Talk:Israel Zolli

Inappropriate

Why is there a picture of Martin Luther on this page, down where it says tha this article is a stub? Wouldn't it be better to have a picture of Christ or something?

Then the Christianity bio template should be edited with a different picture. But don't remove it from the article - yes, I know the picture of Luther is distasteful to many Jews, Catholics, and others, but that is no good reason to move the template from articles - after all, wikipedia is no place for POV, however justified it may appear to us. It IS a good reason, however, to edit the template and find a better image. David Cannon 10:27, 26 June 2006 (UTC)

disputed

1. The article claims that Trieste was under Austrian control in 1920. I don't think so. Trieste was part of Austria-Hungary, but not of Austria after 1918.
2. The article claims that Zolli was baptized as Eugenio Pacelli in 1945. "Eugenio Zolli" is more likely.
3. I have some doubts about the name Bodji, too; it does not sound Galician at all, but I may be mistaken.

-- Austrian 00:08, 2 September 2005 (UTC) no reference is made to zolli's abandoning of the jewish community to seek refuge in the vatican during ww II. when he returned, the jews refused to recognizew him as their leader. he converted shortly thereafter see encyclopedia judaica.217.132.235.87 13:49, 6 November 2005 (UTC)

Previous concerns

Trieste does seem to have been transferred from Austrian or Austro-Hungarian to Italian authority at the end of World War One, although I can't say whether it was before or after Zolli became the chief rabbi there. Having said that, I'm not sure it's absolutely necessary to even address the issue (in this article).

Other websites seem to confirm that he took the name "Eugenio" but not the last name "Pacelli" (indeed my understanding of induction into the Church is that you would be given a Christian name, i.e., John, Michael, etc., but not a new last name).

64.0.113.158 17:24, 18 September 2005 (UTC)

POV

"This summary seems to be slightly biased, as many Jews took refuge in Vatican monasteries from 1943 to 1944, when Nazi deportations to concentration camps started in Italy, which until 1943 had been relatively "safe" despite Fascist rule."

This is extreme POV. It is not for Wikipedians to decide to edit other's memoirs and encyclopaedia notes even if they disagree and begs the question of censorship/apologetics.

karas 08:39, 8 July 2006 (UTC)

I agree with the removal explained above. It at least is not worded in NPOV fasion. Also, the rationale behind "singeling out" Zolli was propbably his position as Rabbi.

However, the removal further down I cannot agree with. It mutilated an existing sentence, implying that Zolli had secretly converted in 1937. Which is nonsense. Not the conversion but the spiritual quest began in 1937. Str1977 ^{(smile back)} 09:24, 8 July 2006 (UTC)

This article is very biased. "He hid at the Vatican really??" The vatican hid over 60,000 jews on papal estates, the Swiss guard trippled in size to take in Italian jews who could live safely in the Vatican. When the nazis demanded gold for the Roman jews Pius wa going to melt down all the Vatican could offer, he was stopped by Italian women who gave up their wedding bands instead —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.175.76.65 (talk) 17:45, 29 March 2009 (UTC)

I don't think the above critique by 24.175.76.65 is correct. There were a lot of Jews hiding in Vatican buildings, but 60,000 seems like an overstatement. Also, re the gold, Jewish representatives asked Pius to loan them some 1/3rd, I think, if they couldn't gather the amount needed; he said yes, but in the end the Jews collected the necessary amount themselves and the Vatican provided none. Randomalphanumericstring (talk) 05:19, 6 December 2023 (UTC)

Zolli or Zoller?

Xx236 09:15, 7 November 2006 (UTC)

According to the Italian Wikipedia page Eugenio Zolli, his name in the lede sentence appears thus: Eugenio Pio Zolli nato Israel Anton Zoller. That looks definitive. I believe the page name here should be changed and content edited to match. -- Deborahjay (talk) 14:12, 13 February 2013 (UTC)

misunderstanding in Jane Scrivener 's book and the destruction of the files

Scrivener writes: "The Rabbi did not destroy his registers and they know where every Jews lives." but previously she writes: "the German authorities sent for the Chief Rabbi and told him that unless by midday today the Jews delivered one million lire and fifty kilogrammes of gold"... the problem is that the 'rabbi' who had the meeting with Kappler was Foà and not Zolli! Zolli never met Kappler. So Scrivener is blaiming Foà and not Zolli.
Was Zolli who asked the Community to destroy the files and was Foà who refuted: "Zolli then urged Foà to destroy the community's list of Roman Jews, but Foà did nothing."[1] "A bitter controversy arose over Foà's failure to destroy the community's lists"[2]

