Talk:MW 18014

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Needs some kind of reference

Because all V2 test launches are already covered in List_of_V-2_test_launches--Savonneux (talk) 07:04, 22 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

According to the contemporary definitions of "space" in the 1940s the 4th V2 test launch was the first to reach outer space. [1]. The Karman line is a) a sports definition of space and not generally accepted as a scientific definition and b) wasn't adopted by the FAI until 1987. This article is patently WP:OR without a reliable source.--Savonneux (talk) 14:15, 22 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

External links modified

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Karmen line

This rocket is supposed to be significant based on passing the Karmen line, which is not substantiated by the citations on this page. The same claim is made on the main V-2 test launches page and is marked unsubstantiated by the citations on that page. Johnfwhitesell (talk) 20:48, 21 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Restoration

I requested the restoration of the MW 18014 article because of concerns I had about the verification process which prompted the deletion request. Although, it is not clear exactly what fact was missing from the original Astronautix source, I have now added new citations (incl. using a better Wayback Machine timestamp for the astronautix cite) which categorically makes it clear that MW 18014 was the first missile to enter space Oshah (talk) 11:13, 8 June 2019 (UTC)[reply]

no 2600:1700:520:1F00:3875:47F2:2704:EED6 (talk) 02:51, 10 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Confusion about test launch V-4

Hey all, I've noticed some confusion about the 3 October 1942 rocket test that reached over 85km in the edits. Some people believe this is related to the Rheinbote V4, which is not the case. So hopefully, to clarify any ambiguities:

Yes, this was a test of a V2 (known at the time as codename A4).
-- *V-2 being the name of the rocket is a popular misnomer. "V-2" is the name of the program, "A-4" is the name of the rocket. This did not change. It would be as if you called the Saturn V rocket "The apollo rocket". Not wrong, but not right.
Yes, it was intentional that I labelled it test launch "V-4".
Yes, the test *was* designated as "V-4".
No, it was *NOT* a V4 Rheinbote
V-4 represents the Rocket Number of the V2 tested on 3rd October 1942 (think Mission numbers in modern day space missions).
Yes, V-4 is the correct label for the 3 October 1942 test.
No, it is not enough to say the test occurred on October 1942 (there were two A4 launches that month &em it is important for us to disambiguate).

I think the source of the confusion is that V4 refers both to a V2 mission number and a different weapon. With that in mind, I'm going to restore back to the version from the original sources. I will also add a hidden comment telling any future editors to go to the talk page before changing back. --Oshah (talk) 14:41, 11 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Contradiction: MW 18012

The German article on the V2 cites a source claiming that MW 18012 was the first space flight. --91.5.109.82 (talk) 12:07, 8 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I wanted to write the same. The German WP claims that MW 18012, a flight test two days earlier, or even another flight test at the beginning of 1944 reaching 189 km, would have been the first flight above 100 km. So what's true? Glasfaser Wien (talk) 15:29, 2 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

The flight test that reached 189 km (MW 18222), was launched on 24 August 1944. German Wikipedia gets it wrong by putting that launch in "the beginning of 1944".

The reason they got it wrong is because they mistranslated the astronautix website. They took a paragraph from astronautix where the events of 1944 are summarised (including a sentence where MW 18222 reaches 189 km). But in the translation, German wikipedia translated "events of 1944" to "beginning of 1944", and now German wikipedia, on top of believing that every significant V2 development of 1944 occurred on the null of January, assert that MW 18222 launched eight months earlier than it actually did. --Oshah (talk) 17:45, 10 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

MW 18012 is the more interesting launch. MW 18012, alongside MW 18014, MW 170940 and MW 18017 formed part of the same series of vertical tests, of which one of these rockets breached space.

However, German log reports of June 1944 were hampered by lack of detail, and thus reliability. As I recall, the results of all these vertical rocket launches all came from the same single log report of Peenemunde. It is therefore a matter contention whether it was MW 18012, MW 18014 or the other two rockets which reached 176 km.

We're going with what the secondary sources say, which attribute the 176 km launch to MW 18014.

It would be good to get a secondary source corroborating the German log reports used by German wikipedia. I'm particularly interested in the new source from German wikipedia that says MW 18012 attained 125km apogee. --Oshah (talk) 17:46, 10 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Attempts to privatise

The source doesn't seem to agree with that at all? From the source https://web.archive.org/web/20100408082721/http://www.astronautix.com/chrono/19441.htm: Virtually all A4 systems were developed by the engineers at Peenemuende rather than by industry. Some said that it would have been better handled by industry, but in fact there was no such thing as rocket technology when Von Braun's team began their work - it all had to be created. References: 693. "Some said but it was impossible" is not really an attempt to privatise — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.37.35.127 (talk) 10:06, 25 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]

That episode was definitely an attempt to privatise the team. However, if you need a citation that explicitly labels the SS's interventions to be a "privatisation", you can find it on the second page of the timeline https://web.archive.org/web/20100408082721/http://www.astronautix.com/chrono/19442.htm. Oshah (talk) 14:44, 18 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]