User talk:DoubleGrazing/Archive 30

This is an archive of past discussions with User:DoubleGrazing. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page.

Archive 25

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Archive 28

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Melissa Powers Draft

I updated the draft and added in the proper sourcing as required. What is the next step for resubmission? SGC101009 (talk) 15:19, 30 November 2023 (UTC)

@SGC101009: I was going to say just click the blue 'resubmit' button, but it seems to have mysteriously gone AWOL. I can submit this on your behalf, if you want? -- DoubleGrazing (talk) 15:28, 30 November 2023 (UTC)

Please do! But before doing so... does this draft appear to be in line with requirements? I've worked hard to make sure it is quality and backed up properly SGC101009 (talk) 15:33, 30 November 2023 (UTC)

@SGC101009: the inline citations are there, so that's okay. It's then a question of whether the sources are enough to establish notability per WP:GNG. I would have to review it to give my verdict, but I'll just submit it and someone will pick it up soon. We have hardly any review backlog, so it should be only a matter of days before this is done. -- DoubleGrazing (talk) 15:39, 30 November 2023 (UTC)

Excellent, thank you! I appreciate your help in this process! SGC101009 (talk) 15:41, 30 November 2023 (UTC)

Unchartered territory and the role of wikipedia

In reference to the page RARPEPESS, I am afraid but it requires the operators to be able to understand the importance of the information in the context of a relatively new discipline - history of digital art. in the citation link I provided a link to a page where there is a never seen before timeline of nfts https://time.graphics/line/858561, where a human reader can clearly see where the asset in question stands in history of nfts. Nothing else around on the subject yet. Please revise your review and/or put a tag in the article mentioning it. NftHistorian (talk) 08:20, 2 December 2023 (UTC)

@NftHistorian: you may have misunderstood the purpose of Wikipedia. We are never the first source to report on something new and emerging, or even an early source. We only summarise what reliable published sources have previously said. Thence it follows that if, as you say, there is "Nothing else around on the subject yet", then it isn't possible to summarise such sources, and consequently isn't possible to publish a Wikipedia article on the subject at this time. -- DoubleGrazing (talk) 08:51, 2 December 2023 (UTC)

so if you do so, LEARN HOW TO READ DIAGRAMS. NftHistorian (talk) 15:28, 2 December 2023 (UTC)

even a spastic could see it https://time.graphics/line/858561 NftHistorian (talk) 15:29, 2 December 2023 (UTC)

@NftHistorian: insults are unlikely to get you what you want. -- DoubleGrazing (talk) 15:37, 2 December 2023 (UTC)

i dont do insults, i do hyperbole. you should have checked to reassure yourself you are not such. nvm this place is full of fake news. NftHistorian (talk) 16:35, 2 December 2023 (UTC)

Editor experience invitation

Hi DoubleGrazing :) I'm looking for people to interview here. Feel free to pass if you're not interested. Clovermoss🍀 (talk) 10:19, 2 December 2023 (UTC)

emirates auction page

hi DoubleGrazing

I want publish article to my company, actually we have 32 branch in uae and have 4 records in Guinness world records, more than 100 Newspaper like Blomberg, the national news, Khaleej times, gulf news.

my article have more than point speaking in topic relevant with Wikipedia audience.

thanks Mohamed fayed eissa2050 (talk) 11:44, 4 December 2023 (UTC)

Your decline decision for the school in Turkey

Hi! Regarding the decline decision for Draft:İstiklal_Makzume_Anadolu_Lisesi : do you think this high school is inherently not notable, or was it the status of the draft when you reviewed? Any feedback for the current draft would be appreciated. Gorkem80 (talk) 07:13, 5 December 2023 (UTC)

@Gorkem80: I couldn't say if it's inherently anything; depends on the sources whether they can establish notability per WP:GNG. -- DoubleGrazing (talk) 07:26, 5 December 2023 (UTC)

Question from SueoftheAntipodes (13:37, 6 December 2023)

