Talk:Pentatonix/Archive 1

Archive 1

School

In one paragraph it says the scott and kirsten dropped out of school and in another it says the graduated from martin high school. Which is correct? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.35.82.165 (talk) 06:36, 18 March 2013 (UTC)

They dropped out of college. All five have graduated high school. Scott, Kirstie, Avi, and Kevin were in college when The Sing-Off's third season started up. I'm not sure if they have withdrawn or dropped out completely. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.37.171.124 (talk) 16:10, 15 May 2013 (UTC)

Minimum requirement for Sing Off

The article mentions the minimum requirement for Sing-off is 5, but the citation doesn't mention that minimum explicitly, and the casting page for this year says four (http://www.singoffcasting.com/). I don't think it changed since then, and I remember an interview with Scott where he says they needed four. I don't want to edit without being sure, can someone help me find that reference?Jonatanschroeder (talk) 01:13, 8 November 2013 (UTC)

Nevermind, found it and edited it. Jonatanschroeder (talk) 01:26, 8 November 2013 (UTC)

Edit war between 99.13.126.180 and Seokhun

User:99.13.126.180 and User:Seokhun have been in a revert war over one statement in the article. I am not a party to any of this, and hoping not to offend either of you; I just notices this unbecoming behavior occurring. I would ask that the two of you not touch this article until you can com eto some sort of agreement, either as to the content, or to get the dispute resolved through mediation. Dovid (talk) 18:29, 24 October 2013 (UTC)

I don't know how to report the IP. I merely provided the reference for the statement someone else put in. It's a reliable source but the IP user kept deleting it even if it was sourced properly, without any explanation. I don't know if you're aware, but IP users don't have talk pages nor do they care if they piss regular users off. Seokhun (talk) 23:10, 24 October 2013 (UTC)

System does support notification to IPs, and even talk pages. If the IP does respond within a reasonable time, and nobody else pipes in, feel free to go back to editing. If the IP reverts at that point, it will go to WP:ANI. Please note, I'm have no authority, I'm not even an admin. Just suggesting a way to keep it civil. Dovid (talk) 03:53, 25 October 2013 (UTC)

Next to that IP is "(talk)" in red, meaning it doesn't exist. I don't know how to notify an admin. I've attempted to contact said user by leaving comments in the summaries of the edits but no attempts by said user to negotiate. In any case, my edit was legitimate. Seokhun (talk) 04:41, 25 October 2013 (UTC)

All you have to do is click the red-link and the system will create the talk page with the contents you add. I've semi-protected the article and left a message for the IP.—Kww(talk) 04:51, 25 October 2013 (UTC)

Scott has never stated he is gay. Check every interview. Just because a magazine states it doesn't mean it is true and a reliable source. Please remove the false statement.User:Gracie555 — Preceding unsigned comment added by Gracie555 (talk • contribs) 14:57, 17 November 2013 (UTC)

"Just because a magazine states it doesn't mean it is true and a reliable source." <-- Just because he never said it doesn't mean he isn't. There's multiple sources pointing to the same conclusion. "Please remove the false statement." <-- Firstly, it's a perfectly well-cited statement, and secondly, simply because you say it's false doesn't make it false. Unless Hoying himself explicitly states in an interview or on TV that he is straight, we have every reason to keep that statement where it is. Oh, and just to piss you off more, I cited some more sources. Have fun reading! --Seokhun (talk) 03:28, 19 November 2013 (UTC)

Pentatonix Philanthropy section has wrong information

Please remove in the Philanthropy section that Scott Hoying is gay. The magazine article that states he is gay is NOT reliable source. That was an interview about Mitch being gay and it randomly states Scott is also gay. Mitch did not say it in the interview. They give no proof in the article. No where in the media has Scott said he is gay, Please remove this. It is said above that information must be verifiable. This is not verifiable. Thank you for your time. >>>>Gracie555

Gracie555 (talk) 16:58, 17 November 2013 (UTC)

Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. Two sources indicate that he is gay: "Two members of the group are openly gay, Mitch Grassi and Scott Hoying." [1] "Grassi was recruited to join the group by his friend Scott Hoying, who's also gay." [2] You will need to provide a source that states otherwise. — TheJJJunk ^{(say hello)} 15:19, 18 November 2013 (UTC)

@TheJJJunk: Gracie555's request is based on RS requirements. The claim is that the referenced source is not considered reliable. If the contention is true, then the material would have to be removed despite the source. (Note also that for non-BLP, your suggestion would still be wrong. Since there would be conflicting sources, both opinions would be required, and both would have to be sourced.) Dovid (talk) 19:15, 18 November 2013 (UTC)

@Dovid and Gracie555: I have listed two sources above. One being the one in question, as well as a second to confirm the first. The issue is that no source stating otherwise is present. There needs to be a source stating that he is not gay. Also, if a second source presents the same information, the content does not need to be removed. The more reliable source can replace the unreliable one. — TheJJJunk ^{(say hello)} 03:01, 19 November 2013 (UTC)

That's always an issue, demonstrating the negative. One of the horrible things WP twists you into as an editor. Another editor has added a couple of more source. One is a gay magazine interview, questionable as an RS, but not worthless. The other is from their claimed publicist's site. We allow self-statements from a person, this is close, but not quite the same (as it the group's representative, not Hoying himself, not Hoying's personal representative, and we don't have clear evidence that Ken Philips is really their representative. However, on the whole, I'd say the evidence is strong enough to use. Dovid (talk) 18:06, 20 November 2013 (UTC)

The new album has come out, and the tenses referring it should be changed.

The album is still referred to in future tense, and it has already come out. It should be in present tense. Drendude (talk) 15:00, 25 November 2013 (UTC)

Duplicate info on Xmas album

The sections "2012–13: PTX Vol. 1 & PTXMas" and "2013–14: PTX Vol. II" repeat info about the re-release of the first Christmas album, which also has its own article. One of the two sections should be pruned, I am assuming it's in the second spot for chronology, but it's redundant. Anyone have an opinion on which should be snipped?JamesG5 (talk) 00:06, 30 September 2014 (UTC)

Grassi’s “Fach”

I’m puzzled by Grassi’s designation as a countertenor, at least as he sings in Pentatonix. My ear says he mostly has a light, lyric tenor voice when he sings melody or harmony. I don’t hear him popping into falsetto before a tenor high C (C5), and he calls himself a tenor. --Janko (talk) 11:53, 30 December 2014 (UTC)

Later: From Voice Classification in Non-Classical Music “Some men can sing in the same range as women using their falsetto voices or as a result of some rare physiological conditions. These men do not fall into the three female categories. These men are known as countertenors within classical music. Within contemporary music, however, the use of the term tenor for these male voices would be more appropriate.” That being said, there is a tenor whose name I can’t recall who had the same light falsetto and seamless passaggio into that range as Mitch does.--Janko (talk) 06:43, 3 January 2015 (UTC)

A Cappella?

I don't think so. A Cappella is supposed to be pure vocal however PTX's songs seemingly all have background tracks. They cannot be considered A Capella just because they beatbox and do a lot of oooooohs. Grez868 (talk) 10:37, 13 March 2015 (UTC)

Assuming you mean background tracks that use instruments, then you are incorrect (with only three or four exceptions where a cello is used, two of which also used a violin as they were collaborations with Lindsey Sterling.) Everything else, including bass rhythms and unusual synth sounds, as difficult as it may be to believe, are purely vocal. — CobraWiki ^{( jabber | stuff )} 21:48, 13 March 2015 (UTC)

@Grez868: Agree with above, the majority of their work is pure vocals only and this is further evidenced when they perform live. — Usfun8991 (talk) 23:12, 13 March 2015 (UTC)

Avi's vocal range

The description of Avi as having a basso profondo vocal range is misleading since it often refers to the ones in Russian choral music who are able to hit notes like G1 with a full chest voice and with a certain tone quality. Even if we accept the Italian definition (being able to sing E flat in fortissimo), it isn't suited for his style of singing. Something like "deep bass" would be more fitting but I'm not sure. MagisterSP (talk) 16:28, 28 May 2015 (UTC)

