Talk:Sibyl of Falaise/GA1

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Reviewer: Gog the Mild (talk · contribs) 15:04, 19 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Which "King Henry"? And can we link him.
Link Anglo-Norman,
"likely that Sibyl was the daughter of Henry's elder brother Robert Curthose". Legitimate or illegitimate?
"Sibyl was just a "kinswoman" of Henry's". I don't think that the possessive is necessary, as =you already cover it with the use of "of".
The lead says she "was an Anglo-Norman noblewoman", the article mentions neither of these.
"Lead: "She was either his illegitimate daughter or a niece". The article discusses other options.

Gog the Mild (talk) 16:50, 19 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

- I should have gotten all of those - I hate not being able to state the obvious - she was "Anglo-Norman" but I cannot find a single source that bothers to state that. And she was a noblewoman ... as someone who was titled "kinswoman" of a king, but again, this is so obvious that no one bothers to say it in print. Ealdgyth (talk) 16:52, 20 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  Just chiming in as a non-involved editor, neither "Anglo-Norman" nor "noblewoman" are the slightest bit controversial. She's (probably?) the daughter of one of William the Conqueror's sons - can't get much more Anglo-Norman than that. If we can't call her Anglo-Norman we should also stop saying "so-and-so is a French (insert occupation)" when the sources say "so-and-so was born in Paris to French parents in 1864". -- asilvering (talk) 02:07, 21 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Like Asilvering I am entirely relaxed as to whether you cite this statement of the obvious or not, but it needs stating in either both the lead and the body or neither. Gog the Mild (talk) 18:11, 22 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Most of this article referring her to be related to Henry I of England, niece, kinswoman cannot be substantiated.

Sibyl of Falaise.

Described only as a "neptis" (acc. "neptem") of Henry, Thompson is correct in stating that she does not belong the list [Thompson (2003), 150].

Henry I of England https://fasg.org/projects/henryproject/data/henry001.htm The Henry Project, and accounted for by Thompson (2003)

Thompson (2003) = Kathleen Thompson, "Affairs of State: the illegitimate children of Henry I", Journal of Medieval History 29 (2003): 129-151. Pipera (talk) 03:33, 10 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Falseley attributed daughters:

Gundred.

Gundred and her brother Reginald de Dunstanville are mentioned in a Pipe Roll of 1130 [see White 108, 119]. She was included by White on the assumptions that her brother was the same as the earl of Cornwall and that they were siblings by the same father. However, Thompson pointed out that the future earl was still described as a young man in the late 1130's [GND (Rob. Tor.) viii, 29 (v. 2, pp. 248-9)], and was therefore not the same man as the Reginald on the 1130 Pipe Roll. (Thompson's conjecture would place the Reginald and Gundred of 1130 as siblings of earl Reginald's mother.)

Sibyl of Falaise.

Described only as a "neptis" (acc. "neptem") of Henry, Thompson is correct in stating that she does not belong the list [Thompson (2003), 150].

Henry I of England https://fasg.org/projects/henryproject/data/henry001.htm

In my opinion I would suggest that Thompson, and Baldwin are correct, and other references are an opinion and stated as so. Pipera (talk) 03:54, 10 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

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