Dear DoubleGrazing, I have just spent two snowed in weeks carefully preparing and sourcing some updated material for the Nick Kyrgios WP entry as explained before. Yesterday I spent a lot of time exchanging bits and using new resources. Each time I gave a detailed explanation as to what I did and why, with resources for each change/deletion. Many were entirely outdated in the section where the page editor has requested help in summarising and making material more in line with encyclopedic tone. So I did that. This included deleting sections in "Current Public Perception' (a section which no other sportsperson has) which date from 2015 to 2019. Surely this is not current? Last night TechnoSquirrel69 reverted all my careful changes without reading them. This is very discouraging. I had changed some headings from negatives like 'Clay court absence' to 'First Australian title' which happened in the same year. TechnoSquirrel69 reverted that! I have contacted her/him but he does not think I have given reasons for my changes. What can a volunteer do? Should I just give in? I was extremely careful and thorough. --SueoftheAntipodes (talk) 13:37, 6 December 2023 (UTC)

Hi @SueoftheAntipodes: I haven't looked at your latest edits, nor would I know why TechnoSquirrel69 might have reverted them; I will have to leave that between you two to discuss. I can only repeat my earlier advice to try to seek consensus on the article talk page. And if that isn't going anywhere, then at some point you may just have to drop the stick and move on to other things. Other than such generalities, I don't feel able to add much here, as I've no knowledge of, or interest in, tennis, let alone any individual player, and wouldn't be able to take an informed view of whether the article in question is or isn't biased, or does or doesn't need updating. Sorry, -- DoubleGrazing (talk) 08:07, 7 December 2023 (UTC)

I do apologise. Shall not bother you further. It's just that you were assigned as my 'mentor'. I now have one volunteer on the talk page who is replying. Nobody else on the talk page is interested! I will try some very slow edits. SueoftheAntipodes (talk) SueoftheAntipodes (talk) 13:59, 7 December 2023 (UTC)

@SueoftheAntipodes: no need to apologise, and I'm still happy to help with general advice where I can; I'm just saying that this subject matter is not familiar to me, and in any case the whole thing seems like an ongoing content dispute, and for both those reasons I don't want to wade into it as I would probably end up making matters worse! :)

Hope you make progress with whoever is now engaging with you on the talk page. -- DoubleGrazing (talk) 14:45, 7 December 2023 (UTC)

thanks. No it's not really a content dispute. There were a lot of people contributing until about 2019 when Kyrgios was behaving very badly for a sportsman after which nobody bothered. What I think I did wrong was try to summarise and reduce by deleting paragraphs which are no longer applicable. So the number of paragraph deletions caught the eye of technosquirrel who (understandably) reverted them. WP can't have just anybody inserting or deleting large swathes of material at will. As a newbie, one sentence a day is better for me! Am I right as a general rule?SueoftheAntipodes (talk) 15:00, 7 December 2023 (UTC)

@SueoftheAntipodes: yes, large edits can be problematic, firstly in that they are likely to attract more attention, and secondly in that they inherenly look more suspect. And when someone looks at what you've done, even if they disagree with only one small part of it and actually agree with the rest, they may just revert the whole thing rather than starting to edit your edit. -- DoubleGrazing (talk) 16:16, 7 December 2023 (UTC)

1234

Hi DoubleGrazing -- Thanks for the note. I still don't think it was intended by the creator as a test? There's a lot of stuff in draftspace that isn't suitable for mainspace but doesn't fit with any speedy criteria. Cheers, Espresso Addict (talk) 07:52, 7 December 2023 (UTC)

Okay @Espresso Addict, no worries. :) -- DoubleGrazing (talk) 07:57, 7 December 2023 (UTC)

exact correction

exact correction to my article please Kongunadnursing (talk) 11:26, 8 December 2023 (UTC)

InZOI

If that is true, then why dont you delete the articles for Paralives and Life by You, both upcoming and unreleased games that have little more information than what has been for InZOI. And both of which havent been able to be reviewed by independant sources. so why do those games get articles and this one doesnt? delete all game articles that havent been released if that is the case. the knowledge of the game has been around for about a month, is that really not good enough? i can minimise the information for it to purely be the most minimalistic but definitely 100 reliable, down to a few sentences, but wouldnt that be a stub or something? Loftt 01 (talk) 11:32, 8 December 2023 (UTC)

@Loftt 01: I've no interest in going around looking for articles on unreleased games and nominating them for deletion. If you have such an interest, go for it. Either way, see WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS.