Vandalism

I believe a username by the name of Totor18 committed vandalism on the first paragraph of this article. I removed it, but there may be some damage still left. Keep an eye on this. Maybe someone should put a form of protection on it? If someone knows who Totor18 is ( I believe he deleted his account after doing his damage ), tell him that it is not a joke. Vandalism is not cool. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Amishnarrich (talk • contribs) 04:51, 1 July 2015 (UTC)

PTX Vols. 1 & 2

The full-length complilation album of Pentatonix, PTX Vols. 1 & 2, is also released in the Philippines, it has its own Philippine Edition, colored in red, blue, and yellow. It's not only Japan, Australia, and Korea. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Luxenroar (talk • contribs) 00:34, 23 October 2015 (UTC)

External links modified

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Additional Releases section

I think the Additional Releases section should be deleted, and the information in the section distributed to its respective places in Pentatonix's history. Most of the Additional Releases is singles and covers. To redistribute these into their respective places in the timeline will make it more smooth. What do you all think? Amishnarrich (I do what I can, but I don't know everything) (talk) 05:40, 4 December 2015 (UTC)

Can someone please add to the Additional section that two of the members of the group have a web channel called superfruit? It would have saved this researcher a lot of time to just read that. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 115.187.142.160 (talk) 12:27, 9 October 2016 (UTC)

Hoying and Grassi Sexual Orientation

In the Philanthropy section of the article, it is claimed that both Mitch Grassi and Scott Hoying are gay. The articles cited clearly indicate that Grassi is gay (he has also admitted as much on his social media platforms), but none of the sources above indicate that Hoying is also gay. Can anyone prove this? If not Hoying as being gay should be removed as there is no verifiable source. Skunyote (talk) 22:02, 16 November 2013 (UTC)

At the very least, Grassi and Hoying do a weekly vlog together under the name Superfruit; both are quite upfront about being gay. I realize that this is a primary source, but it is definitely verifiable; I don't think it needs to be removed. I'll go digging for reliable third-party stuff. TechBear | Talk | Contributions 04:26, 17 November 2013 (UTC)

I agree with Skunyote. And Scott does not state that he is gay on Superfruit. Watch every episode, he never states that he is gay. >>>>User:Gracie555 — Preceding unsigned comment added by Gracie555 (talk • contribs) 15:08, 17 November 2013 (UTC)

Um. I've seen just one episode of superfruit and he is gay in that episode. Also...um, 'superfruit'? I mean, duh. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 115.187.142.160 (talk) 12:29, 9 October 2016 (UTC)

"Grassi was recruited to join the group by his friend Scott Hoying, who's also gay" from http://www.echomag.com/archives/features/600/concert_preview.php would appear to be a statement from a reliable source.—Kww(talk) 16:12, 17 November 2013 (UTC)

New 'A Pentatonix Christmas' Album

To be added? Information is needed for this new album — Preceding unsigned comment added by Sir.ob Lam (talk • contribs) 22:29, 28 October 2016 (UTC)

Further information on Avi Kaplan

I just reverted the recently created article on Avi Kaplan back to a redirect per WP:NMUSIC, specifically this line:

• "Note that members of notable bands are redirected to the band's article, not given individual articles, unless they have demonstrated individual notability for activity independent of the band, such as solo releases."

Kaplan doesn't meet any of the criteria on his own so shouldn't have his own article. There was, however, some useful information about him on it (if uncited) so figured I'd drop a link to it here, for interested editors. Nikthestunned 12:52, 5 November 2013 (UTC)

I find this business of deleting other people's contributions very arrogant. This is one of the things that is killing wikipedia -- arrogant editors deleting everyone's stuff -- so that everyone just gives up and goes away and doesn't participate. This band just released a number one album. How can you say that individual band members in a top selling band are not significant? Would you say the same of members of the Beatles? In fact, Avi has also collaborated with Peter Hollens. People do want to know more about Avi -- and the other band members. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Skysong263 (talk • contribs) 01:52, 6 December 2016 (UTC)

