Talk:2024 Sambhal violence/Archive 1

Archive 1

Additional Perspective on 2024 Sambhal Violence

A video surfaced on Twitter showing people with the survey team chanting "Jai Shri Ram" slogans, which might have triggered the violence after the team left the mosque. As this has not been reported in mainstream media, it may not meet inclusion standards yet. reliable sources should be monitored to potentially add this perspective in the future. Sahil023 (talk) 20:17, 25 November 2024 (UTC)

Even if it did happen , does that justifies voilence? 103.112.8.63 (talk) 11:45, 28 November 2024 (UTC)

the correct information is below with article kindly make changes

An ASI board has been installed here and it is an ASI protected area.ASI conducts surveys twice a year. Being ASI protected property any kind of worship is not allowed.At that time of violence, advocates from both sides, committee members, the head of the mosque and the Imam were also present at the mosque. They also appealed for peace from the mosque. Photography was being done from the top. However during the survey an ablution tank had to be drained for videography purposes. This led to a confusion among those gathered outside as they believed excavation was taking place and it provoked the crowd. However the tank is regularly emptied every week. Meanwhile some miscreants started to throw bricks at police which lead to response from police firing rubber bullets. This further provoked the crowd leading to stone pelting. News is available in many prominent indian news agency websites. Prohibited00 (talk) 12:39, 28 November 2024 (UTC)

Provocation (lead section)

The lead section could fail WP:NPOV and WP:V since the citations used for the claim for provocation were the following:
1. Opinion Piece from Wire; opinion articles cannot be used for verification of factual details.
2. The Hindutva Watch source mentions that locals resisted the court-ordered survey team where no causation has been established between chanting of the slogans and eruption of violence.
3. The Telegraph also quotes the claims of Opposition MPs but does not give a factual statement.
4. TimelineDaily's report contradicts The Hindu's ground report which does not mention the slogans at all credits it to the misintereptation of the drying up of the tank which was interpreted as mosque being dug up.

I would be going ahead with using The Hindu as the primary factual source mainly due to it's WP:RS/PS status while leaving this TP discussion for further discussion. Xoocit (talk) 18:09, 2 December 2024 (UTC)

User:Cerium4B tagging you here, I removed an opinion piece that was being used as a factual citation. Xoocit (talk) 18:28, 2 December 2024 (UTC)

But do other media outlets mention or refute the claim?

I also added a Twitter post (as per WP:TWITTER), where the people accompanying the survey committee chanted the slogan "Jai Shri Ram". (see)

However it can be mentioned as a claim to keep the WP:NPOV - Cerium4B • Talk? • 19:43, 2 December 2024 (UTC)

My point is that there is not established correlation between the chanting of the slogans and the riots that broke out. The timeline given by reliable sources do not mention the causation of the breakout, only the mention of the draining of water and the riots. It's better to follow that series of events while keeping both the side's (the lawyer and the opposition MPs) version mentioned in the events tab.

No need for the tweet, it's already established that there was chanting of slogans but we would need to establish a connection that the violence was a direct result of the chanting of the slogans.

Another use of WP:TWITTER could be the one tweet mentioned by User:119.42.59.51 which mentions a timeline of events, it's easier to establish causation looking at a timeline rather than standable events. Xoocit (talk) 22:02, 2 December 2024 (UTC)

Incorrect order of events

The article states "While the first survey had proceeded peacefully, tension never escalated during the second survey while entering the harihar temple named as jama mosque but when Vishnu Shankar jain was returning from temple converted to mosque, some people who were standing on the way, when they saw Vishnu Shankar jain is returned safely they got emotional and chanted jai shree ram. In mosque noone sid jai shree ram ,this is fake narrative spread by samajwadi party there. In normal street where namaz is performed 5 times and it's heard even in temples, people just took law and order in their hand for no reason.

The sources only quote this as a claim by opposition MPs and not as a fact. This is not a reliable source. In fact, the slogans were raised only after 11 am, when advocate Vishnu Jain had already exited the disputed property. This is seen on video.

https://x.com/swati_gs/status/1863538549611745488 119.42.59.51 (talk) 18:11, 2 December 2024 (UTC)

“Unexplained revert”

@Aliyiya5903: I noticed you reverted my removal of the "Muslims" part in the infobox and called my removal "unexplained", despite me clearly giving a reason in the edit summary. If this'll be edit-warred on, let's at least try to avoid it before it happens and discuss. :) E_F⁵ 02:38, 3 December 2024 (UTC)

Apologies for the oversight. I didn’t noticed your edit reverted the edits made by another user without explanation. Aliyiya5903 (talk) 07:20, 3 December 2024 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 3 December 2024

Please remove the below para from the article:

Why? Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 12:28, 3 December 2024 (UTC)

 Not done - No reason provided for the removal. - Ratnahastin (talk) 01:09, 4 December 2024 (UTC)

Pakistani Hand

Recent development shows that police has found one shell made in pakistan, and I feel this information should be added to this article@Gråbergs Gråa Sång Mavrick2022 (talk) 04:53, 4 December 2024 (UTC)

NDTV article : https://www.ndtv.com/india-news/shocker-in-sambhal-violence-probe-cops-find-made-in-pak-bullets-7164250

Times Of India article: https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/city/bareilly/sambhal-violence-cartridges-from-pakistan-and-usa-found/articleshow/115942331.cms Mavrick2022 (talk) 05:05, 4 December 2024 (UTC)