You need to write the draft by summarising what independent and reliable sources have said, citing those sources as you go. If that results in only a short stub, then so be it. And if you cannot find sufficient sources to summarise, then you cannot have an article published at this time. Ultimately, it's that simple. -- DoubleGrazing (talk) 11:38, 8 December 2023 (UTC)

Schloss Saxental

Dear DoubleGrazing,

Thank you for your comments on my article on Schloss Saxental. Many of the reference given in the article are evidence for information in more than one paragraph. If you read the references in detail (in English translation if required) you will see that the key assertions of the article can be found there. As refers to offline resources I could provide you with copies of the texts from books. How can I send files to you?

Regards,

beamtothefuture Beamtothefuture (talk) 15:33, 8 December 2023 (UTC)

Courtesy link: Draft:Schloss Saxental

@Beamtothefuture: that's fine, you can use the same source to support more than one piece of information, but you do have to cite it each time; it shouldn't be up to the reviewer, or indeed later on a reader, to plough through all the sources to see which one supports a particular statement in the article. The best way to do this is to use what's known as named references, see WP:NAMEDREFS, which groups all the citations of a given source together against a single footnote.

As for offline sources, you do not need to, indeed cannot, send me or anyone else copies of the sources. You simply need to cite the source with complete details, as advised in WP:OFFLINE. Best, -- DoubleGrazing (talk) 15:53, 8 December 2023 (UTC)

A Heads Up

On the AFCHD you answered a plea by an alpahabet soup editor on their rejected draft. Since it identified a minor child it would have been worth going to the cv-revdel chat and alerting an oversighter. I did so and it has been overnighted.I have the link among all sorts of info on my user page if you need it. 🇺🇦 Fiddle^Timtrent Faddle^Talk to me 🇺🇦 13:35, 9 December 2023 (UTC)

@Timtrent: that faintly rings a bell, I think I know the one you mean. Oversight on my part. Thanks for picking up the slack, du... pal. :) -- DoubleGrazing (talk) 13:58, 9 December 2023 (UTC)

http://en.wiki.x.io/wiki/Draft:Scott_Liddell

Just a line to say thanks for the comment/feedback. Much appreciated. StuartDouglas (talk) 11:39, 10 December 2023 (UTC)

K. Annamalai (politician)

I think this should go to Afd once more. He is a president of state unit from BJP, and there are sources talking about him in particular. zoglophie^•talk• 11:35, 11 December 2023 (UTC)

Thanks for pinging. They both are politicians from different era. Maybe the title should be moved from K. Annamalai (politician) to K. Annamalai (politician, born 1984). Or,

A disambiguation page for K. Annamalai. zoglophie^•talk• 11:38, 11 December 2023 (UTC)

@Zoglophie: I know there are two people by the same name. The other one, K. Annamalai, is notable as MLA under NPOL. This one, K. Annamalai (politician) (and goodness knows how many other variations of that name/title) is not MLA, and is what's causing all this trouble. The AfD and deletion review I pointed to on the talk page refers to the latter. -- DoubleGrazing (talk) 11:44, 11 December 2023 (UTC)

Question from SueoftheAntipodes (19:55, 12 December 2023)