Fixed

I went ahead and condensed the article into less sections, removed some unsourced info from 2011, added a source, and removed some out of place content. I know nothing of this man myself, I simply stumbled on an article that was too fragmented and decided to lend a hand. Hope it help! 98.198.85.83 (talk) 00:00, 3 January 2013 (UTC)

"his villainous behavior"

Are you serious? outreachjudaism.org - is an authoritative source? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Алессия (talk • contribs) 14:29, 11 December 2014 (UTC)

External links modified

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More sources

This is a fairly exhaustive list of sources from an internet search and Google scholar search as of April 2019:

• "1954 Autobiography of Rabbi Who Converted Is Published". Zenit. 16 February 2004.
• "Keys to Understanding the Conversion of Rabbi Zolli of Rome: Interview With Alberto Latorre". Zenit. 25 April 2004.
• Arbez, Edward P. (1951). "Book Review: The Jewish People and Jesus Christ". Theological Studies. 12 (4). SAGE: 594–597. doi:10.1177/004056395101200430. ISSN 0040-5639.
• "Before the Dawn: the Mysterious Conversion of Rome's Chief Rabbi". Inside the Vatican. February 1999. pp. 78–83.
• Cabaud, Judith (2000). Eugenio Zolli, ou, Le prophete d'un monde nouveau [Eugenio Zolli: Prophet of a new world] (in French). FX de Guibert.
• Cabaud, Judith (2002). Il rabbino che s' arrese a Cristo [The rabbi who surrendered to Christ] (in Italian). del Mar Velasco.
• Cabaud, Judith (2018). La tradition hébraïque dans l'Eucharistie [The Hebrew tradition in the Eucharist] (in French). Artège Editions. ISBN 979-10-336-0680-2.
• Carozzi, P.A. (2009). Israel-Eugenio Zolli: un semitista tra religioni e storia [Israel-Eugenio Zolli: A Semitic scholar between religions and history]. Percorsi (Università di Verona. Dipartimento di filosofia) (in Italian). Il poligrafo. ISBN 978-88-7115-510-4.
• Caturelli, Alberto (2009). "Meditación sobre Eugenio Zolli y el sentido sobrenatural del pueblo judío" [Meditation on Eugenio Zolli and the supernatural sense of the Jewish people] (PDF). Verbo: Revista de formación cívica y de acción cultural, según el derecho natural y cristiano (in Spanish) (473). Madrid: 329–338.
• Dom Antoine Marie (1 September 2003). "Eugenio Zolli". Abbey Saint Joseph in Flavigny.
• Duquin, L.H. (2003). A Century of Catholic Converts. Our Sunday Visitor. ISBN 978-1-61278-236-2.
• Foa, Anna (20 February 2010). "The rabbi who studied Jesus". L'Osservatore Romano.
• Goldman, S. (2015). Jewish-Christian Difference and Modern Jewish Identity: Seven Twentieth-Century Converts. Lexington Books. ISBN 978-0-7391-9609-0.
• Goldman, Shalom (4 March 2016). "After WWII, Rome's Chief Rabbi Shockingly Became a Catholic". Tablet Magazine.
• Green, David B. (27 September 2013). "1944: An Italian chief rabbi sees Jesus on Yom Kippur". Haaretz.
• Klyber, A. B. (1945). "The Chief Rabbi's Conversion". The Catholic Digest. p. 9296.
• Latorre, Alberto (2001). From Israel Zoller to Eugene Zolli: Itinerary of a Scholar in Search (Thesis). University of Verona.
• Marchione, M. (2002). Consensus and Controversy: Defending Pope Pius XII. Paulist Press. p. 108ff. ISBN 978-0-8091-4083-1.
• "My Father Never Stopped Being a Jew". Inside the Vatican. Urbi et Orbi Communications. February 1999. pp. 79–81.
• Neuhaus, David M. (1988). "Jewish conversion to the Catholic Church". Pastoral Psychology. 37 (1). Springer Nature: 38–52. doi:10.1007/bf01763916. ISSN 0031-2789.
• Newman, Loius I. (1956). "ZOLLI, EUGENIO, Before the Dawn: Autobiographical Reflections" (Book Review). Jewish Social Studies. 18: 75.
