Talk:Matthew Tye

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This article was nominated for deletion. Please review the prior discussions if you are considering re-nomination:

Keep, 1 July 2022, see discussion.
allow recreation, 20 June 2022, see discussion.
decision endorsed, 15 October 2021, see discussion.
delete, 25 June 2018, see discussion.
delete, 9 May 2017, see discussion.

A fact from Matthew Tye appeared on Wikipedia's Main Page in the Did you know column on 29 July 2022 (check views). The text of the entry was as follows:

Did you know... that Matthew Tye uploaded a YouTube video about leaving China after hearing that members of the local public security bureau had shown his photograph in bars frequented by foreigners?

A record of the entry may be seen at Wikipedia:Recent additions/2022/July. The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/Matthew Tye.

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Did you know nomination

The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by SL93 (talk) 23:29, 26 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(

Comment or view
Article history

)

... that Matthew Tye uploaded a YouTube video about escaping from China after he heard members of China's public security bureau had shown his photo in bars frequented by foreigners? Source: Mo, Yu 莫雨 (2021-07-30). ""在中國，自由都是表面的"：一位逃離牆國的美國網紅" ["In China, freedom is superficial": An American Internet celebrity who fled the wall country] (in Chinese). Voice of America. Archived from the original on 2022-06-20. Retrieved 2022-06-20.
The article notes: "馬修真正感到危險來臨，是從內蒙古回到惠州之後。那是2018年初，他的朋友告訴他，當地公安局的人，正拿著他的照片在外國人比較多的酒吧和場所打聽他的消息。 ... 2020年7月馬修將他逃離中國的經歷發佈到YouTube後，視頻至今有125萬多點擊量，一萬多條評論。許多網友對他能夠平安離開中國感到慶幸，也有少數人質疑他是否做了違反中國規定的事情。"
The article notes from Google Translate: "Matthew really felt the danger coming after returning to Huizhou from Inner Mongolia. It was early 2018, and his friend told him that people from the local public security bureau were taking his photo to inquire about him in bars and places with more foreigners. ... After Matthew posted his experience of fleeing China to YouTube in July 2020, the video has so far received more than 1.25 million views and more than 10,000 comments. Many netizens were thankful that he was able to leave China safely, while a few questioned whether he did anything in violation of Chinese regulations."
Frascolla, Bruna (2021-09-20). "Influência chinesa modifica até o conteúdo da enciclopédia da internet" [Chinese influence even modifies the contents of the internet encyclopedia]. Gazeta do Povo (in Portuguese). Archived from the original on 2022-06-20. Retrieved 2022-06-20.
The article notes: "O autor do vídeo, chamado Matthew Tye, informa que este fora desmonetizado pelo YouTube. O título é autoexplicativo, e cabe explicar que Matthew Tye é um norte-americano casado com uma chinesa, e que morou por 10 anos na China até ter que fugir do país por entrevistar pessoas sem ter uma licença de jornalista."
From Google Translate: "The author of the video, named Matthew Tye, reports that it was demonetized by YouTube. The title is self-explanatory, and it should be explained that Matthew Tye is an American married to a Chinese woman, and who lived for 10 years in China until he had to flee the country for interviewing people without having a journalist's license."
- ALT1: ... that Matthew Tye, who had interviewed Chinese people without securing a required journalist's license, uploaded a YouTube video about escaping from China?
- Reviewed: Template:Did you know nominations/WVGB
- Comment: The article was moved to mainspace after Wikipedia:Deletion review/Log/2022 June 20#Matthew Tye was closed as "Allow recreation".

Moved to mainspace by Cunard (talk). Self-nominated at 09:33, 1 July 2022 (UTC).[reply]

Depending on the AFD, I wouldn't mind reviewing this DYK nom once it is done. FacetsOfNonStickPans (talk) 11:42, 3 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

As per the presence of a template (Template:POV), and accordingly as per WP:DYKRULES 4.a. and WP:DYKSG D6 this DYK nom cannot proceed at this stage. The conversation over at Talk:Matthew Tye#Neutrality aims to address the pov template in consideration. While the review is on hold, there seems to be no reason to close this nomination. FacetsOfNonStickPans (talk) 04:06, 9 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Full review needed now that AfD has been closed as "keep" and the neutrality template has been removed from the article. BlueMoonset (talk) 16:48, 9 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

@FacetsOfNonStickPans: Do you still want to review this nom? If not, I can do it now that the POV templates are gone. BuySomeApples (talk) 22:10, 10 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

BuySomeApples, sure, go ahead. Just a quick comment you can cross-check, while the hooks use the word "escape", the article text does not use the word or anything similar; the intro says "immediately leave China", the header for the corresponding section is "Leaving China". Thanks. FacetsOfNonStickPans (talk) 05:29, 11 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

@Cunard and FacetsOfNonStickPans: New enough in mainspace and long enough. QPQ present. Hook facts check out to the Gazeta do Povo source.

I don't know if the word "indoctrination" in "indoctrination video" is too strongly worded? I also note that the article we have on Gazeta do Povo notes it has a conservative bias, which should be mentioned here. I also think that quote is kind of dicey in its translation quality.

