Talk:Moms Mabley

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Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 22 August 2019 and 6 December 2019.

Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by PrimeBOT (talk) 04:24, 17 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Married, Never Married

The article claims Mabley was married (Early Years paragraph) - and later states she "never married" (Personal Life). Teeb (talk)

I believe the article is referring to the date her parents married (Early Years Paragraph), though I don't understand why it needs to be there. GMoneyWhatWhat (talk) 06:47, 29 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Life story copy vio

The life story text here is the same as the one here: http://www.mmguide.musicmatch.com/artist/artist.cgi?ARTISTID=352163&TMPL=LONG#bio with no attribution. Which is the original source?

You're right. The text here was a cut and paste from that article. Because that article included a byline, I'm assuming our version is in violation of copyright. I've excised the offending text. Good catch. — BrianSmithson 18:06, 15 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I would like to add more detail to some of her decisions about her stage name and what her jokes centered around. GMoneyWhatWhat (talk) 06:45, 29 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Lesbian?

Thanks for adding the NYT reference about Mabley's supposed sexuality. But if you read the article, it says "Although Moms herself was a lesbian, according to Ms. [Clarice] Taylor...". I'm afraid that doesn't qualify as a reliable source - gossip from Clarice Taylor (Cosby's mother on The Cosby Show) is not up to snuff. Further, the edit summary when the ref was added says to "See EL", which I suppose means the external links section. But neither IMDB, IBDB, nor Find-a-Grave are considered reliable sources either.

So could someone find a reliable source that states Ms. Mabley's sexuality? Thanks! -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 06:06, 19 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I provided 2 references and 1 external link. Apart from the fact that Ms. Taylor is also a source, especially when she is quoted in the NYT. Debresser (talk) 13:09, 19 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

If she was really a lesbian, then why this text comment: "She took her stage name, Jackie Mabley, from an early boyfriend..."?

Maybe she was bisexual but I am loath to categorize or classify her as a lesbian based on posthumous innuendo. Hopefully no one is confusing her with Ma Rainey. Rms125a@hotmail.com (talk) 15:26, 26 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

The tv biopic had pretty substantial documentation that she dated women in her 20s, and dressed in men's clothes. I'm not sure "lesbian" is appropriate. Her roommate said they never called her a lesbian, or gay, or homosexual, and I'm not sure those terms were in use in that community at that time. She slept with women, that's a verifiable fact. Baron ridiculous (talk) 18:28, 14 November 2014 (UTC)[reply]

The biopic could be inferred two ways; Moms was either a lesbian or FTM transgender in a time before that had been classified. Given her roommate's description and Moms's choice to dress and act like a man at all times outside of her performances, I would assume transgender to be more likely, though we will never know for sure which.--LurganShmith (talk) 04:17, 23 November 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Comedienne

Was she ever called a "comedian" during her lifetime? We didn't call women that back then, because the word "comedian" was always begging to have "low" put in front of it. Women were dignified with the word "comedienne". Varlaam (talk) 07:03, 29 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Discography Update

I've been collecting records lately and came across Chess Records LPS 1525 Moms Babley Breaks Up The Network. I'm not sure when it was made, but it doesn't show up on the Discography section. I suspect I can find more information, but what should I provide to make sure its acceptable?--Seanbruno (talk) 18:43, 19 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I updated the Discography section to include her appearance on The Smothers Brothers Comedy Hour, Episode #108, October 22, 1967. Moms was considered too controversial for television, but that did not stop the Smothers Brothers. I am not sure if I need to include this reference anywhere. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Great Trek (talk • contribs) 21:13, 2 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Number 1 records, Records with Pigmeat, Sketchy details here...