Ethnicity

What's up with calling Scott Caucasian and no one else? Avi and Mitch are also 100% Caucasoid. Almost everything that isn't Negroid (African) or Mongoloid (Chinese/Mongolian Descent, and heavily present in hispanics) are all Caucasian. This includes everyone middle eastern, Italians, white people, Spaniards, Jewish, and partially Hispanics. Also I don't think it's a good practice to call Kirstie Spanish. As many Hispanics tell me, you call them Hispanic (NEVER Spanish) if they are "Spanish" from mid-south America, and usually Spaniards if they are from Spain (sometimes Spanish). Kirstie being Spanish means what? White people wrongly call Hispanics "Spanish" all the time so I have a feeling there is a very good chance she is wrongly called so here... unless of course the heritage is from Spain which should more correctly be called Spaniard to avoid confusion as they are not even close to being the same (Hispanics are mostly Mongoloid from Native Americans, not nearly as much Spaniard decent). bhegeta (talk) 02:15, 20 February 2013 (UTC)

Descriptions are provided directly from the band themselves, sourced and cited: Scott describes himself as Caucasian, no one else does. Epideme (talk) 23:03, 2 December 2015 (UTC)

I fail to even see the importance of having that list at all. I have never gone into the page of a group thinking : Now I wonder, does that lead singer have a little bit of german in him? It is paramount that I know this, to fully judge that person. Raymond Holmoey (talk) 22:16, 22 February 2013 (UTC)

The band provided them, in answer to a question. A driver for the question may have been Kirstie's ethnicity, as they themselves discuss. Epideme (talk) 23:03, 2 December 2015 (UTC)

I'll also point out that it is biologically impossible to be 1/6 of anything (or 1/3 for that matter) so the ethnicity of Scott is innaccurate, per se. 70.56.36.162 (talk) 20:59, 28 March 2013 (UTC)

I agree - that was a poor edit by someone to Mitch's description of "Half Italian, the other half is Irish, Welsh and Scottish". Epideme (talk) 23:03, 2 December 2015 (UTC)

I think the Ethnicity section should be removed completely. Some of what are listed are nationalities and some ethnicities, but I imagine that it's their heritage backgrounds. It's just not relevant for a group to list it out like that and seems a bit ridiculous to me. 24.20.120.109 (talk) 09:04, 6 May 2013 (UTC)

Descriptions are provided directly from the band themselves, sourced and cited: The ethnicities described are in their own words. Epideme (talk) 23:03, 2 December 2015 (UTC)

I agree that the Ethnicity section should be cut entirely. It's true that the band did not refuse to answer when someone asked this in an interview, but that doesn't make it a necessary bit of data to put here on Wikipedia. The whole subject of race and ethnicity is culturally fraught and I don't see any way that it's better to discuss it here than it is to simply omit it. Ctate (talk) 22:40, 9 December 2016 (UTC)

Definition of independent label.

If the label they record under is independent, it is not owned by Sony. If it is owned by Sony, it is not an independent label. Despite any appearance to the contrary, intentional or otherwise, the board of directors of Sony have final say on anything/everything. BJRCollins (talk) 03:09, 31 May 2015 (UTC)

Agreed. The current description is oxymoronic. I suggest removing the word, independent. 50.104.3.99 (talk) 18:11, 17 July 2015 (UTC)

Also agreed. Madison Gate is not at all an "independent" label; it's a sub-brand of Sony. Ctate (talk) 23:43, 9 December 2016 (UTC)

According to our own site (reliable source?) an independent record label does not mean that it is not at all involved with major labels and, in fact, "major labels may also wholly or partially acquire independent labels." Madison Gates Records even identify themselves as, "the in-house, independent record label of Sony Pictures Entertainment."[3]. Pre-Wikipedia edits, news sites were referring to the first albums as "independent" and not "studio" albums. — CobraWiki ^{( jabber | stuff )} 06:45, 10 December 2016 (UTC)

