Talk:Italian racial laws
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Renaming proposal
[edit]The main source of this article seems to be the book published in italian language by historian Renzo De Felice (1929-1996) in 1993: "Storia degli ebrei italiani sotto il fascismo" which, translated in English, means "The Italian Hebrews history under Fascism". These "Italian Racial Laws" do NOT exist anymore, so IMHO the article should be renamed "Italian Fascism Racial Laws". Please compare Neofascism#Italy article/section. Oh, I missed that today is U.S. Independence Day. Please all U.S. citizens have a nice day. M aurice Carbonaro 10:37, 4 July 2013 (UTC)
- Oppose . These were laws of the Italian State, promulgated via "Regi Decreti" and countersigned by the king (who represented the italian nation), so "Italian" is fully correct. I can personally add that it is too easy (and unfortunately typically italian) to shift the responsibility of these laws on someone else (the fascists): they, as De Felice writes, represent a black page of italian history. Moreover, in Italy they are mostly plainly known as "Leggi razziali". In order to underline the time period, we could anyway rename the article to Italian Racial Laws (1938-45): 1945 because, although the abrogation of the laws was one of the first actions of the Badoglio government in 1943, they were still applied (and made harsher) by the RSI until 1945. Alex2006 (talk) 06:55, 5 July 2013 (UTC)
- Oppose . Agree with Alex2006 on this. The proposed name is both awkward and misleading. Hawkeye7 (talk) 12:55, 5 July 2013 (UTC)
- The article "Racial policy of Nazi Germany" states "Nazi Germany": i.e. is not "German racial policy" which sounds like this article title "Italian Racial Laws". So IMHO this article should be renamed at least for "conformity". What about "Racial policy of Fascist Italy" then? BTW (talking about "alleged current racism in Italy"), does anyone opposing the renaming knows who is the current Italian Minister for Social Integration? Cheers. M aurice Carbonaro 07:58, 17 July 2013 (UTC)
- No. The article deals with the laws promulgated by the Kingdom of Italy, not about the racial policy. As I written above, we can add the years of existence of these laws. The name commonly used in Italy among historians is "Leggi razziali", non "Leggi razziali fasciste". See for example de Felice (who wrote the reference work about this subject) about it. Alex2006 (talk) 08:52, 17 July 2013 (UTC)
- Adding the years of existence of these laws would find my consent and looks fine. As I wrote before someone could think that these laws are still active so it definitely looks weasel. Last but not least AFAIC Fascism and the Kingdom of Italy had some kind of relationship. M aurice Carbonaro
- Thanks Maurice! I will do the change. BTW, this will be a good way to celebrate the 70th anniversary of the fall of Mussolini... :-) Alex2006 (talk) 11:26, 22 July 2013 (UTC)
- Adding the years of existence of these laws would find my consent and looks fine. As I wrote before someone could think that these laws are still active so it definitely looks weasel. Last but not least AFAIC Fascism and the Kingdom of Italy had some kind of relationship. M aurice Carbonaro
- No. The article deals with the laws promulgated by the Kingdom of Italy, not about the racial policy. As I written above, we can add the years of existence of these laws. The name commonly used in Italy among historians is "Leggi razziali", non "Leggi razziali fasciste". See for example de Felice (who wrote the reference work about this subject) about it. Alex2006 (talk) 08:52, 17 July 2013 (UTC)
- The article "Racial policy of Nazi Germany" states "Nazi Germany": i.e. is not "German racial policy" which sounds like this article title "Italian Racial Laws". So IMHO this article should be renamed at least for "conformity". What about "Racial policy of Fascist Italy" then? BTW (talking about "alleged current racism in Italy"), does anyone opposing the renaming knows who is the current Italian Minister for Social Integration? Cheers. M aurice Carbonaro 07:58, 17 July 2013 (UTC)
Suggestions
[edit]The "DemoRazza" was the central infamous department for the implementation, monitoring and decision making regarding racial laws in the ministry of the interior. (source:Michael A. Livingston: The Facists and the Jews of Italy - Mussolini´s Race Laws, 1938-1943) In the Social Republic of Italy the minister of the interior Guido Buffarini Guidi ordered the imprisonment of all jews by Italian authorities on 30th of November 1943 with the intention to demonstrate recovering strength. The expropriation was finally completed by a law dated 4th Januar 1944. (source:Renzo De Felice: The Jews in Fascist Italy p. 434) You should mention these things in your article.--5glogger (talk) 07:43, 26 February 2017 (UTC)
Lowercase?
[edit]The article title was just changed to lowercase ... I'm just checking, which of the sources use lowercase? - Dank (push to talk) 21:07, 9 December 2018 (UTC)