She was a sensation in the late 60s and early 70s on LP records and television. She appeared on Cosby's original comedy series and The Flip Wilson Show, many others besides Ed Sullivan. No mention is made of album sales (perhaps first woman comedian to break the top 10) not counting Nichols and May. Certainly the first black woman to score with comedy LPs. Plus Bill Cosby had her, and early comedy circuit partner, "Pigmeat" on his short lived " Bill Cosby Show ('69-70) in which they played his aunt and uncle. Article needs a lot more research and info. Who was the father(s) of her children? One person said she was a lesbian, in an article 20 years ago, and that makes it a fact? Having 6 children at least suggests she was a bisexual. She performed without her false teeth for effect..... Just because she died very, very long before the advent of the internet, doesn't mean this article should have very little real information... aside from its skimpy cut and paste sources. — Preceding unsigned comment added by BayBoomer1959 (talk • contribs) 01:58, 7 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Influenced Bing Crosby?

The very first name listed under people whose careers were influenced by Mabley is Bing Crosby? That doesn't seem intuitive...did Crosby ever say that or is someone having a little joke here? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.110.175.121 (talk) 13:36, 7 November 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Agreed. This appears to be an error. Likely the author meant Bill Cosby. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.189.104.223 (talk) 02:05, 20 November 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Birth year discrepancy

In the lead and info box, her birth year is listed as 1894, however the referenced material states her birth year as 1897. Could someone who is knowledgeable enough update her page?

"Although she always claimed a birthdate of 1894 and that she was one of a family of twenty children, the 1900 Federal Census shows "Loretter Aiken" in Brevard was born in March 1897 and was the youngest of four (out of five) surviving children of James P. and Mary Aiken.[1] "

ZouBEini (talk) 11:26, 16 November 2013 (UTC)[reply]

According to the 1910 Census there was a Loretta Aiken born in Brevard, North Carolina who was 13 years old at the time. I do see about 6 other people with the last name Aiken. Almost every other website varies in the number of siblings she had. https://www.genealogybank.com/doc/census/image/v2:16DABE9A383D710A@GB3CENSUS-16DABD5E1C30F310@2418673-16F3780B2E8AD6E3@/p_511495705 GMoneyWhatWhat (talk) 07:08, 29 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you. I found a source claiming her father died when she was 12 and that she left home to have an abortion at 14, and that she decided to join her mother in Cleveland instead. I was beginning to wonder if the person had done proper research. This explains a lot. And the source has the birth date as 1897.

Also, the source says she kept her baby and worked as a wet nurse at 14, depriving her own baby. The abortion she never had took place years later. This conflicts with her having babies at 11 and 13.— Vchimpanzee • talk • contributions • 22:31, 11 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Triple X-rated

@Jpgordon: I'd imagine it's akin to a triple X-rated movie. Found various references to it on the web (hey, maybe that's what a browser's "private mode" is for! Looking up references for Wikipedia!), one of which was a Jay Leno interview: "Well, hmmm. … You should be a reasonable expectation of what people see on television. The funniest thing I can think of, the greatest example of that, was Redd Foxx. Now Redd Foxx was the filthiest comedian, I mean, just so dirty. But to most people he was Fred Sanford [of the network sitcom “Sanford and Son”]. I remember when Redd came into Westbury, N.Y., and they had huge signs, “This show is triple-X-rated — XXX — do not bring children or anybody under 40,” you know." Not sure how to get that across in the article. --NeilN ^{talk to me} 23:51, 11 September 2014 (UTC)[reply]

External links modified

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TV Appearances

In addition to the appearances listed in the article (Smothers Brothers, etc.), she appeared several times on the Johnny Carson show, The Tonight Show, during the 70's. This is notable as Johnny Carson was very particular about which comedians were allowed to not only stand before the audience, but it was also considered a coup if he asked you to sit down at his dias, and Moms Mabley always sat at the dias after she delivered her monologue. YvetteMcNeill 18:20, 20 April, 2019--Yvettekm (talk) 22:38, 20 April 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Lots of possible errors

I'm afraid to use this source but if it is right, there are a lot of errors in this article. 8 children, not 16, for example. See #Birth year discrepancy for more details.— Vchimpanzee • talk • contributions • 22:34, 11 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]