Talk:Robert-Bourassa Boulevard — University Street

1935 photo

The photo from 1935 seems to include the Roddick Gates at the top of McGill College avenue, not University 205.151.83.5 (talk) 19:49, 11 March 2015 (UTC)

Robert-Bourassa Boulevard: new article or move?

On March 15, 2015, University Street (excluding the short stretch adjacent to McGill) was renamed "Robert-Bourassa Boulevard". There's a one year transition for postal mail forwarding, and I believe some old signs with red tape covering them may stay for a short period, but for all intents and purposes it's now official: the new street signs have gone up and even Google Maps has renamed the street.

Question is, how should we go about the change here. A new article titled Robert-Bourassa Boulevard, or the existing article moved from University Street to Robert-Bourassa Boulevard? I'm leaning towards the latter since it will automatically redirect, and little needs to be done in terms of modifying the article. Wanted to hear what others think before I go forward with any changes (not particularly keen about doing so, considering it's another erasure of Montreal's history for political reasons).--Apple2gs (talk) 00:16, 18 March 2015 (UTC)

It's a quandary, as University Street will continue to exist. If the present article were moved to Robert Bourassa Boulevard, and then University Street were re-created by re-adding the relevant information, would its edit history be preserved in both places? - Montréalais (talk) 13:49, 5 April 2015 (UTC)

Probably best to use the Wikipedia article on Rene Levesque Boulevard as a model, it was an almost identical situation. The vast majority of Dorchester was renamed except for a small tail stretch in Westmount. For all intents and purposes, and as much as I dislike the situation, University is no longer a major or large street, too insignificant to merit its own article. Of course it's history is still relevant and important, but it'd likely just fit under the main Robert-Bourassa Boulevard article as a section on the street's history (or like Dorchester, a sub-section of the Rene Levesque Boulevard). As I said, I think a move is probably a better idea than a split into two articles but let's see what others feel.--Apple2gs (talk) 16:17, 5 April 2015 (UTC)

Requested move 29 January 2025

Robert-Bourassa Boulevard — University Street → Robert-Bourassa Boulevard – Current title is the result of an undiscussed move in 2015, and violates naming convention. Per WP:PLACE#Alternative names: "Wikipedia articles must have a single title." University Street was renamed Robert-Bourassa Boulevard in 2015, and reliable sources have used the latter name since (WP:NAMECHANGES.) No sources use the double-barrelled "Robert-Bourassa Boulevard — University Street". Although a small stretch retains the name "University Street", a discussion at the time determined that a split of the article is unnecessary, and that the situation is indeed quite similar to René Lévesque Boulevard (where Dorchester Boulevard is a primary redirect, not a separate article.) 162 etc. (talk) 18:06, 29 January 2025 (UTC) — Relisting. Arbitrarily0 ^(talk) 18:43, 5 February 2025 (UTC)

• Opposed I was fine having the article using both names, but I'm going to walk back and disagree with what I said a decade ago if only one name can remain. Rethinking this, if only one name can stand, then it must be "University Street". The street name dates back to 1842--that's nearly 200 YEARS. It was only in the last 10 YEARS that a large section of it was arbitrarily renamed, and purely for political reasons (the erasure of English history, and giving importance to modern day politicians who've supported anti-English legislation and the segregation of this province from the rest of Canada). Further more, University street hasn't disappeared, the section from McGill University to the former Royal Victoria Hospital retains the name. And several locals, myself included, still refer the street in its entirely as University Street. Just as I refer to Dorchester as Dorchester Boulvard, and not the name of the late founder of the Parti Quebecois political party. It's also worthy to note nearly half (+43%) of the street retains the original name, it's not quite as small as was written in the article. Additionally, the section that makes the renamed bit slightly longer, is not so much a street as it is an on/off ramp to the expressway/Highway 14. I vote, if there is to be a change, that the article be moved back to "University Street" with a bolded mention of Robert-Bourassa If they're nearly equal in size. This leaves the importance of its history intact, and most importantly, follows the common name guideline on Wikipedia. We should also do the same with the Dorchester street article, but let's stick with this for now.--Apple2gs (talk) 08:24, 5 February 2025 (UTC)

  > "a large section of it was arbitrarily renamed"

  It was indeed renamed. See here, here. Why it was renamed can be addressed in the article (provided, of course, that such content is cited to reliable secondary sources.) As for the article title, Wikipedia follows the policy at WP:NAMECHANGES: " If the reliable sources written after the change is announced routinely use the new name, Wikipedia should follow suit and change relevant titles to match." And, that is indeed the case; heck, even the City of Westmount uses "Robert-Bourassa". See also WP:RGW. 162 etc. (talk) 17:31, 5 February 2025 (UTC)

My issue is there are now two (nearly) equally sized streets this article is about. Since the rename by the city of Montreal, these sections of road are now separate entities:

1) A ~1.0 kilometer road named "University Street" which has been so named since 1842, and has a long standing legacy history in Montreal. It is 183 years old.

2) A ~1.2 Kilometer road named "Robert-Bourassa Boulevard", that only came into existence by erasing and eliminating nearly 50% of the aforementioned road by giving it a new name designation. It has only existed since 2015, and is 10 years old.

So we have two equally sized streets (especially once you consider a large portion of Robert-Bourassa Boulevard is a long on-off section for highway 10; with few if any buildings surround it). Why is the newly inaugurated one of more importance or significance? If anything, University has a 173 years more history over it than Robert-Bourassa Boulevard. If University street is removed from this article title, then it needs to be spun-off into it's own article. Obviously both articles can mention it used to be one long street that was later cut in two and one section renamed. or alternatively, still consider them one long street and re-title the article: "University Street–Robert Bourassa Boulevard" (note University in front, as the street starts as University, and additional has a far longer history behind it). I agree with following Wikipedia guidelines, but I do not agree with trying to use them in a underhanded way to try and erase important parts of Canadian history.--Apple2gs (talk) 01:10, 7 February 2025 (UTC)

Propose a split if you want. The article can't have two names. 162 etc. (talk) 04:52, 13 February 2025 (UTC)