Talk:Alexander Alekhine

Alexander Alekhine has been listed as one of the Sports and recreation good articles under the good article criteria. If you can improve it further, please do so. If it no longer meets these criteria, you can reassess it.

Article milestones
Date	Process	Result
August 22, 2007	WikiProject A-class review	Not approved
May 28, 2008	Good article nominee	Listed

Current status: Good article

Chess Top‑importance

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France Mid‑importance

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Biography

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Russia: Sports & games Top‑importance

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Soviet Union Low‑importance

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Socialism Low‑importance

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White Washing Jew Hatred

The section on the article which starts with thr uncited claim that there was evidence that he wasn’t antisemitic, then goes on to list relationships or friends he had who were Jewish. This is beyond offensive and the exact equivalent of a white person making racist comments then claiming they cant be racist because they have black friends. Anyone who has ever hears this “excuse” knows how offensive it is, and see’s it as a blatant strawman argument to try and normalize their bigotry. This entire section should be re-written, a citation given, and any “evidence” that includes working relationships or friendships with Jewish people removed. 201.237.126.218 (talk) 14:18, 8 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Photo of grave

Per reddit the grave site includes a chess board. It's hard to tell in the photo in the wiki article. Assuming the chessboard or its photo isn't some kind of temporary prank, can we get another photo that includes it? 2602:24A:DE47:B8E0:1B43:29FD:A863:33CA (talk) 01:10, 12 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

This article is so slanted that it reads like propaganda

According to the article, Alekhine wasn't an antisemite, wasn't really a nazi, was only one of many top players to play in Nazi organized tournaments, didn't make up games, didn't take credit for other players' ideas, was mostly a teetotaler, that it was Casablanca's fault that they didn't play a rematch, that he was loyal and protective of his (fourth!) wife, and that he was murdered by the Soviets.

Most of these views are false, the others are highly speculative, and some are so ridiculous as to shock the conscience.

This article is an example of why so many academics bar their students from using Wikipedia. Fielding99 (talk) 11:38, 22 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Are there particular statements, or omissions, that you find problematic? Most of the statements on these topics are dutifully supported by citations of sources that are considered reliable. Bruce leverett (talk) 14:25, 22 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I'm not sure if we're reading the same article. I think the article paints a fair picture. Yes Alekhine did say and write some vile anti-Semitic things, but he didn't necessarily hate Jewish people personally. It is also factually correct that many top players including Keres, Bogoljubow, Stoltz and Foltys played in Nazi-sponsored tournaments. The Soviet murder theory is presented as speculation, as is appropriate. The article doesn't gloss over Alekhine's generally unlikeable personality. MaxBrowne2 (talk) 05:01, 23 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Death during reign

Article says:

Alekhine is the only World Chess Champion to have died while holding the title.

Vera Menchik was women's world champion when she was killed by a WW2 bomb hitting her house in 1944. I don't know if that should be noted in the article since I'm not sure if the men's and women's world championships were considered separate events back in those days, like they may have been in the Botvinnik (FIDE) era. That became an issue for Susan Polgar in the 1980s, resulting in some rules changes, so today the formerly "men's" world championship is now an "open" championship that anyone can compete in. Thoughts? 2601:644:8581:75B0:0:0:0:F42E (talk) 08:13, 5 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The rules haven't changed; the World Championship is open to players of both sexes, as it was during Menchik's lifetime, and the Women's WC is open only to women.

They have been separate championships ever since they both existed. Conflating them as suggested can only cause confusion and/or arguments.

More generally, statements like "Alekhine is the only World Chess Champion to have died while holding the title" are not very interesting except as the answers to trivia questions. So I am not attached to this statement, but I have no idea if I could get consensus for removing it. Bruce leverett (talk) 16:02, 5 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

GA concerns

I am concerned that this article no longer meets the good article criteria. Some of my concerns are outlined below:

The article uses some unreliable sources, like old geocities websites and an angelfire website. These should be removed, and the information sourced to them should be cited to other sources or removed.
To help with the above task, there are a lot of sources listed in the "Further reading" section that can be used instead. The large amount of sources listed in Further reading also makes me think that this article might not be complete. If some of these sources are not usable in the article, I think they should be removed.
There is some uncited prose in the article.

Is anyone willing to address these concerns, or should this go to WP:GAR? Z1720 (talk) 18:36, 22 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]