Talk:Tupac Shakur/Archive 9

Archive 5

←

Archive 7

Archive 8

Archive 9

Tupac page protected

Can someone make this page protected please thx. Confunxion (talk) 10:36, 13 July 2024 (UTC)

There should be a button on our user page to call administrators. Pier1999 (talk) 10:39, 13 July 2024 (UTC)

its protected again HumansRightsIsCool (talk) 13:07, 13 July 2024 (UTC)

It's not, I just logged out of my profile and it lets me edit even without going in. It is not protected, this page has had two million views since March. It means we should fight against edit war every day lol Pier1999 (talk) 13:11, 13 July 2024 (UTC)

If I see any more accusations of vandalism from anybody, the accuser may be blocked. Work it out here or at DR, the back and forth is disruptive. Acroterion (talk) 16:13, 13 July 2024 (UTC)

Ok he's not vandalizing I guess. Hey any admins though, in the lead can you put "other" before "African Americans", since Tupac was also African American. ActionHerosIsReal removed "other" because he said Grammar issues or something, I don't see how? HumansRightsIsCool (talk) 19:42, 13 July 2024 (UTC)

can someone respond HumansRightsIsCool (talk) 19:46, 16 July 2024 (UTC)

Fully-protected edit request

In the middle of the article's first paragraph, there are periods both before and after the 3rd and 4th reference footnotes. Please remove the latter period in accordance with MOS:REFPUNCT, since there should only be one period and it should be before the footnotes. Thank you. Left guide (talk) 07:48, 18 July 2024 (UTC)

 Done * Pppery * _{it has begun...} 15:41, 18 July 2024 (UTC)

Protected edit request on 22 July 2024

Please remove the sentence "In its vinyl release, side A, tracks 1 to 8, is labeled the 'Black Side', while side B, tracks 9 to 16, is the 'Dark Side'" in § Strictly 4 My N.I.G.G.A.Z... While this does seem true, I cannot find any RS on it or why it's relevant enough to be mentioned in this article instead of just in the album article. Thanks, Queen of Hearts ^talk 06:24, 22 July 2024 (UTC)

 Not done as the protection has expired and this may now be made directly as appropriate. Ping to @Queen of Hearts:. — xaosflux ^Talk 13:30, 23 July 2024 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 28 July 2024

Add Actor to Tupac's credentials. 2600:1700:5192:4890:565:2201:D827:6046 (talk) 04:04, 28 July 2024 (UTC)

 Not done: Per MOS:ROLEBIO. Jamedeus (talk) 04:53, 28 July 2024 (UTC)

......

@LLawrencekhoo said "To reverse a RFC consensus, you should hold another RFC". You all reversed consensus since it was agreed upon to keep songwriter in the lead recently. HumansRightsIsCool (talk) 22:53, 10 August 2024 (UTC)

I mean @Lawrencekhoo HumansRightsIsCool (talk) 22:53, 10 August 2024 (UTC)

Would you like to start a RFC? Or would you prefer that I start one? LK (talk) 07:22, 11 August 2024 (UTC)

Who decides that a 2017 regulation must now be the rule? If we've decided over the years to approve different approaches? Pier1999 (talk) 10:49, 11 August 2024 (UTC)

It hasn't been used for years, and now you bring this up. Why? Pier1999 (talk) 10:50, 11 August 2024 (UTC)

See WP:LOCALCONSENSUS. "Consensus among a limited group of editors, at one place and time, cannot override community consensus on a wider scale." LK (talk) 12:08, 11 August 2024 (UTC)

Contested edit

@Pier1999 bro what are you doing, stop edit warring, one of us is going to get in trouble and possibly banned. Stop reverting and just discuss your edit in the talk page HumansRightsIsCool (talk) 16:15, 13 August 2024 (UTC)

You need to discuss your edits; mine have already been approved, and an administrator changed the lead, stating that academics consider him an influential political activist by writing "economy." None of the sources mention his poems, so why do you insist on adding the poems? Pier1999 (talk) 16:17, 13 August 2024 (UTC)

because Nemov suggested it during 2024 RfC and I agreed. It says "rapper and actor" because Shakur played in tons of movies so I said that in the lead, he also wrote poems so why not add that and move your sentence, the sentence is still there, that's the solution I tried to create. Why is there always edit wars and the lead changing every three seconds. Go to any other rappers page and there's no problem, yet everyone tries to fight over Tupac, like that's so annoying HumansRightsIsCool (talk) 16:23, 13 August 2024 (UTC)

