Talk:Ummah

Keep the Ummah page

Keep this entry (Ummah) as a separate page, not to be incorporated into a larger Wiki article. Ummah is a term which is unfamiliar to most readers and should remain a distinct entry, especially since the notion of "ummah" can be linked to the dream of an expanding Islamic caliphate.

KwwinchKwwinch (talk) 23:31, 30 October 2009 (UTC)

I think that especially considering the western connotations of "Muslim World" that they should be kept separate, as they are quite often used to describe entirely different things that should not be confused. That's my two cents though, I'm open to other opinions on that matter. Peter Deer (talk) 17:38, 13 November 2009 (UTC)

unclear sentence re "common heritage"

"The word ummah is widely used in the conception of a "nation" as those who share a common heritage."

This doesn;t seem very meaningful to me. Perhaps it should be clarified; ni what context is it used, what is implied by it? Palmiro | Talk 20:36, 11 November 2005 (UTC)

Sorry, I didn't see your query. That is enshrining one particular conception of nationalism, known as cultural nationalism. Civic nationalism just requires adherence to a common ideal of governance, not a common culture. Zora 18:34, 11 December 2005 (UTC)

Ah yes, that was one of my problems with it. The thing I have been trying to get at is that "ummah" in Arabic, in general use, has pretty much the same sense as the English word "nation". This is of course a highly variable and disputed sense; I'm currently reading a book which is essentially a 400-page taxonomy of the concepts of the nation in modern Arab thought! On the other hand, as used in English, it is pretty much confined to the Islamic sense of Muslims as a community of believers, if that's a good way of putting it. Palmiro | Talk 13:08, 13 December 2005 (UTC)

Constitution of Medina

There was no senate of Medina, only a bunch of clans with separate strongholds. Some historians have questioned the historicity of the Constitution of Medina, saying that it was "invented" after Muhammad's death. Others accept that it was early, but do not accept the common Muslim contention that it was adopted when the Muslims first arrived in Medina. If it's early, it was much more likely to have been adopted after the Muslims had (peacefully) taken over the whole oasis. Zora 18:34, 11 December 2005 (UTC)

Arabic?

and forbid (Haram) what is evil.” - are you sure Haram is a verb? I haven't heard it used that way before, instead it typically is used as an adjective meaning forbidden. Sherurcij ^{(Speaker for the Dead)} 12:52, 12 March 2007 (UTC)

You are right that the adjective form in quotes is not the verb form which appears in the text 24.14.89.219 (talk) 21:58, 8 January 2016 (UTC)

The widely-known word "Haram" comes from a big family of Arabic words that cover a wide range of related meanings. Here are the closest in pronunciation: حرام Haraam (adj.) = Forbidden / prohibited / sacred حَرَم Haram (n.) = Mosque / church / temple / campus / protected area حَرَم Haram (v.) = deprived / forbade حَرَّم Harram (v.) = forbade / prohibited (by law) Note that the root for verbs in Arabic is the past tense, not the present as in English. And words are derived from the root by reshaping it into more complicated forms, not just adding prefixes and suffixes. ؛؛؛؛ AhmedAbuGhadeer (talk) 08:26, 30 April 2016 (UTC)

Wikilink to Arabic Wikipedia?

I noticed there was no wikilink to Arabic Wikipedia. I believe the corresponding article is الأمة_الإسلامية al-Umma al-islāmīya, but I'm slightly unsure if a wikilink should be introduced, since this article on English Wikipedia is not only about the muslim society, but also about other uses of the word. What do you think? – Danmichaelo (talk) 00:34, 3 November 2012 (UTC)

Both words are synonyms. Faizan 07:18, 16 June 2013 (UTC)

Map

The scale in the map does not show the difference between France and poland in the view of Muslim percentage. Qadeer Nil (talk) 21:34, 26 September 2013 (UTC)

Etimo (scuxeme se a scrivo en veneto ma no cognoso ben la lengoa angrexe)

Non è possibile evitare di considerare l'associazione con queste voci: inglese home (casa), A.a.tedesco heim (patria, casa), gotico haims (villaggio), lituano kaimas (villaggio) e seimà (famiglia), venetico 'a'imoi (?), greco kome e a.greco keimai (villaggio), accadico kummu (cella, stanza privata del tempio e del palazzo), accadico kimatu (famiglia, comunità), accadico kamu (unito, legato, congiunto), accadico hammatu (comunità, totalità), accadico hamamu (to gather), accadico hummumu (to collect), latino amma (mamma, madre), antico sloveno amma (nonna), latino amita -ae (sorella del padre), sumero ama (mamma), ebraico em e accadico ummu (mamma, madre), ecc. . Cfr. con la città di Umma http://en.wiki.x.io/wiki/Ummah. Alberto Pento --79.38.249.59 (talk) 18:39, 18 January 2015 (UTC)

Muslim Nation, not Muslim Community

I believe the Arabic word "Ummah" is equal to "Nation" in English, not "Community". The term "أمة/Ummah" is used in different sciences to mean slightly different meaning. While in Politics and Law it usually means the people of the country, mostly as decision makers or voters. It means in Islamic Literature and Arts the one independant united state of all lands with Muslim majority, ruled by elected leader (Khaleefah/Caliph) and Islamic Law (Sharee`ah/Sharia), or the hope of making this state if not present. So, I suggest changing the name of this article from "Ummah" to "Islamic Community" and removing the auto redirect from "Ummah". ؛؛؛؛ AhmedAbuGhadeer (talk) 09:08, 30 April 2016 (UTC)

hm

How does this compare to "Christendom"? DS (talk) 14:33, 16 September 2016 (UTC)