Hi again. I think I've been blocked from editing because they think I am 'emotionally involved'. Hopefully someone else will do some updating on Kyrgios's page. Don't mind if it's not me! I added 'and December' and they said it was unsourced. I said 'Clay Season Absence' was incorrect as Kyrgios won a title that year which is on the ATP website but they said I was writing emotional rubbish. I added a 90 minute podcast by Jay Shetty on Kyrgios which was seen by millions but they said it was emotional rubbish. So It's not surprising that there's nothing since 2019. Writing anything at all is counted as emotional rubbish! thanks anyway. Sue. PS - I'm a grandmother of 75 and have time to spare. My family have always been involved in sport. Just thought it was an interesting project. My husband was looking up AS Byatt. He's a writer too. --SueoftheAntipodes (talk) 19:55, 12 December 2023 (UTC)

@SueoftheAntipodes: no, you haven't been blocked, but you have been issued with a final warning, which suggests you may be blocked soon if you continue doing whatever it was that triggered the warning. -- DoubleGrazing (talk) 10:28, 15 December 2023 (UTC)

thanks. They have not explained what I did wrong except to infer that I am 'emotionally involved'. Hopefully someone else will eventually pick up on the fact that Kyrgios has had wrist surgery that will keep him out of competition for six months. that's a fact, not an emotion! Also that he made a podcast indicating retirement last week. 100,000 viewers and every media outlet in the world saw and reported on that. I thought it was worth including. Perhaps Wikipedia should warn its volunteers that updated knowledge of their subject will be interpreted as 'emotional involvement'. The section on Mental Health issues has now been reduced to a few dubious podcasts and 'Ladbible' which is scarcely reputable! I had included material with multiple references. ?emotionally involved? SueoftheAntipodes (talk) 13:29, 15 December 2023 (UTC)

Ayvianna Snow article http://en.wiki.x.io/wiki/Draft:Ayvianna_Snow

Thank you so much for your feedback on my article. Would you mind telling me which of my cited sources you find unreliable? I have removed the Daily Star and The Sun as I have now realised they are deprecated sources. Could you tell me what else has to go please? Thanks!

Draft:Ayvianna Snow Ferry66 (talk) 15:39, 13 December 2023 (UTC)

Hi @Ferry66: that's correct, those two are indeed deprecated.

Other than them, anything user-generated is generally regarded as unreliable. In your draft this means IMDb (see WP:IMDB) and YouTube. (YT can be reliable, if the content is the official, un-doctored video from a media outlet that is itself considered reliable, say the BBC etc.)

There is also a slight question mark against The Mirror (see WP:DAILYMIRROR), but personally I tend to treat that as reliable, unless the specific article or the writer gives me particular reason to think otherwise.

HTH, -- DoubleGrazing (talk) 16:07, 13 December 2023 (UTC)

Draft:Hermann Paul Max (Paul) Haase

How many reliable sources are required? Prolete (talk) 10:18, 15 December 2023 (UTC)

@Prolete: for establishing notability by WP:GNG, we usually require three sources that meet the standard described in that guideline. Plus as many sources and citations as are required to support the contents in the draft/article. -- DoubleGrazing (talk) 10:22, 15 December 2023 (UTC)

I now have four references from reliable media and institutions on the draft article about Hermann Paul Max (Paul) Haase, which should be titled Paul Haase (posting the full link results in a mess, sorry for that) plus the original sources from the Dutch Wikipedia which I put in External links. Could the article now be included or do I have to ask elsewhere? It's hard to find more online as the subject died many decades before the World Wide Web was invented. Prolete (talk) 10:39, 15 December 2023 (UTC)

@Prolete: just to be clear, each of the sources that you're relying on to establish notability must be reliable and independent, and provide significant coverage of the subject, and be secondary sources (newspapers, magazines, books, TV or radio programmes, etc.). It doesn't look like any of the four you're citing meets that standard. (If any of the three external sources do, then please cite them as references, rather than merely listing in the EL section.)

