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Talk:Prosecution of Donald Trump in New York

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Final charges

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The opening paragraph does not reflect the final charges correctly.

The conviction, as per the official jury instructions and final charges document (primary source) was falsification of business records to conceal or commit another crime.

The other crime is specified as violation of Section 17-152 of the New York Election Law (page 30) which is "conspiracy to promote or prevent an election".

The article states that the other crime is one out of three possibilities "violation of federal campaign finance limits, unlawfully influencing the 2016 U.S. presidential election, and tax fraud".

The three possibilities should instead refer to the three theories offered by the prosecution that constitute the unlawful means by which the NY Election Law was violated. And even these are wrong. They should be tax violations, FECA violations, and falsification of other business records (p31+). 82.47.184.148 (talk) 17:42, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Proposal to change to a more accurate description of the conviction. Examples provided below which summarise the final charges as per the primary source linked above. Emphasis added to show that the current article is factually incorrect.
  • "New York jury found him guilty of all 34 charges in a scheme to illegally influence the 2016 election" AP News
  • "New York jury has found him guilty of falsifying business records to commit election fraud." Sky News
  • "Donald Trump has been found guilty of all 34 counts of falsifying business records in a criminal hush-money scheme to influence the outcome of the 2016 election." Guardian
82.47.184.148 (talk) 20:09, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

CBS News Austin affiliate article

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I think this is notable, relevant, and reliably sourced, and should be included.

What do others here think?

The Last Hungry Cat (talk) 19:25, 5 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

https://cbsaustin.com/news/nation-world/doj-official-calls-trump-prosecutions-perversion-of-justice-in-undercover-clip-donald-trump-nicholas-biase-department-of-justice-alvin-bragg-new-york-hush-money-trial-mug-club-undercover

It’s one person’s opinion, which that person has retracted, as stated in the article, so no, I don’t think it merits inclusion. Mr Serjeant Buzfuz (talk) 10:39, 6 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]
This has been reported in multiple reliable sources, and he only retracted his opinion once he discovered he had been recorded. Moreover, this is not just "one person"; he is "a senior official at the Department of Justice's Southern District of New York office". Definitely needs inclusion. Magnolia677 (talk) 13:12, 6 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Here's another source:

https://www.cnn.com/2024/09/06/politics/manhattan-us-attorney-office-spokesperson-video-trump-hush-money/index.html

The Last Hungry Cat (talk) 21:35, 22 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Title redux

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Our previous discussions on the title have run into a deadlock. As a key element of a title, "hush money" is more recognizable, but is technically incorrect since the charges are for business records falsification, and paying hush money is not even in itself a crime. On the other hand, "business records falsification" is potentially ambiguous with the civil trial and with the separate criminal prosecution of Trump Organization corporations.

I think that combining the two may solve these problems, so I want to ask what people would think of Hush money records falsification trial of Donald Trump or something similar. Antony–22 (talk⁄contribs) 23:00, 9 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Median Sentences?

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All parties have agreed to the sentencing hearing being delayed (until November 26) given the unprecedented situation of Trump now being president-elect. Manifold implications, the sheer logistics (!) of whatever comes down if it's not outright dismissal, etc. We do have a baseline, however: Trump isn't the only New York Class E Felon that's ever been. Strictly in terms of the number and types of charges, what sentences have been handed down in, oh, the last decade or since the turn of the century? Understandably, everything I've found has been focused on the uniqueness of this case, but again, there's public record. What say you? kencf0618 (talk) 15:09, 13 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Well, we could do all that research and get a number, but we could not put it in the article because it would be WP:OR. What you would need to do is find some pundit who mentions what the median sentence would be and then figure out where in the article to put it making sure to make it clear who said it so it is not in Wikipedia's voice. Richard-of-Earth (talk) 07:08, 18 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
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