Yes, but this is a dangerous road for an information resource to go down. For MG to refer to themselves as "independent" is marketing, and arguably deceptive. What on earth does "independent" actually mean if we accept that description? For Wikipedia to refer to them that way is taking a stand on that subject, and is I think inappropriate. Ctate (talk) 21:18, 12 December 2016 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 15 December 2016

Could i please edit this so it includes the Pentatonix Holiday Special tonight? CameronFarr (talk) 00:51, 15 December 2016 (UTC)

Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format. In other words, propose the exact wording you'd like to add. Include the date of the special (not "tonight") and say where in the article you want it to go. Please also make sure you include a reliable source and provide some indication of why the information is noteworthy. Rivertorch^FIRE_WATER 05:56, 15 December 2016 (UTC)

Lede grammar

What does this mean: "The group is noted for their includes song covers ... " ??? Maineartists (talk) 13:40, 16 December 2016 (UTC)

Fixed now. Rivertorch^FIRE_WATER 17:46, 16 December 2016 (UTC)

Grammy Awards

Can't edit right now due to the vandalism lockdown, so...

The summary block at the top of the page says, regarding Grammy awards, "they are the only a capella artist to have won the award." This is factually untrue. The Manhattan Transfer's a capella rendition of A Nightingale Sang In Berkeley Square won a Grammy in 1981. Bobby McFerrin won multiple Grammys in 1988 for Don't Worry, Be Happy, which also consists solely of voice and vocal-percussion parts. (McFerrin's Grammy-winning 1985 rendition of A Night in Tunisia with The Manhattan Transfer might also be a cappella but it's hard to tell.) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ctate (talk • contribs) 22:58, 9 December 2016 (UTC) Ctate (talk) 23:01, 9 December 2016 (UTC)

The Pentatonix has won the 27th Grammy Awards for the best dou/group performance in Country Album for their music Jolene ft. Dolly Parton. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ashkachui (talk • contribs) 11:09, 14 February 2017 (UTC)

Appearances

The group appeared in The Muppets season 1 episode "Pig's in a Blackout" (10 Nov 2015) performing their song "Can't Sleep Love" during an electricity-free episode of Up Late with Miss Piggy. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Silly.ol.ryan (talk • contribs) 17:54, 5 October 2017 (UTC)

References

Avi Kaplan leaving the group

Avi left to pursue a solo career, no matter what he claimed in his goodbye video. (In fact, he was promoting his first solo single a month before he announced he was leaving the group) This should be reflected in this article. 67.149.76.122 (talk) 19:07, 13 November 2017 (UTC)

We report what reliable sources say, not editors' opinions. Meters (talk) 19:12, 13 November 2017 (UTC)

He's got a solo album coming out. It's not "editors' opinions" when it's an established fact.67.149.76.122 (talk) 19:54, 13 November 2017 (UTC)

Correction: that album came out in June. We can argue semantics all day, but he's pursuing a solo career. The sentence "This split is amicable and centers on his inability to keep up with the touring demands of the group, and deal with the distance from his family." is inaccurate (or at the very least incomplete) given this information.67.149.76.122 (talk) 19:57, 13 November 2017 (UTC)

Then please provide reliable sources to the contrary. --‖ Ebyabe ^talk - Welfare State ‖ 19:58, 13 November 2017 (UTC)

Maybe I'm not being clear: Former member Avi Kaplan is currently pursuing a solo career. The article should reflect this. As is stands now, the wording makes it sound like he left to lead a life out of the spotlight.
Not sure what a good source is for an album, especially given the rude reception I'm getting for pointing out the obvious, but here's the itunes page for it: https://itunes.apple.com/us/album/sage-and-stone-ep/id1225792004. 67.149.76.122 (talk) 20:40, 13 November 2017 (UTC)

Avi has said that he left the group because he couldn't keep up with the touring demands, and he wanted to be with his family. He has not said that he left to focus on his solo career (even though the two events happened to take place around the same time) so the article will not say this either (unless you can provide a reliable source that says this). – Rhain ☔ 07:15, 16 November 2017 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 29 November 2017 Suggestion

Explanation: The vocal group Pentatonix has replaced a former full member (Avi Kaplan) with someone ***not*** billed as a full member of the group (Matt Sallee). Since this is a matter of accurate billing (which could also have legal ramifications within the group), general descriptions on this page should reflect that.

