Talk:Joanna of Bourbon

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Wrong illustration

This is not Joanna of Bourbon. It's Isabeau of Bavaria, her daughter-in-law, queen-consort of Charles VI, king of France. Fan2jnrc (talk) 23:59, 3 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Death date

In this article it is written that his death date was 1378. However, her death also apper in the year 1377. Does someone has other references to her death date? Thanks,WhatWasDone (talk) 14:07, 16 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

It currently lists Her birth year as 1338, and her death year as 1278. I don't know the correct dates, so I can't fix it, however. 71.66.230.44 (talk) 09:54, 4 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The death for "Jehanne de Bourbon, royne de France" is listed in Les Grandes Chroniques de France as occurring at 10 p.m. on Saturday, 6 February 1377 in the king's hostel of Saint Paul in Paris. "Le samedi ensuivant, sixième jour dudit mois du février, environs dix heures après midi, ladite royne trespessa de ce siècle audit hostel de Saint-Pol." The year is stated on the preceding page describing the birth of her daughter Catherine as "mils trois cens septante-sept." Full text is available in Google Book format as of this edit. Yes, the text is in medieval French; no, those aren't all typos.--MoggieBleu (talk) 15:11, 19 April 2010 (UTC) ^[1] Following my entry, above, it is important to note that the visitation of Charles V's maternal uncle Emperor Charles IV to the French royal court in Paris took place in 1377, by the same account; however, in 1377, Charles IV inquired via letter about a possible visit, he arrived in December of 1377, and he left in January of 1377 by that same reckoning. This seems like a clear-cut case of Dual Dating [1] and the date most likely should be written as 1377/78 on the main page, for clarity (or at least the dual date should be mentioned thereon). Also, please note the alternate spelling of her name from a period source. This is not reflected on the actual article.--MoggieBleu (talk) 18:17, 25 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

References

^ Paris, Paulin, pub. Les Grandes Chroniques de France. Paris, Imprimerie de Béthune et Plon: 1836, v2, p412—3.

name

It is not in any way controversial. She was called Jeanne de Bourbon! She was Queen of France thus is the best name for her; and I hate articles with titles in them which came about by marriage. The page name of Jeanne de Bourbon existed and thus J d B, Queen of France the best option Prince LouisPhilippeCharles (talk) 21:57, 11 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Stop doing controversial moves over and over again after being reverted! You've been to told to stop doing that several times by several administrators and users yet you persist. I will have to report you if you continue. If you can't move an article to a desired title because the page already exists, you are supposed to request a move instead of inventing a name similar to the one you consider best. And she was not called Jeanne de Bourbon in her own lifetime, for her name was then spelled Jehanne. It is your responsibility to cite reliable English language sources because you are the one who is trying to change status quo. Surtsicna (talk) 11:51, 12 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

This is the only notable Joanna of Bourbon and there is no need to have "Queen of France" in the title of the article. Stop inventing titles just because you can't get the exact one you want without a proper discussion! Surtsicna (talk) 12:12, 12 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Well to be fair she should not even be called Joanna of Bourbon anyway. When on earth do you hear of this?! It actually makes my blood boil when I see of Bourbon as a name it just looks odd and is misleading. Jeanne de Bourbon, Queen of France as a title is fine methinks. Why is this sooo difficult?! Prince LouisPhilippeCharles (talk) 12:44, 12 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

She is the best known Joanna/Joan/Jeanne/Jehanne/Ioanna of/de Bourbon that ever existed. She is the primary usage. Surtsicna (talk) 12:47, 12 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

User:LouisPhilippeCharles you have made your point another editor has objected, so if you still want to have this page moved put in a WP:RM request. -- PBS (talk) 21:01, 12 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Potentially silly query: Why is the name Joanna being used on Wiki, when most scholarly books (even in English) refer to her by the modern French "Jeanne?" Thanks (in advance) for the explanation. — Preceding unsigned comment added by MoggieBleu (talk • contribs) 17:10, 22 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Not a silly question, but a good question. Joanna is the Latin form of the name, and Latin was the universal language of learning in the European Middle Ages in which medieval histories were first written. It became conventional in English to cite medieval European names in Latin, no matter what country they were from (they made an exception for England, though, and used English names for English people, e.g. Joan). This is an older practice and maybe now it's being superseded in scholarly writing by using modern local forms like Jeanne. But I think Latin is still legit in medieval names, as the Latin names were their official written forms during those medieval people's lifetimes. A followup question would be: Why do they use modern names like Jeanne when, as pointed out above, the lady herself would have been named Jehanne in medieval French? Johanna-Hypatia (talk) 08:33, 13 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]

[1] Paris, Paulin, pub. Les Grandes Chroniques de France. Paris, Imprimerie de Béthune et Plon: 1836, v2, p412—3.

[1]