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GA Review

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Passed. Matthew Yeager (talk) 20:41, 14 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

GA toolbox
Reviewing
This review is transcluded from Talk:Hayes Manufacturing Company/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Nominator: CosXZ (talk · contribs) 22:35, 6 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Reviewer: Matthew Yeager (talk · contribs) 16:40, 5 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]


I'll be taking a look at the nomination and review how it matches up against the good article criteria. In the event of an unsuccessful nomination, I'll look to provide recommendations and a path forward for your consideration. Matthew Yeager (talk) 16:40, 5 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

@CosXZ: Congratulations! and Thank You!! for putting in the effort to get this article in shape. I thought it was going to be too much work, but you took the feedback to heart. I just gave the article a fresh read and it meets the criteria for Good Article. Matthew Yeager (talk) 20:34, 14 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]


Good Article review progress box
Criteria: 1a. prose () 1b. MoS () 2a. ref layout () 2b. cites WP:RS () 2c. no WP:OR () 2d. no WP:CV ()
3a. broadness () 3b. focus () 4. neutral () 5. stable () 6a. free or tagged images () 6b. pics relevant ()
Note: this represents where the article stands relative to the Good Article criteria. Criteria marked are unassessed

Overall

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Great start with a workable outline and initial history. Each section needs significant improved with additional references and broader coverage. I'll cover each section below. It would take some time to get the article into shape, and so I will mark this nomination as failed. We can still talk about the feedback and your perspective, over the next few days before this nomination is closed. After that, you can use this as a list to work from, or further discuss changes on the article's talk page for others that may be interested in helping. Matthew Yeager (talk) 19:09, 10 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Lead

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IMO, the goal of the lead is to imagine it being the only section a viewer may read. Let's give them all the notable information with context, and allow them to pursue the rest of the article for follow-ups or any details. There are many approaches and no right answer. I like to think of the lead as concise outline for the rest of the article. Let me give an example:

The Hayes Manufacturing Company, also known as Hayes, was a Canadian manufacturer specializing in heavy equipment vehicles. Founded in 1928 as Hayes-Anderson, Hayes developed custom trucks and off-road vehicles to expanded with the local forestry industry in Vancouver. Before World War II, Hayes had diversified into streamliner buses, while afterwards they expanded into on-highway semi-trailer trucks. In 1969, Mack Trucks acquired a majority stake in Hayes before ultimately being sold off to Paccar five years later. Hayes ceased operations in 1976.
This is just one example, and organizes the article to answer the following questions:
  • How were they formed/founded and what happened to go from Hayes-Anderson to Hayes? (History)
Organization within Paccar highlights different periods around incorporation, WWII, post-war, etc which might line up here too.
  • What is significant about the forestry industry in Vancouver? Local competition? Vancouver-city collaboration? (It seems they provided water trucks, transit buses, fire trucks, etc).
  • How was the process of investment, acquisition, and ultimately shut-down?
  • How did they expand their offering as well as continue forestry development? (Products) Fire trucks.
  • While the red link of The Signal Company is not disqualifying within the article, it could be better suited within the article instead of the lead. There are few references within Mack Trucks of Signal and so maybe you'd want to expand information there first. From what I saw, there were references which mention the company more colloquially as Mack Truck.
  • Again not strictly required to show notability within the lead, right now there isn't much to understand why there might be an article. I attempted to make reference to how they grew alongside/with a dominate forestry industry -- you'd know better than me.

I implemented your design for the lead. Cos (X + Z) 00:31, 11 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

checkY Great, and you didn't need to use exactly that example, but that works too. I'll move down the last item in this section, which is just the difference in company name on the infobox. Matthew Yeager (talk) 06:48, 11 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Company Naming

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  • Mismatch between article name (Hayes Manufacturing Company), lead (Hayes Manufacturing Company Limited), and info-box (Hayes Manufacturing Company Ltd.). Within the lead they are referenced as Hayes without first mentioning "also known as".
  • removed Ltd. From infobox
checkY Matthew Yeager (talk) 20:34, 14 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Infobox

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  • Would be great to have an image which showcases their main use case in the forestry industry.
  • added
Thanks for adding the image - this one looks amazing! @CosXZ: Would you mention how you found the licensing for the image to be CC BY-SA 4.0? Matthew Yeager (talk) 06:48, 11 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
@Matthew Yeager I have a question, what copyright template should I use for the image as it came from a book? Cos (X + Z) 16:22, 11 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
@CosXZ: I'm going to guess that the photo is copyright protected by the photographer (Dave Mcintosh Collection?). What might make sense is to bring the source/book and photo to the folks at the media copyright questions for a more informed answer. You'll need to have this sorted out before we could move the review forward. Matthew Yeager (talk) 00:01, 13 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
I'm working on it, just need more information. Cos (X + Z) 16:11, 13 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
@Matthew Yeager, Looks like your dreams aren’t coming long-time true, as the photo is going to be deleted on the 20th due to the photo not having permission. I will revert back to the original infobox image. Cos (X + Z) 14:40, 14 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
Ugh - but I'm still dreaming. I think I'll send a few emails requesting copyright permission from photographers. Hopefully someone is interested in sharing appreciation for Hayes. Matthew Yeager (talk) 20:34, 14 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