Whenever you think you've met the notability and referencing requirements, you can click on the 'resubmit' button to send the draft for another review. -- DoubleGrazing (talk) 10:54, 15 December 2023 (UTC)

Well, as I said it is hard to find sources online. Haase died in 1906, I don't think there were radio and TV programmes during his lifetime and books and magazines will lie in dusty libraries and archives somewhere. Prolete (talk) 11:10, 15 December 2023 (UTC)

@Prolete: sources don't have to be online; offline sources are perfectly acceptable as long as they otherwise meet the required standard. -- DoubleGrazing (talk) 11:25, 15 December 2023 (UTC)

Ok then it's a question of finding them. BTW I checked, voice radio programmes only became possible when the vacuum tube was invented in 1906, Haase's year of death and TV wasn't invented until the 1920s so it will have to be books, newspapers and magazines. Prolete (talk) 11:58, 15 December 2023 (UTC)

Page Review!

Hi @DoubleGrazing can you please look into this Draft VJ Sunny and suggest me the changes for the page creation! Mr.shaikmeer (talk) 14:32, 15 December 2023 (UTC)

@Mr.shaikmeer: no, as I said already, it will be reviewed in due course, you don't need to recruit reviewers, someone will take a look at it sooner or later. -- DoubleGrazing (talk) 14:40, 15 December 2023 (UTC)

Draft:Suraj Goswami

Hello, DoubleGrazing,

I deleted this draft you tagged for CSD speedy deletion but I noticed that the draft creator didn't receive a notification explaining why the draft was going to be deleted. You used Twinkle to tag the page, which is great, so I think there must be a problem with your Twinkle Preferences. Please be sure a) the "Notify page creator" box is checked off and b) all of the CSD criteria boxes were checked off as well. That should help this problem. Thank you. 07:03, 16 December 2023 (UTC)

Notification seems to have gone to User talk:2409:40D1:18:2621:4509:CA06:E0DE:783F. --DoubleGrazing (talk) 07:08, 16 December 2023 (UTC)

Draft: Kunchaikutty Pillai

Hello, DoubleGrazing,

http://en.wiki.x.io/wiki/Draft:KunchaiKuttyPilla_Sarvadhikaryakkar

Thank you for your review of the above submission, Yes, it is hard to find documentation on this subject (other than word of mouth passed down generations) - I will try again when I visit India next year.

BTW, here is a link to a another historic figure of the same era (with only one reference) http://en.wiki.x.io/wiki/Edachena_Kunkan

No offense, but may be it is better if someone else reviews when I submit a new draft next year. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Sankarnair2 (talk • contribs) 15:38, 17 December 2023 (UTC)

Thanks again.

Sankarnair2 (talk) 18:21, 16 December 2023 (UTC)

Milkshake spam

that was getting ridiculous. Was glad to have found the source of one, so we can hopefully save ourselves six days. Star Mississippi 19:15, 16 December 2023 (UTC)

@Star Mississippi: oh good, phew! I tried to look around, but after a dinner and a drink or three, my mind turns to molasses... -- DoubleGrazing (talk) 19:18, 16 December 2023 (UTC)

special assist to @Deepfriedokra too. let's hope there are no okra molasses milkshakes on the menu though! Star Mississippi 19:26, 16 December 2023 (UTC)

@Star Mississippi: ha, thank you for curing my chronic deep fried okra cravings! Now I can just think of okra molasses milkshake instead, which sounds considerably less moreish. :) DoubleGrazing (talk) 19:32, 16 December 2023 (UTC)

hah! Glad to be of service.

I'm also pretty sure our friend is a sock, albeit not NickJr_Fanon2021 (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) and I'm otherwise not up to speed with the children's programming socks. I suppose they'll out themselves soon enough. Star Mississippi 19:42, 16 December 2023 (UTC)

@Star Mississippi Oh? That's the account I automatically assumed was the master, but if you say not... -- DoubleGrazing (talk) 20:05, 16 December 2023 (UTC)

make them stop -- Deepfriedokra (talk) 20:08, 16 December 2023 (UTC)

I didn't see enough overlap, but I could well be wrong. There are just so many per Wikipedia:Sockpuppet_investigations/NickJr_Fanon2021/Archive#30 December 2022. Perhaps @Mz7 can guide us. I'm stepping offline for a bit, so it's someone else's turn to play whack a sock. Gets out the holiday stress! Star Mississippi 20:12, 16 December 2023 (UTC)