• Riccardi, A. (2012) [2008]. L'inverno più lungo: 1943-44: Pio XII, gli ebrei e i nazisti a Roma [The longest winter: 1943-44: Pius XII, the Jews and the Nazis in Rome]. Economica Laterza (in Italian). Editori Laterza. ISBN 978-88-581-0371-5.
• Rigano, G. (2009). "Aspetti della cultura ebraica italiana nella prima metà del'900. Levi Della Vida, Cassuto e Zolli sulla cattedra di Ebraico della "Sapienza"" [Aspects of Italian Jewish culture in the first half of the 1900s: Levi Della Vida, Cassuto, and Zolli in the chair of Hebrew of "Sapienza"]. Quaderni di diritto e politica ecclesiastica (in Italian). 17 (1): 165–190. doi:10.1440/29192.
• Rigano, Gabriele (2006). Il Caso Zolli: L'itinerario Di Un Intellettuale In Bilico Tra Fedi, Culture E Nazioni [The case of Zolli: The journey of an intellectual caught between faiths, cultures and nations] (in Italian). Milano: Guerini studio. ISBN 978-88-8335-759-6. OCLC 70198136.
• Schoeman, R. (2007). Honey from the Rock: Sixteen Jews Find the Sweetness of Christ. Ignatius Press. ISBN 978-1-58617-115-5.
• Schwarz, Guri (28 September 2009). "The Reconstruction of Jewish Life in Italy after World War II". Journal of Modern Jewish Studies. 8 (3). Informa UK: 360–377. doi:10.1080/14725880903263093. ISSN 1472-5886.
• Magister, Sandro (10 February 2017). "The Jew, Jesus, Who Changed the Life of the Chief Rabbi of Rome". chiesa.espresso.repubblica.it. Translated by Sherry, Matthew.
• Sillanpoa, W. P.; Weisbord, R. G. (1989). "The Baptized Rabbi of Rome: The Zolli Case". Judaism. 38 (1): 74ff.
• Sillanpoa, W. P.; Weisbord, R. G. (1989). "The Zolli Conversion: Background and Motives". Judaism. 38 (2): 203ff.
• Singer, D. G. (1985). "Has God Truly Abrogated the Mosaic Covenant?: American Catholic Attitudes toward Judaism as Reflected in Catholic Thought, 1945-1977". Jewish Social Studies: 243–254. JSTOR 4467301.
• Singer, Tovia. "Why did the Chief Rabbi of Rome Convert to Catholicism?". Outreach Judaism.
• Sklarin, Y. (22 September 2009). ""Rushing in Where Angels Fear to Tread": Rabbi Joseph B. Soloveitchik, The Rabbinical Council of America, Modern Orthodox Jewry and the Second Vatican Council". Modern Judaism. 29 (3). Oxford University Press (OUP): 351–385. doi:10.1093/mj/kjp015. ISSN 0276-1114.
• Sparrow, Stephen (5 September 2005). "Eugenio Zolli's Path to Rome". Ignatius Insight.
• "The Chief Rabbi's Conversion". Catholic Answers. 17 February 1945.
• "The conversion of Rabbi Zolli". District of the USA. 16 October 2013.
• Tobias, Norman C. (2017). "Salvation is from the Jews". Jewish Conscience of the Church. Cham: Springer International Publishing. doi:10.1007/978-3-319-46925-6_12. ISBN 978-3-319-46924-9.
• Weisbord, R.G.; Sillanpoa, W.P. (1992). The Chief Rabbi, the Pope, and the Holocaust: An Era in Vatican-Jewish Relations. Transaction Publishers. ISBN 978-1-4128-3615-9.

Daask (talk) 17:25, 23 April 2019 (UTC)

Israel or Eugenio

Sorry for the anonymous edit (just a passer by), and thank you for the work done in creating this page. Serious question. Isn't titling this page "Israel" a form of deadnaming? Thank you and apologies if this is inappropriate. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2001:B07:ADD:C4B2:AD94:2E1A:DDDE:D7B (talk) 16:44, 27 January 2021 (UTC)

Austrian by birth?

that's a bit misleading especially since the link leads to modern Austria. As it says below he was born in the Austro Hungarian Empire true enough, the province of Galicia modern day Ukraine 2607:FEA8:FF01:4FA6:D836:B2EC:F10F:F334 (talk) 16:08, 4 December 2024 (UTC)