History

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  • Very few citations exist within the text. Perhaps one citation is covering many sentences, but what would provide more value is the collaboration of multiple reliable sources. The first paragraph would look like this with tags added:
The Hayes Manufacturing Company was established in Vancouver in 1920 by Douglas Hayes, an owner of a parts dealer[citation needed], and entrepreneur W. E. Anderson from Quadra Island[citation needed], as Hayes-Anderson Motor Company Ltd. The company sold truck parts for the first two years, then built their own trucks. The company was renamed Hayes Manufacturing Company Ltd. after Anderson left the company in 1928. Despite Anderson leaving the company, the trucks kept the Hayes-Anderson badging until 1934[citation needed]. In 1935, Hayes added diesel engines to their trucks; the first logging truck manufacturing company to do so[citation needed]. Throughout the late 1930s, Hayes was a distributor of British-made Leyland trucks, and the Leyland trucks supplemented Hayes' range of trucks. The company also used Leyland's components for the trucks.
  • Three employees leaving -- was that important? Was it amicable?
  • yes it is important as at that time, Hayes was the only successful British Columbian truck manufacturer, so three employees leaving to start their own truck company would have been notable. Cos (X + Z) 16:47, 11 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
checkY Matthew Yeager (talk) 20:34, 14 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
  • Need to introduce the concept of the HDX. Only reference in the article is the photo caption A Hayes WHDX 70-170 ballast tractor. It just appears as an acronym with no explanation.
  • Find a way to integrate your note Historian ... claims ... start year ... of the HDX was 1949" if it is a significant/reliable viewpoint. You could also step back on the specificity by paraphrasing "by the early 1950s, production of the HDX..."
Three employees – Vic Barclay, Mac Billingsley and Claude Thick – left Hayes to start Pacific Trucks in 1947[citation needed]. Hayes merged with Lawrence Manufacturing in 1949. In 1952, the company started manufacturing the HDX, which was the most successful truck[how?] manufactured by Hayes[citation needed]. The Signal Company, the parent firm of Mack Trucks, acquired a two-thirds share in Hayes Manufacturing in 1969, and Hayes began a mass expansion[how?][citation needed]. The company was renamed Hayes Trucks in 1971. The company at its peak had 600 employees and three plants[citation needed]. In 1975, Signal sold the company to Gearmatic Co., a subsidiary of Paccar, which closed the Hayes plants and stopped production[why?].
  • Claims need quantified or sourced throughout the industry, like "most successful truck", "mass expansion".
  • Hayes merged with Lawrence Manufacturing in 1949. In the source "American Semi Trucks" by Stan Holtzman it dates the merger as 1946.
  • fixed
checkY Matthew Yeager (talk) 20:34, 14 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

See Also

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  • Please annotate the links to give detail that the first was founded by 3 employees, and the second was founded in 1987 and primarily rebuilt Hayes heavy trucks.
  • done
checkY Matthew Yeager (talk) 06:48, 11 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
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  • Is the linked site providing value? I'm not sure how notable the "club" is and the website seemed to have very limited capabilities, as well as content. Unfortunately the images are licensed CC BY-NC-ND and therefore "are not permitted as such licenses do not allow totally free, credited use."
  • removed
checkY Matthew Yeager (talk) 06:48, 11 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
  • If you decide it is useful to have the Trucking industry in the United States template (but why? This is a Canadian company.) consider adding |state=collapsed. For me, the template is larger than the total text within the article.
  • added |state=collapsed
checkY Thanks! Matthew Yeager (talk) 06:48, 11 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Topics

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  • I found some notable innovations developed by Hayes that could have expanded coverage, that I have not verified: first use of diesel engines, development of dual axles, production of self-loading trailers, and significance of their motto "Built to Last".

Potential Resources

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The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Did you know nomination

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(
)
  • ... that a bulldog bought two-thirds of the letter "-H-" in 1971?
  • Source: Francis, Daniel (September 1, 2012). Robertson, Pam (ed.). Trucking in British Columbia: An Illustrated History. Madeira Park, British Columbia, Canada: Harbour Publishing. p. 81. ISBN 978-1-55017-561-5.
  • Reviewed:
Improved to Good Article status by CosXZ (talk). Number of QPQs required: 0. Nominator has fewer than 5 past nominations.

Cos (X + Z) 14:59, 15 January 2025 (UTC).[reply]

General: Article is new enough and long enough
Policy: Article is sourced, neutral, and free of copyright problems

Hook eligibility:

  • Cited: Yes - Offline/paywalled citation accepted in good faith
  • Interesting: Yes
  • Other problems: No - Thank you for your work on the article! The hook is certainly interesting, but IMO it doesn't provide enough context to the reader, and the article doesn't mention the letter "-H-" anywhere. Are there any other possible hooks?
QPQ: None required.

Overall: '''[[User:CanonNi]]''' (talk • contribs) 13:12, 16 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

  • @CanonNi: the "-H-" is Hayes signature hood ornament.
    For example, take a look at the bullbar.
  • But if you want, I'll give you another hook:
ALT1: ... that the Hayes Manufacturing Company were the first logging truck manufacturing company to introduce diesel engines to their trucks in 1933.

Source: Holtzman, Stan (1995). American Semi Trucks. Osceola, Wisconsin: Motorbooks International. p. 46. ISBN 978-1610605731.

-Cos (X + Z) 15:13, 16 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
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