Talk:Emmett Till

Anyone interested in copy editing?

Hello, friends. I wrote this article back in 2010. This was before Carolyn Bryant Donham came out with her statements, so a lot has happened since I wrote it and retired from Wikipedia.

As a result, the article has lost cohesion which happens when a lot of editors add info. It needs a good copy edit. I'm asking if anyone is interested in getting it back into shape with me. If so, I'll start a sandbox and we can start there.

If not, I can try it myself but don't @ me with ya nasty comments when it's posted. I don't intend to watch it after I'm done so it will need to be watched by someone who has a regular presence here. That's easier to do when you know the source material.

I'll wait a few days for replies. Moni3 (talk) 16:09, 15 January 2024 (UTC)

"Hello, friends. I wrote this article back in 2010. This was before Carolyn Bryant Donham came out with her statements, so a lot has happened since I wrote it and retired from Wikipedia."

Which "statements" were you referring to? The only statements I'm familiar with were by Duke history professor Timothy Tyson, who had previously supported the Duke Rape Hoax. Tyson asserted that Carolyn Bryant Donham had recanted her court room testimony during a tape recorded interview with him. However, after Tyson had deposited the audiotape with the UNC archive, UNC reported that the tape contained no recantation by Mrs. Donham. Again, which "statements"?!2603:7000:B23D:C116:F9D0:B547:E089:EF39 (talk) 20:57, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

The other "statements" referred to may be Bryant's memoir, I Am More Than a Wolf Whistle, which was leaked in 2022. This article says it was leaked by an "anonymous" source, but the article about the memoir says that Tyson was responsible for the "leak." Which is correct? Muzilon (talk) 05:34, 20 May 2024 (UTC)

Correct. It's extremely unlikely that Bryant ever made such a statement of recantation to Tyson. All we have is hearsay among three people in a room - one claiming something was said and the other two denying it was said. But think about it logically, why would Bryant go out of her way to make her life difficult by telling her side of the story, only to recant it decades later and then immediately deny recanting it. It makes zero sense.

So, in order to adhere to high standards of neutrality and objectivity, Wikipedia needs to thread extremely carefully with hearsay. From the 'Encounter between Till and Carolyn Bryant' section, the following should be deleted: "According to historian Timothy Tyson, Bryant admitted to him in a 2008 interview that her testimony during the trial that Till had made verbal and physical advances was false. Bryant had testified Till grabbed her waist and uttered obscenities but later told Tyson, "that part's not true." As for the rest of what happened, the 72-year-old stated she could not remember. Bryant is quoted by Tyson as saying, "Nothing that boy did could ever justify what happened to him." However, the tape recordings that Tyson made of the interviews with Bryant do not contain Bryant saying this. In addition, Bryant's daughter-in-law, who was present during Tyson's interviews, says that Bryant never said it."

I have no problem with this likely fraudulent recantation being left in the 'Later Events' section so readers can make up their own minds. 137.43.106.63 (talk) 15:21, 19 July 2024 (UTC)

Was Emmett Till born out of wedlock?

"Emmett Till was born to Mamie Carthan and Louis Till on July 25, 1941, in Chicago." My understanding has always been that Till's parents were married at the time of his birth. The sentence in the article implies that they were not married. If they were married, the sentence should read, Emmett Till was born to Mamie and Louis Till on July 25, 1941, in Chicago. 2603:7000:B23D:C116:F9D0:B547:E089:EF39 (talk) 21:15, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

Your understanding is correct, Emmett was born approximately 9 months after Mamie and Louis married (so probably conceived in wedlock). It isn't unusual to refer to the mother in that fashion, in order to introduce her 'born' name, but it is potentially misleading, so I will rephrase. Her 'born' name isn't much used and isn't important in this article. Pincrete (talk) 05:02, 20 May 2024 (UTC)

That's quite an assumption. My parents were married years before I was born, but retained the names they were born with. My wife and I were married the year before our oldest child was born, and we too retained the names we were born with. SlackerInc1 (talk) 06:33, 3 August 2024 (UTC)

Not sure what my assumption was. My wife also retains her 'born' name, on both formal documents and informal situations. Occasionally she hyphenates mine after hers, but that is a relatively recent custom. AFAIK, nothing suggests that Till's mother used her 'single' while married, or (I believe) even after her first husband's death, so using her married name is apt. Pincrete (talk) 19:18, 3 August 2024 (UTC)

She probably followed the custom for respect in that day and time, so that she would be referred to publicly as Mrs. Till. Alanscottwalker (talk) 20:32, 3 August 2024 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 4 October 2024

In section: Works inspired by Emmett Till -> Other

A book was published in September, 2024 by Wright Thompson titled "The Barn - The Secret History of a Murder in Mississippi".