Edits by 46.186.244.93

IP please discuss here. Have you read the citation provided or are you engaging in WP:OR? --Emir of Wikipedia (talk) 19:39, 7 November 2017 (UTC)

Are you an Arab? Ummah means nation, not community. Community is a broad term that can be used at the macro and micro levels. A neighborhood can be considered a community as well. That's not what ummah means in Arabic. In Arabic, an ummah is a collection/group of people who are bound together by a common religion, location, history or any other factor. This is the definition of an ummah. The Arab ummah means "the Arab nation". As I told you, you can say that an ummah is a national community, but you have to specify that it's national. You can't only say it's a community because a neighborhood community, for example, is not an ummah. I already provided the link. It's in Arabic. 46.186.244.93 (talk) 19:49, 7 November 2017 (UTC)

Whether I am an Arab is irrelevant. At Wikipedia we support our claims with WP:RS's. --Emir of Wikipedia (talk) 20:29, 7 November 2017 (UTC)

Well I don't think you're an Arab otherwise you wouldn't keep mistakes in this article. Shaab doesn't mean nation, it means people. And ummah is the Arabic word for nation, which basically means an aggregation/community of people bound by a common geography, history, religion, or anything else. I provided the link in Arabic. You are removing a citation and changing the article back to its false information. Anyway please read the article again. I also improved its grammar. If you still don't like it then you can make your own changes, but you shouldn't keep the mistakes in the article.46.186.244.93 (talk) 20:34, 7 November 2017 (UTC)

Nation is not an always clear cut context. "And ummah is the Arabic word for nation, which basically means an aggregation/community of people bound by a common geography, history, religion, or anything else." That basically means community then.

--78.193.35.108 (talk) 17:17, 17 August 2021 (UTC)

Made a number of improvements to the article

I made several improvements to the article. If you guys don't like it and wanna revert it then that's totally up to you. I don't mind. But I will list the changes I made. First, I removed the word Shaab from the article because Shaab doesn't mean nation. Shaab, in Arabic, means people. Also, I added a citation in Arabic that defines "ummah". An ummah is basically the Arabic word for nation, which means a community of people bound together by a common religion, history, location or anything else. It's a national community to be specific. It shouldn't be confused with community in the broader sense of the word. A community in Arabic can refer to neighborhoods, small towns, etc. But an ummah is specifically a national community, or a nation, and it means an aggregation of people bound together by a common purpose, be it religious, geographic, historical or otherwise.

Secondly, I made some grammatical adjustments to various parts of the article and added a link for the word "qawm".

If you guys don't like my additions, feel free to revert them. In my opinion, I made the article better and more accurate. But if you don't like it then that's fine with me. You can revert it. 46.186.244.93 (talk) 20:29, 7 November 2017 (UTC)

They were reverted. Wikipedia does not engage in WP:ORIGINALRESEARCH. --Emir of Wikipedia (talk) 10:41, 15 November 2017 (UTC)

Shaab doesn't mean nation, it means people. And Ummah means nation. This is Arabic 101. And I provided the citations. There's nothing to argue with you about. Have a nice day. 94.129.98.121 (talk) 12:30, 15 November 2017 (UTC)

Ummah

Ummah (/ˈʊmə/;[1] Arabic: أمة [ˈʊmːæ]) is an Arabic word meaning "community". It is distinguished from shaʻb (شعب [ʃæʕb]), which means a nation with common ancestry or geography. Thus, it can be said to be a supra-national community with a common history.

It is a synonym for ummat al-Islām (أمة الإسلام, 'the Islamic community'); it is commonly used to mean the collective community of Islamic people.[2] In the Quran the ummah typically refers to a single group that shares common religious beliefs, specifically those that are the objects of a divine plan of salvation.[3][4] In the context of pan-Islamism and politics, the word ummah can be used to mean the concept of a Commonwealth of the Muslim Believers (أمة المؤمنين ummat al-muʼminīn). 146.212.15.193 (talk) 13:15, 8 December 2022 (UTC)

Merge?

Whether we can think over merging article Qawm in this article Ummah. Different spelling article seems to have been deleted Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Qaum with little discussion. Bookku (talk) 08:51, 14 June 2024 (UTC)

@Chipmunkdavis and @Mccapra, First I thought why not merge the article Qawm in this article, but as I went on searching term in google books the term seem to have significant socio - political contextual importance in multiple aspects like discourse related to formation of two nation theory, Berbers and Afghan's social things seem to have their own importance, Hadith related interpretations on two different Hadiths by traditional scholars being discussed by academics also seem to be important enough.

Would it be possible for you to go through the list of refs I updated at Qawm#Further reading at google books for term Qawm and share your inputs. Bookku (talk) 12:01, 14 June 2024 (UTC)

Qawm is a stub about an Afghan identity. It does not seem at face value to fit into this article. CMD (talk) 14:58, 14 June 2024 (UTC)

Our article about Qawm is primarily about its meaning in a specifically Afghan context and I think it would not be a good idea to merge this content with Ummah. The term “qawm” is used many times in the Quran and it is possible that there is scholarship about the specific meaning(s) of the word in an Islamic context, which may or may not include some overlap with the meaning of “ummah”. All of this is however beyond my knowledge and I think work on this should be left to people with the relevant knowledge. It would be a mistake to go looking for an overlap in meaning and then try to construct an article based on a selective reading of a few sources. Mccapra (talk) 19:09, 14 June 2024 (UTC)

Whether Qawm and Qaum are same words with different spellings or different words? Bookku (talk) 06:01, 15 June 2024 (UTC)