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The following is an archived discussion of a featured article nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured article candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The article was promoted 15:54, 26 July 2007.

William Bruce (architect)

[edit]

Recently passed GA with little amendment, and it was suggested that FA may be possible. Self nom. Edward Waverley 09:57, 3 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

  • Comment This looks like it needs some work before FA. For example, as per WP:LEAD, the lead should be a "concise overview" of the entire article, and it shouldn't just highlight the parts of his life that make the subject notable. Nishkid64 (talk) 17:56, 3 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
I expanded the lead a bit to cover the whole article - I think it now mentions all the main points. Can you give any other advice? Thanks, Edward Waverley 13:02, 4 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Comment: I'm certainly going to support this great article but there are one or two minor questions before I do

  • "In 1663 Bruce travelled to France, and may have visited several notable houses including.... " I would prefer to see "he is believed to have visited" or "thought to have visited" with a ref to who thinks so.
  • " Bruce's early work involved advising and rebuilding" should that be "advising on the rebuilding"?
  • " he laid out "Italian" terraces, with.... " wasn't this something rather new for the era in Scotland if so more should be made of it
  • "but with French-inspired detailing..." I think perhaps French inspired detailing should be explained.
  • "The French-inspired Palladian" should be explained
  • Are there any more images of the country houses available? - the last four sections could do with an illustration or two.
  • "recognised as one of the finest buildings in the country" - recognized by whom?
  • "Defoe called Bruce "the Kit Wren of Scotland" - where did he call him this?
  • "Sir John Clerk of Penicuik named Bruce as "the chief introducer of architecture in this country", as above a quote need a cite. I see footnote 28 may cover this, could it be more explicit.
  • I would prefer to see Legacy section after family.
  • I don't like the info box, but that is the choice of the principal editors.

This is a great page, and I'm sure all of the above can easily be sorted, they are meant more as suggestions than demands conditional on support, but I would like to see them addressed before I do. Giano 14:52, 11 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you for your comments and support. I have added a couple of images, something that was definitely lacking. Giano I think your other comments are reasonable and I will seek to address them this week. Thanks, Edward Waverley 11:33, 17 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

OK, to address Giano's points:

  • expanded the ref regarding the French visits.
  • changed to "advising clients and rebuilding existing houses".
  • Italian terraces - I agree that this appears to be significant, but I cant find much further detail. The books I have access to are architectural in focus, and tend to skip over Bruce's contribution to Scottish garden history. Will see what else I can find.
  • 'French inspired' explained a bit
  • pics added, see above.
  • Defoe, Clerk and Campbell quotes cited better.
  • Moved "family" up to end of "career" section, as it is more biographical. "legacy" follows from the architecture section.
  • I agree the infobox isnt great, but Architect seems the most appropriate one to use.

Further comments welcome. Thanks, Edward Waverley 16:23, 20 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

  • Support: Thanks you have addressed some of my points and I accept what you say. However, I have just spotted this phrase "These modern French designs, incorporating the latest innovations of Italian architecture, were highly influential on the young Bruce.[14] He had also certainly seen modern Dutch architecture when in Holland prior to the Restoration.[7]" We have three countries mentioned here, I think we need some explanation of what feature is coming from where - also I'm not sure by the time the French were incorporating the "Italian innovations" that they were still "the latest". I know what the author means but I'm not sure too many others will. Perhaps it should be made clearer. Another small point is: "French-derived detailing, such as the rustication on the facade at Mertoun" - Rustication is actually not "French-derived" - and again here "but with French-inspired features such as the rusticated basement stonework, and the giant order of corinthian pilasters, the latter possibly deriving from Bernini's first designs for the Louvre." - I will not allow the French to take the credit for these features. Sorry, I did not spot these points earlier - have you changed things since I last looked? I don't mean to be pedantic and nit picking - I would change it myself but I see it is reffed - so something has gone awry somewhere with someone. I think colossal order is a more correct term, (but that is preference - like the horrible info-box) but here is an instant ref to the fact the Italians got there first [1], and of course Bernini was Neapolitan by birth. I'm sure these things can be easily sorted. I'm not around Wikipedia much at the moment so I shall vote support on the assumption these things are cleared up because it is such a good article. I hope when Raul comes to evaluate this page he looks at the quality rather than the number of people showing interest in this FAC and promotes it to FA status. Sadly, this type of page seldom appears to interest the multitudes. Giano 17:59, 25 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
    • Thank you, thank you, thank you and thank you, respectively. Giano, I will check the sources again, but they do seem to suggest that these features are "French derived", although i think the meaning is that Bruce got the ideas from French buildings, not that these are intrinsically French inventions. Some more tweaking may be necessary to elucidate this better. I have always understood "giant order" and "colossal order" as being interchangeable terms? Edward Waverley 12:15, 26 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured article candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.
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