure of, that isn't simply about being more succinct, although being more succinct is, indeed, a good thing. It's that the choice that the source authors made about juxtaposing two quotes was a sort of "intellectual property". It's not about the meaning of the quotes, either separately or together. It's about one possible choice, out of many other possible choices, of how to present the two quotes. FFF did write in a more succinct way, but also preserved the meaning without copying that one particular choice. --Tryptofish (talk) 00:06, 12 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
(edit conflict) That's essentially the issue that I identified. I see it more as a matter of sloppy writing, than of copyvio. It wasn't so much close paraphrasing, as paraphrasing that could have been less close, as it were. I agree that Martin should not have reverted. I also think that your warning here was needlessly confrontational. You could have just as well explained in your own words (irony of my using that phrase duly noted) why you felt that it was a bad edit. --Tryptofish (talk) 23:09, 11 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Perhaps we can devise an even larger template waring for "sloppy writing, that's not quite copyvio"...private expert advice permitting, of course. Martinevans123 (talk) 23:12, 11 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
WP:TROUT. --Tryptofish (talk) 23:17, 11 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
To be honest, I prefer the templated options like this, as they typically explain the underlying issue and reference relevant policies and guidelines in a far more direct manner. I find the clarity helps in situations like this, as the templates tend to be unambiguous.
Now had Martin left a message on my talk page, or the article talk page after the first removal, I'd have been happy to explain it there without having to issue a warning. However his first action was to restore the text unmodified. Even leaving aside the fact that Murder of Brianna Ghey is a double CTOP article, when the reversion it crossed the line into being warning worthy. So I issued the appropriate warning for the circumstances. Sideswipe9th (talk) 23:17, 11 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Martin's very sorry he didn't leave a message on your talk page, perhaps he was too busy responding here. So it's a "double CTOP article"? There may be a few watchers here would might like a further explanation on that? Thanks. Martinevans123 (talk) 23:23, 11 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The issue is not that you're responding here, I'm happy that you are responding here. The issue is that the first action you took after I removed the text was to restore it without modification. Check the timeline of the edits, I removed the content at 22:28 (UTC), you restored it twelve minutes later at 22:40 (UTC), and I issued the warning here three minutes later at 22:43 (UTC). You can't have been too busy responding here at the time you made the revert at 22:40, as the warning and this discussion didn't start until 3 minutes later. At 22:40, you could have started a discussion either on the article talk page, or my talk page, but you didn't. You chose to restore a copyright violation.
So it's a "double CTOP article"? Yes, as can be seen in the talk page banners on Talk:Murder of Brianna Ghey, the article is covered by both WP:GENSEX and WP:BLP. Sideswipe9th (talk) 23:33, 11 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
How do WP:GENSEX and WP:BLP relate to my edit? Thanks. Martinevans123 (talk) 23:38, 11 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
They apply to all edits to that page. CTOP require editors to hold themselves to, arguably, higher standards than at pages in general. In this case, the main issue is that you reverted the revert, instead of asking for clarification of why you were reverted. --Tryptofish (talk) 23:42, 11 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I'm all for higher standards, but I'm really not sure how WP:GENSEX and WP:BLP are directly involved in that quote. I would have thought that to satisfy BLP, an edit would need to follow the original quoted speech as closely as possible. Martinevans123 (talk) 23:54, 11 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
They aren't directly involved in those quotes, but they don't have to be. Those editing restrictions are defined by the topic areas, but they apply to all edits on the page, because the page falls within those topic areas. That's the way these things work. In "contentious topics", editor conduct is held to a high standard (that's different than saying that writing style is held to a high standard), regardless of whether the individual edit was about those topics directly. That's just how this works.
You raise a point that's well-worth examining here, in terms of whether fidelity to the BLP policy requires direct quotes instead of summaries. It doesn't, so "an edit would need to follow... " is not true. What needs to happen is that the edit should not misrepresent what the living person said or believes. That's not the same thing as quoting them word-for-word. FFF's edit correctly represents what was said, without needing to quote it directly. But I'm glad that you raised the issue, because it's a frequent source of misunderstanding about proper and improper paraphrasing. --Tryptofish (talk) 00:18, 12 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
When editing an article covered by one or more CTOPs, you need to be very careful that your contributions are policy and guideline compliant. Tensions on these types of articles tend to be fraught at the best of times, as they are often dealing with highly contentious topic matter. Whenever content you add to an article is reverted by an editor in good faith, even if you fundamentally disagree with that reason, the best option is always to start a talk page discussion. Maybe the person who reverted you made an error as we're all (hopefully) only human, maybe they had reasons you don't understand or an understanding of a policy or guideline you weren't aware of, or maybe there's a consensus against a certain piece of content appearing in an article. Regardless of the cause, the best option is to start a talk page discussion, and not immediately restore the challenged content. Sideswipe9th (talk) 23:45, 11 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Sorry, I don't regard it as a copyright violation. Martinevans123 (talk) 23:47, 11 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Neither do it, but reverting a revert under CTOPs is best avoided. Fraught tensions, yes, indeed. Sigh. --Tryptofish (talk) 23:52, 11 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]