The difficulty is that there seems to be no definitive published statement as to his correct billing, merely a preponderance of evidence: the absence of Mr. Sallee in in their main web site publicity displays; their November 27 NBC Special titled "A Very Pentatonix Christmas" (https://www.nbc.com/a-very-pentatonix-christmas) credits the 4 remaining members as "Starring" and Mr. Sallee is given a separate credit as "Bass Vocalist", and Mr. Sallee is also absent from the featured publicity photo for the special on the NBC site. I was able to find a statement that the group "... invited Matt to join them on their holiday tour...", which is referenced in the suggested changes below.

Suggested change 1, original text, lists Matt Sallee as a Current Member: RRP27 (talk) 19:28, 29 November 2017 (UTC)

Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. The source provided is not anything like a reliable source on the member's status. It is merely a program listing for one event. Please provide some source which contradicts one of the established member's own statement that Sallee is "our new bass". Eggishorn (talk) (contrib) 21:39, 29 November 2017 (UTC)

Actually, it's a fair point. The fact that Sallee is not listed on the website (which has been updated recently) shows that he is perhaps not a permanent member—however, it's best to wait until after the holiday tour to see what his official role is, as there's a fair chance he may remain as their full-time bass vocalist. He may only be temporary, but that's not to say that he's not an "official" member, at least for now. – Rhain ☔ 00:26, 30 November 2017 (UTC)

Going by what they have put on YouTube and Twitter this week it looks like Matt is now a permanent member and there is going to be some kind of announcement probably within the next 4 to 5 days as they appear to be changing their heading image on those sites and Facebook each day by adding a key to it although their own web site does not appear to be getting updated at the moment. WyrmVane (talk) 20:49, 17 February 2018 (UTC)

comment

Article says that they renamed themselves Pentatonix. Does anyone know what their original name was? Mblumber (talk) 19:25, 12 January 2012 (UTC)

Article omits performance of Good Feelin' on the Sing Off, with Flo Rida and Urban Method. While a group number, the talents of both Kirstie and Kevin are apparent. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.237.181.93 (talk) 01:54, 24 February 2012 (UTC)

Article does not mention their Sesame Street appearance. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.32.200.95 (talk) 00:43, 13 December 2014 (UTC)

Article says Avi was replaced when that is not the proper way of wording what happened. saying he was replaced sounds like he was kicked out when he left on his own accord and the position was filled not replaced — Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.226.134.227 (talk) 20:52, 29 May 2018 (UTC)

Request for Comment: New WikiProject for A Cappella-related articles

Hi there! To any and all interested: I've proposed a WikiProject dedicated to a cappella. This would be a group of editors interested in improving the quality of articles related to a cappella. If you're passionate about a cappella—ranging from the Pentatonix to collegiate a cappella groups, or perhaps pop culture representations like Pitch Perfect and The Sing-Off—please check out the proposal and share your thoughts!

Here's a link to the proposal for WikiProject A Cappella.

If you could see yourself contributing to an article related to a cappella (like this one), please consider joining! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Shrinkydinks (talk • contribs) 06:42, 6 December 2019 (UTC)

Evergreen

Is it possible we could get a separate article for Evergreen please? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:195:C200:2660:E9DB:1915:5C61:5C9F (talk) 16:07, 16 February 2022 (UTC)

Matt

Someone please add a Wiki page on Matt Sallee! Everyone except him has one! SmartyParty6556 (talk) 13:51, 13 June 2020 (UTC)

Thanks for your suggestion. This is a great injustice that we don't have a separate page on him. I will work on an article myself. It is my duty. He is my favourite in the band. werldwayd (talk) 18:01, 6 August 2021 (UTC)

On the topic of Matt, should we consider using a more recent picture of the group featuring Matt, as he is a current member? RaCJ1325 (talk) 02:00, 19 February 2022 (UTC)