@Star Mississippi: I'm not familiar with any milkshake spam. Which accounts are talking about here? Mz7 (talk) 22:43, 17 December 2023 (UTC)

Apologies for no link @Mz7. It was Hashim10 (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) who I ultimately just blocked for spam since I didn't see enough for an SPI. Thank you for the response! Star Mississippi 22:55, 17 December 2023 (UTC)

No worries. I took a look, and I think I agree with you that it doesn't look like NickJr Fanon2021 behaviorally. Absent some kind of other behavioral pattern that can connect this with another sockmaster, I'm not sure there's much we can do here. Now that Hashim10 is blocked, if we start to see more of this milkshake spam from some other account, we will know who it is then. Mz7 (talk) 23:11, 17 December 2023 (UTC)

Thank you! Appreciate the eyes and the time. Have a great evening. Star Mississippi 23:37, 17 December 2023 (UTC)

Question from MyUniqueUsername123 (23:17, 16 December 2023)

ok --MyUniqueUsername123 (talk) 23:17, 16 December 2023 (UTC)

Regarding Comment on Draft Rabinarayan Acharya

Respected Sir, In your comment you have mentioned that that Rabinarayan Acharya is a director. He is not Director. He is DIRECTOR GENERAL or DG in the Public Sector. He is not a business man. And the publication is a Government of India Publication as CCRAS is an autonomous body of https://en.m.wiki.x.io/wiki/Ministry_of_Ayush

Ministry of AYUSH, Government of India Apart from that, 6-7 reliable sources are also added which clearly justify that he is DIRECTOR GENERAL of CCRAS.Moreover a Director General is next to Cabinet Minister of Ministry of AYUSH, Government . Moreover it is also noticed that the article of Secretary of Ministry of AYUSH is in the main space of Wikipedia (Rajesh Kotecha ) . If so how could the Director General( Director general) become irrelevant for a Wikipedia article. Sir, Request for consideration please Neelesh Pandiyath (talk) 17:12, 19 December 2023 (UTC)

Sorry, I've no idea what you're asking from me? -- DoubleGrazing (talk) 19:37, 19 December 2023 (UTC)

Request on 19:32:30, 19 December 2023 for assistance on AfC submission by Jark.ouyi

Jark.ouyi (talk · contribs)
- Draft:BOE’s Wonder Lab of Worry Solutions (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)

Jark.ouyi (talk) 19:32, 19 December 2023 (UTC) 文献都是比较多的啊，具体需要提供什么文献合适

What assistance do you require? -- DoubleGrazing (talk) 19:37, 19 December 2023 (UTC)

Draft Benji Krol

Hey. Look, I know I was not so friendly back there, I really just someone to review my article so let me start right. Hey how are you doing ? I hope well. As you know I modificated the Benji Krol draft. And I appreciate if you could give it a look and tell me what is needed to be worked on, if it doesn’t meet the criteria’s and if not why. I know Wikipedia criteria’s are very rigorous for a reason. Thank you. Meio2934 (talk) 20:19, 19 December 2023 (UTC)

Okay, no worries @Meio2934.

Courtesy link: Draft:Benji Krol

This draft had been rejected already. The 'rules', whether you (or I, for that matter) like them or not, are that a rejected draft cannot be resubmitted, because it has reached the end of the road as far as the AfC review process is concerned. The way forward from there is to appeal directly to the reviewer who rejected the draft. This is why I reverted your post-rejection submission, because it was out-of-process, not because I have anything against this draft or its subject. HTH, -- DoubleGrazing (talk) 20:28, 19 December 2023 (UTC)

Thank you for the explanation everything is so clear now. So in this case I need to appeal with the editor that rejected the draft so they can approved it ? That seems better. Thank you DoubleGrazing :) sorry for taking so harsh on you I promise this type of conduct won’t ever happen again. Meio2934 (talk) 20:30, 19 December 2023 (UTC)

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