Here is the link to the book:

https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/679066/the-barn-by-wright-thompson/ Fearfulinoculum (talk) 00:56, 4 October 2024 (UTC)

 Done. Thanks for the info. A. Randomdude0000 (talk) 03:15, 4 October 2024 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 15 November 2024

I've stumbled on some fascinating facts about both Emmett Till and Fred Hampton that merit further research. They were both born in Argo-Summit, IL. (I was born in that school district. Emmett was killed on my third birthday.) I thought it an odd coincidence that two prominent names in the civil rights struggle of the sixties were both born there. The black neighborhood in Argo Summit is just five or six square blocks. When I read Mamie Till's "Death of Innocence" I understood what was going on. The Mobley family (her mother's side) were prominent as the 'activists' of that tiny community. Anyone coming up from the south contacted Mamie's mom first, who found them a place to crash and made sure they were fed, till they got settled, usually at the corn plant. Everyone in the neighborhood knew that Mrs. Mobley kept her front door key under the welcome mat in case they needed to make a phone call while she was out. She kept a bowl next to the phone where people could leave their nickels. Every Sunday she made a feast the whole neighborhood was welcome to. It was the energy and spirit of the Mobley family that was the precursor to the politics surrounding Emmett Till's martyrdom, and Fred Hampton's as well. Interestingly, both of them spent their first nine years there. A strong spirit of communal overcoming, a few individuals enabling the many to move forward existed there. In short, Emmett and Fred were both killed because they grew up immersed in the mindset of that community that was remarkably empowered for the times, too threatening to those in power. In 1966 the 'Argo Race Riot' occurred. The history of that should also be researched.

This would be a wonderful topic for a young scholar to delve into more deeply. I doubt there's even a historical marker in Argo about any of these people. Karris828 (talk) 03:35, 15 November 2024 (UTC)

Karris828, unfortunately, we do not do research or publish any content that has not already been published in reliable sources (books, journals, news articles, etc). So we cannot use this info, interesting though it is.Pincrete (talk) 06:00, 15 November 2024 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 15 November 2024

I've stumbled on some fascinating facts about both Emmett Till and Fred Hampton that merit further research. They were both born in Argo-Summit, IL. (Emmett was killed on my third birthday.) I thought it an odd coincidence that two prominent names in the civil rights struggle of the sixties were both born there. The black neighborhood in Argo Summit is just five or six square blocks. When I read Mamie Till's "Death of Innocence" I understood what was going on. The Mobley family (her mother's side) were prominent as the 'activists' of that tiny community. Anyone coming up from the south contacted Mamie's mom first, who found them a place to crash and made sure they were fed, till they got settled, usually at the corn plant. Everyone in the neighborhood knew that Mrs. Mobley kept her front door key under the welcome mat in case they needed to make a phone call while she was out. She kept a bowl next to the phone where people could leave their nickels. Every Sunday she made a feast the whole neighborhood was welcome to. It was the energy and spirit of the Mobley family, and community culture they created that was the precursor to the politics surrounding Emmett Till's martyrdom, and Fred Hampton's as well. Interestingly, both of them spent their first nine years there. A strong spirit of communal overcoming, a few individuals enabling the many to move forward existed there. In short, Emmett and Fred were both killed because the mindset and leadership of that community was much too empowered for the times, too threatening to those in power. In 1966 the 'Argo Race Riot' occurred there. The history of that should also be researched.

This would be a wonderful topic for a young scholar to delve into more deeply. Karris828 (talk) 16:30, 15 November 2024 (UTC)

 Not done: This isn't the right place to present original research, nor is it a discussion forum. The edit request form is for requesting specific, non-controversial edits to the page. PianoDan (talk) 16:49, 15 November 2024 (UTC)

Just to be clear, Mobley was the family name of Mamie (Till)'s final husband. Mamie's maiden name was Carthan, and at least according to this perhaps unreliable source, her mother's maiden name was Smith.[1]. Alanscottwalker (talk) 16:47, 16 November 2024 (UTC)