Talk:St James' Church, Stretham

St James' Church, Stretham has been listed as one of the Art and architecture good articles under the good article criteria. If you can improve it further, please do so. If it no longer meets these criteria, you can reassess it.

Article milestones
Date	Process	Result
September 29, 2010	Peer review	Reviewed
October 30, 2010	Good article nominee	Listed

A fact from this article appeared on Wikipedia's Main Page in the "Did you know?" column on September 6, 2010.

The text of the entry was: Did you know ... that the 1876 clock on the east face of the tower of St James Church, Stretham, is by JB Joyce & Co of Whitchurch, Shropshire, the oldest firm of tower clockmakers in the world?

Current status: Good article

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This article is written in British English, which has its own spelling conventions (colour, travelled, centre, defence, artefact, analyse) and some terms that are used in it may be different or absent from other varieties of English. According to the relevant style guide, this should not be changed without broad consensus.

GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:St James' Church, Stretham/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: hamiltonstone (talk) 00:52, 29 October 2010 (UTC) The article appears neutral, stable and generally well-written. All images appear in order (presuming either that England has Freedom of Panorama or that the artist for the stained glass window died over 70 years ago). It is well-referenced. Specifics:[reply]

"The north aisle is leaded and there is a chantry chapel at the east end with a screen." If this is continuing the report of what Francis Blomefield said, then it should be in the past tense, or say "At that time..."
the meaning of the term "leaded" will not be known to a lay reader and needs linking or explaining.
"There are approximately 374,000 listed buildings in England". Not sure we need this info?
Is no information known about the window portrayed in the photo - its age or creator?
You have linked "butresses", but the meaning of "clamped" in this context also requires elucidation - I have no idea what the term means. Suggest a bracketed explanation rather than a second link I think.
In the table you have a column heading "Clerical DB id", which again means nothing to a lay reader. Explain the term and why it matters (ie. why is it being included in an encyclopedia article).
Why is the Baldwin, John book in the further reading? It seems very peripheral to the article subject, so I would omit it.
I hate to say this, but that sound recording of synthesised bells is pretty awful to listen to. Not clear why it has been included. A recording of the actual bells, I could understand, but this seems a stretch. Comments?

Thanks for your careful scholarhsip. hamiltonstone (talk) 00:52, 29 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you for the review. I will attend to these comments within the next two days --Senra (Talk) 10:04, 29 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

"The north aisle is leaded

agreed

Done --Senra (Talk) 12:13, 29 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

the meaning of the term "leaded"

agreed

Done --Senra (Talk) 12:13, 29 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

"There are approximately 374,000 listed buildings in England"

agreed

Done This phrase was added as per a previous review. Moved to footnote --Senra (Talk) 12:13, 29 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Is no information known about the window portrayed in the photo

stet? Nothing is known. It is believed the window was entirely restored (recreated?) during the St Aubyn restoration but this has not been documented --Senra (Talk) 12:13, 29 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

agreed

Done Image of the window is copyright free according to Elen_of_the_Roads (talk · contribs) in response to the query raised at Wikipedia:Media copyright questions#Stained glass window .28UK.29 Panoramafreiheit.3F with reference to Commons:Freedom_of_Panorama#United_Kingdom --Senra (Talk) 22:34, 30 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

You have linked "butresses", but the meaning of "clamped" in this context also requires elucidation

comment Not sure about this. I have asked the question here --Senra (Talk) 12:13, 29 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

agreed

Done added footnote explaining buttress and clasping (clamped) from Pevsner Architectural Guides website plus reference --Senra (Talk) 15:18, 29 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

In the table you have a column heading "Clerical DB id"

comment not sure what to do here. The clerical databases were used to confirm names and dates. Following this review I have considered removing the column but not sure what to do with the external references. Move them to footnotes? A simple statment saying some of the information has been confirmed from these databases? Also, Venn is used to confirm other information (e.g. in the comments) and probably should be moved to references too. Perhaps you could suggest what I can do? --Senra (Talk) 12:24, 29 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

agreed

Done I have completely modified all the inline external references from the table converting them referenced citations and at the same time, I removed the CCEd/Clergy Database column. I hope this is satisfactory --Senra (Talk) 14:49, 29 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Why is the Baldwin, John book in the further reading?

agreed

Done --Senra (Talk) 12:16, 29 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I hate to say this, but that sound recording of synthesised bells is pretty awful

agreed

Done removed --Senra (Talk) 12:15, 29 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Clamped buttress Possible or probable error - (Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Science#Clamped_buttress) - the text states "Clamped buttresses dating from the 12th century are visible in the chancel" I think this should be "visible on the outside of the chancel. See the source "There are clamped buttresses which date from the end of the 12th century"[1] - the 12th century parts of the church are show in this diagram http://www.british-history.ac.uk/image.aspx?compid=21908&filename=fig24.gif&pubid=93 ... the clamped buttresses are the extra stonework on the outside of the church on the corners.. furthest right structure on this image is one 77.86.42.103 (talk) 13:04, 29 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

So certain am I of the error that I have corrected it http://en.wiki.x.io/w/index.php?title=St_James'_Church,_Stretham&action=historysubmit&diff=393606466&oldid=393595764 - see Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Science#Clamped_buttress for further evidence.. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 77.86.42.103 (talk) 13:40, 29 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Unfortunately Buttress doesn't explain - you can see the various types here [2] via www.lookingatbuildings.org.uk/

also here [3] 77.86.42.103 (talk) 13:51, 29 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

It would be a good idea if possible to alter the File:St James drawing.jpg to include the clasped buttresses - eg as per [4] 77.86.42.103 (talk) 14:17, 29 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you for this very useful information. I will add a footnote explanation though I do not feel confident about changing the diagram. I drew the diagram (to avoid copyright issues from the source) and do not feel I can add more information to it without violating copyright --Senra (Talk) 14:59, 29 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Note there's something wrong with the authorlink field in that reference http://en.wiki.x.io/wiki/St_James'_Church,_Stretham#cite_note-31 - not sure what - it's not displaying the Pevsner link correctly.77.86.42.103 (talk) 16:08, 29 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Fixed. I had wikified it in error --Senra (Talk) 16:42, 29 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

For what it's worth I've added a brief explanation and images to Buttress. Possibly redirects from "clamped buttress" could be made there too if wanted.Sf5xeplus (talk) 17:10, 29 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Awesome Sf5xeplus. Thank you --Senra (Talk) 17:17, 29 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Result

I take my hat off to someone who is this committed to resolving issues and who doesn't take shortcuts. Excellent work Senra, and thanks to the reference desk / helpers who chipped in. All good. hamiltonstone (talk) 02:48, 30 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

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