But it doesn't have anything to do with the lead. He was suggesting the roles. In 2022, Tupac was considered a rapper and actor. But in the final part of the lead, it was written "icon of activism against injustices." There, the roles are being discussed, not the entire content of the lead. Pier1999 (talk) 16:25, 13 August 2024 (UTC)

"rapper and actor per MOS:BIOFIRSTSENTENCE. Those are the two most notable things about him. There other stuff can be detailed further in the lead" - Nemov during 2024 RfC HumansRightsIsCool (talk) 16:27, 13 August 2024 (UTC)

Yes, but it's not a rule, and the RFC isn't finished. It will continue, and until that point, we need to keep "actor" and "rapper" in the description, and in the academic section, that he is considered a rapper and prominent activist. Pier1999 (talk) 16:31, 13 August 2024 (UTC)

The RfC isn't finished because why'll everyone pretty much agreed with rapper and actor now, you keep trying to convince people to add Activist in the lead and no one's listening HumansRightsIsCool (talk) 16:32, 13 August 2024 (UTC)

The fact that Tupac played in movies and wrote poems is sourced already, just go to the poetry section. Just move your sentence over in the lead, mine and Nemov's sentence can be in the article and you can move your sentence over in the lead, what's the big deal? HumansRightsIsCool (talk) 16:33, 13 August 2024 (UTC)

You can't move the sentence in the lead; it cites academic sources. We've all already decided that it should stay there. In fact, an administrator even approved this by improving the grammar. Why should we leave in that he wrote poems and not that academics consider him an important activist? Do you realize that the latter is much more important than the former? And not by a little. Pier1999 (talk) 16:37, 13 August 2024 (UTC)

The fact that he has been cited by academics as an important activist is far more significant than the fact that he wrote "a dozen poems." Therefore, it must remain in the lead because it cites the opinion of academics. Pier1999 (talk) 16:38, 13 August 2024 (UTC)

This is not a policy-based argument. MOS:LEAD and MOS:BIO do not say anything that supports the claim that it must remain in the lead because it cites the opinion of academics. Please try and make sure your arguments are supported by Wikipedia policy and not stances you have come up with on your own. JustAnotherCompanion (talk) 16:46, 13 August 2024 (UTC)

Fine, the sources report that, and no source mentions dozens of poems and films. I stick to the sources used; we can't write something in the lead that differs from the sources used. Additionally, according to Wikipedia's rules, before changing something, a discussion needs to be opened. He didn't open any discussion to modify the lead, and furthermore, he didn't use any source. He writes that since it's mentioned on the page, it should be included without any source. Pier1999 (talk) 16:49, 13 August 2024 (UTC)

I'm not trying to remove the part about academics, I'm just trying to move the sentence a few sentences down so I can have room for the sentence me and Nemov agreed to. The fact that we argue about small sentences in wiki articles is honestly sad, why can't you just move your sentence over just a little bit HumansRightsIsCool (talk) 16:40, 13 August 2024 (UTC)

But if there is a section for poetry, why do you need to include it in the lead as well? And it’s the same for the films, it’s written in the content of the page that he acted in various films, lol. Is what the academics say about his activism more important, or the fact that he wrote some poetry or acted in a few films? Pier1999 (talk) 16:42, 13 August 2024 (UTC)

But if there is a section for poetry, why do you need to include it in the lead as well? And it’s the same for the films; it’s written in the content of the page that he acted in various films, lol. Is what the academics say about his activism more important, or the fact that he wrote some poetry or acted in a few films? Pier1999 (talk) 16:40, 13 August 2024 (UTC)

Yes, but no one said to remove the part about the academics; in fact, everyone agrees that it should remain. An administrator changed the grammar of the sentence about Tupac. He changed the lead and wrote "and a political activist for Black America." We all agree that this part should stay. Pier1999 (talk) 16:34, 13 August 2024 (UTC)

all of it's important, that's why I'm trying to include all of it, I didn't remove your part about academics I just moved It a few sentences down HumansRightsIsCool (talk) 16:43, 13 August 2024 (UTC)

You can't do that because the lead cannot become too long, and we need to stick to the sources. The academic source examines Tupac as an artist and activist separately. Besides, the lead cannot become overly long. Pier1999 (talk) 16:46, 13 August 2024 (UTC)

I didn't make the lead overly long I just added a short sentence that talks about his movies and poems, a sentence that takes less than 6 seconds to read HumansRightsIsCool (talk) 16:48, 13 August 2024 (UTC)

