Template talk:Steels

I this template is not for every single type of steel there is!; removing surgical stainless and HSS --Knife Knut 03:07, 4 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I agree we shouldn't include all the AISI numbers in this template, but I'd like to consider adding a few more named phases and types to this template. I don't think there are many more named ones. I propose adding:

These are all common and someone browsing about steels might want to know about them. Can you come up with enough more common named kinds of steel to suggest that things could get out of hand? —Ben FrantzDale 18:16, 17 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Ok, lets compromise. I pulled surgical and high speed as they are subsets of stainless and tool steel, but left the irons as they are easily confused with, and are often used interchangably with steel.

I suggest we split off "types of Steel" into a new template for starters.

I dont know enough about templates and stuff to do it yet, but would be acceptable to put the different types under each classification. Surgical Stainless indented under Stainless, and the same with HSS.

--Knife Knut 01:24, 20 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Sounds good. What do you mean abou tthe "templates and stuff", do you just mean putting subheadings in there or something more complicated? —Ben FrantzDale 04:06, 20 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

no just keeping it simple where it is obvious that a given type of steel belongs to a certain group. I changed my mind about splitting the template now. Lets wait on that till it gets big enough to warrant it. --Knife Knut 00:45, 21 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Phases and microstructures

There seems to be some confusion in this template about the differences between the phases of steel and the various microstructures. Carbon-iron alloy systems only have four phases, which are ferrite (including all allotropes), cementite, graphite and austenite. These phases combine in various ways to form different microstructures, which are sphereoidite, pearlite, bainite, martensite and ledeburite. Alloy-steels, on the other hand, may have other phases, such as nickel-ferrite, but I think that would need to be a whole different template.

Personally, I think the phases and microstructures should be separated under different heading within this template. I'd do it myself, but have no idea how. Zaereth (talk) 20:31, 27 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Is graphite a phase of steel?

Along with the other phases of steel is "Graphite", which links to the article on Graphite which is of course an allotropr of carbon and not a phase of steel. Should the link to "Graphite" be removed or modified? Paul Foxworthy (talk) 05:06, 25 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Graphite is a phase of cast iron, which is included in this template. In specific, cast irons are divided into white and grey cast-irons, depending on which form the carbides take. In white cast-iron, the carbon is mainly in the form of cementite, but in grey cast-iron it is mainly in the form of graphite. It also occurs in white cast-iron that has been "black tempered". This template was originally named "Iron alloy phases", which was somewhat inaccurate. It was later changed to "Iron-carbon phases", which was more accurate, and then recently someone changed it to "Steels", which is even less accurate. I think it would probably be best to rename it "Iron-carbon alloys" and leave graphite a part of it. Zaereth (talk) 05:39, 25 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

@Zaereth, thanks for the explanation.

But both gray and white cast iron are already listed in the template under "Other iron-based materials". Would it be better to change the text for "gray iron" to read "gray (graphitic) iron" and remove the link to Graphite in the phases section?

The title "Steels" is arguably oversimplified, but there are links to microstructures and classes as well as phases, and we need a pithy title. The job of the template is to lead you to more detailed information, so it should be short and sharp. I'm no expert in the field, but I'd lean towards keeping the title of "Steels".

What do you think?

Paul Foxworthy (talk) 06:02, 25 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I still lean toward a more-accurate title. For example, if we remove graphite from the phases, do we also need to remove ledeburite from the microstructures? Nobody calls grey iron "graphitic iron" or white iron "ledeburitic". And what about ductile iron (aka: black iron or non-porous cast-iron), in which the ledeburite in white iron is transformed into graphite by black tempering? All these alloys really belong together in the same template, because they all share many of the same phases and structures. Pearlite, ferrite, and cementite can all be found in cast irons just as they are in steel. Steels don't have graphite or ledeburite, but cast irons don't have martensite or austenite. That's just my opinion, though. Let's see what others have to say. Zaereth (talk) 06:22, 25 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]