The above comment leaves me to suggest this tweak to wording (though I note the characterization of "fleeing" is supported by some of the articles):

ALT0a: ... that Matthew Tye uploaded a YouTube video about leaving China after he heard members of China's public security bureau had shown his photo in bars frequented by foreigners?

Missing signature on the ping, so here we go. @Cunard and FacetsOfNonStickPans: Sammi Brie (she/her • t • c) 00:49, 18 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Sammi Brie, I've been pinged here. As I had mentioned above my comment was "just a quick comment you can cross-check"; while I haven't gone into an-actual-review-kind-of-check following BuySomeApples's comment, the article reads well. Since you have suggested an alternate hook, I assume there needs to be a new reviewer to confirm that?

While the word "escape" may not be mentioned in the article, if a couple of lines are taken together, they can be substituted for the presence of the word. In short, even if "escape" is not literally in the article, usage in the hook can still be considered. The article does have the line- In July 2020, he uploaded a YouTube video about escaping from China and in one year- corresponding to the primary source, accordingly the word can be placed in quotes. FacetsOfNonStickPans (talk) 03:11, 20 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Often if it's a wording tweak that doesn't change the underlying hook fact, I can still approve. Noting that I haven't seen the two suggested copy changes made yet. Sammi Brie (she/her • t • c) 05:03, 20 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

While the word "escape" may not be mentioned in the article and The article does have the line- In July 2020, he uploaded a YouTube video about escaping from China and in one year is contradictory. That part of the hook is based on that sentence in the article.

Here is another source that supports "escaping": Sjöberg, Alexander (2019-07-28). "'De ville ødelægge os psykisk': Den vilde historie om to vestlige YouTube-stjerner, der forelskede sig i Kina, så deres venner blive anholdt og til sidst måtte stikke af" ['They wanted to destroy us mentally': The wild story of two western YouTube stars who fell in love with China, saw their friends get arrested and had to flee in the end]. Politiken (in Danish). Archived from the original on 2022-06-20. Retrieved 2022-06-20.

The article notes: "Af frygt for deres liv - og som minimum af frygt for en tur i fængsel - flyttede Matthew Tye og Winston Sterzel til Los Angeles. Det politiske klima var ganske enkelt blevet for farligt, og i februar begyndtre Tye at sende sine videoer fra USA, ligesom han solgte sin kinesiske lejlighed." The translation is "Fearing for their lives - or at least fearing the prospect of going to prison - Matthew Tye and Winston Sterzel moved to Los Angeles. The political climate had simply become too dangerous, and in February Tye started broadcasting his videos from the US, and he sold his Chinese apartment."

Cunard (talk) 08:32, 24 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I've made two changes to the article based on the suggestions here. Cunard (talk) 08:32, 24 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I would accept the use of escaping as well with the added source (so 0 and 0a are both available), and the textual issues have been resolved. Sammi Brie (she/her • t • c) 02:40, 25 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Neutrality

Note that the neutrality of this article has been questions on this AfD page. Shritwod (talk) 21:37, 3 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

As I wrote in the AfD: "I wrote all of the text in the current version of the article. I did not write the article to "praise its subject". I wrote the article to "describe him" based on all the reliable sources that covered him. Editors who have raised Wikipedia:Neutral point of view concerns have not pointed out which paragraphs, sentences, or phrases are non-neutral. I recommend that editors who consider the article to be non-neutral open a discussion on the article's talk page with specific examples of what is non-neutral and what can be improved. I am open to discussing on the article's talk page whether any content needs to be reworded or whether any content does not comply with Wikipedia:Neutral point of view#Due and undue weight."

From Template:POV#When to remove, "You may remove this template whenever any one of the following is true" including "It is not clear what the neutrality issue is, and no satisfactory explanation has been given."

You added a {{POV}} template to the article but have not pointed out which paragraphs, sentences, or phrases are non-neutral. Please do so.

Cunard (talk) 21:42, 3 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Note to Shritwod: it appears that a lack of response here has resulted in your neutrality template being removed. The AfD has been closed as "keep". BlueMoonset (talk) 16:46, 9 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Noteworthy?

This seems to be self-promotion for a YouTube channel. There are almost no citations relevant to this long-winded adventure story, and I have to wonder what it's doing on Wiki. This guy is unknown. 109.148.131.232 (talk) 06:24, 5 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I agree. This article really does have a concerning amount of biased sources, presented with affirmations of the following sort - [The company ceased communication after Tye and Sterzel requested sources to validate the company's incorrect assertions] - with "incorrect assertions" being an example of a reckless statement, which goes against rule 9 of Wikipedia:Ten simple rules for editing Wikipedia: Write neutrally and with due weight. So, said this, I believe this page to be somewhat compromised. 2804:214:8905:1D5:178D:2ABA:2F6D:1698 (talk) 01:57, 12 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

He does have some articles from reliable news sources on the page, as well as two documentaries that he produced and starred in. We should probably seek to remove the bloat as it does read like self promotion and an adventure story. But he is notable enough for a page. OnceAdream93 (talk) 21:29, 11 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]