Yes, but you couldn't do it without consensus. To include that stuff in the lead, I needed consensus. I had to discuss it, and anyway, we need to report what the sources say. The things you wrote have no consensus, no source, and you also can't change what's written in other articles. You even mixed up two different articles when that source analyzes Tupac's music and his activism as two distinct things. Pier1999 (talk) 16:52, 13 August 2024 (UTC)

I don't need a source about Tupac writing dozens of poems because it's already sourced throughout the article, same with actor. HumansRightsIsCool (talk) 16:54, 13 August 2024 (UTC)

No, actually you have to do it; if you want to include it in the lead, you need to use sources. And before writing it, you still need to get consensus and start a discussion. Pier1999 (talk) 16:56, 13 August 2024 (UTC)

also I already have conscious, Nemov agreed with my edits HumansRightsIsCool (talk) 16:56, 13 August 2024 (UTC)

Actually, he didn't agree with what you wrote. He only said that actor and rapper should be kept. He didn't say that poems should be included, and he didn't tell you to remove the part about the academics. Anyway, to write something in the lead, you need sources. We're on Wikipedia! Pier1999 (talk) 16:57, 13 August 2024 (UTC)

He did agree. He said poet should be talked about later in the lead. Here's the quote "rapper and actor per MOS:BIOFIRSTSENTENCE. Those are the two most notable things about him. There other stuff can be detailed further in the lead" - Nemov during 2024 RfC and I don't need sources for something if something is already sourced. Btw you reverted over 3 of my edits first, so technically you started an edit war, and you're breaking the Wikipedia rule "Don't bludgeon the process", so it seems like you don't really care about the rules. We're on Wikipedia! HumansRightsIsCool (talk) 17:02, 13 August 2024 (UTC)

And why do you keep saying I removed the part about academics, I just moved the sentence a few sentences down HumansRightsIsCool (talk) 17:04, 13 August 2024 (UTC)

But you can't put it there because you would be reporting something different from the source. The source says that Tupac was a great activist because of his commitment to activism, not because of his lyrics. Pier1999 (talk) 17:05, 13 August 2024 (UTC)

Then I'll just move the source a few sentences down to where i moved your sentence so I can add back how he has starring roles in films and wrote poems HumansRightsIsCool (talk) 17:08, 13 August 2024 (UTC)

Be careful. Remember when I wanted to expand the lead? They told me it was getting too long. Start a discussion about this and cite your sources. Pier1999 (talk) 17:13, 13 August 2024 (UTC)

i already did start a discussion, this is the discussion lol. And poetry and actor is already sourced HumansRightsIsCool (talk) 17:16, 13 August 2024 (UTC)

Songwriter in the lead

Wouldn't it also be appropriate to mention that he was a songwriter in the lead? Maybe in the main roles? What do you think? I'm asking because the RFC hasn't been closed. Pier1999 (talk) 00:22, 18 August 2024 (UTC)

done HumansRightsIsCool (talk) 00:29, 18 August 2024 (UTC)

Mace Windu

In the "Posthumous rumored roles and Star Wars" section:

"The character's bald appearance could have also been an homage to Shakur."

The cited Rolling Stone article makes no mention of this and this comment in general seems largely speculative. Townkryer (talk) 18:45, 19 August 2024 (UTC)

I agree, that section is insufficiently supported and also shouldn't be more than a line long at most. ^Thanks,L3X1 ◊distænt write◊ 19:54, 24 August 2024 (UTC)

I have removed the quoted sentence from the article now. It's clear speculation ('could have') and it is not supported by the reference given. JustAnotherCompanion (talk) 20:04, 24 August 2024 (UTC)

Change Treach's Gender to Male

Treach collaborated with Shakur on his song "5 Deadly Venomz" and appeared in his music video "Temptations". She was also a speaker at a public memorial service for Shakur in 1996. 74.87.78.3 (talk) 22:45, 31 August 2024 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 31 August 2024

Treach collaborated with Shakur on his song "5 Deadly Venomz" and appeared in his music video "Temptations".[100] He was also a speaker at a public memorial service for Shakur in 1996.[168] 74.87.78.3 (talk) 22:43, 31 August 2024 (UTC)

 Not done: Please provide sources or links. Also, please be careful when copying. Those square brackets [] are meaningless on the talk page. ⸺(Random)staplers 20:52, 1 September 2024 (UTC)