Talk:Fly to the Sky

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Fly to the Sky was one of the Music good articles, but it has been removed from the list. There are suggestions below for improving the article to meet the good article criteria. Once these issues have been addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake.

Article milestones
Date	Process	Result
September 2, 2006	Peer review	Reviewed
October 19, 2006	Good article nominee	Listed
November 5, 2006	Peer review	Reviewed
December 27, 2009	Good article reassessment	Delisted
Current status: Delisted good article

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Discography

The discography section is REALLY messy. Is there anyone who can clean it up? I'll do it if necessary, but I don't know FTTS very well.... SKS2K6 08:00, 23 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Album release dates

Please come up with a reliable source for their album release dates, especially for the sixth album. mirageinred 14:05, 3 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Are they a 1990s music group?

I was wondering Fly to the Sky page should get Category:1990s music groups, since they debuted in 1999, but they debuted in December, so I'm not really sure. mirageinred 15:56, 9 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

References

Shouldn't there be an English translation of the titles of the articles referenced? -- ArglebargleIV 02:44, 14 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Should I leave the korean titles in and then put the english translation or should they all be turned to english? mirageinred 18:24, 14 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The translations are not 100% exact, but they are roughly accurate. Are there anything else to be done? mirageinred 18:33, 14 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Looks fantastic to me -- thanks!!!! -- ArglebargleIV 21:26, 14 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

No problem. =) mirageinred 01:27, 15 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

GA on hold

This article will be put on hold (for 7 days) until these minor adjustments can be made :

1. Well written? Pass

2. Factually accurate? OK

3. Broad in coverage? Fail

4. Neutral point of view? Pass

5. Article stability? Pass

6. Images? ~~Fail~~ Pass

Additional comments :

~~None of the images state their fair use rationale.~~
Discography in a table is less appropriate than having each album in a subsection with a little explanation about the album especially because they don't link directly to an album subpage.
No section on reception/criticism of the band.
Needs a little copyedit to remove pov weasel words.
Needs to be broadened.

Lincher 04:17, 15 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

GA passed

This article now passes the GA requirements for the latest modifications have broaden it and made it more accurate. Lincher 18:48, 19 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

oh my god thank you!!! mirageinred 20:21, 19 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

on that music chart

If we follow Lincher's recommendations.... I can talk about the third albums onward, but nothing before it. SKS2K6 06:34, 19 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I couldn't find any news articles regarding FttS's albums before 2003, but I will make pages for each album soon. mirageinred 01:15, 20 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

This probably is because they really weren't THAT famous at that time. mirageinred 01:26, 20 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Yeah. Their third album was their turnaround album. "Sea of Love" was huge. :P SKS2K6 07:32, 20 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Wow, I can't believe this. There are literally zero articles about Fly to the Sky before 2000. mirageinred 22:56, 26 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

That's cuz they weren't that big.... Unlike other SM groups, they did not have a huge first album (considering that almost all the other groups had strong starts).SKS2K6 02:32, 27 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

A sentence that bugs me...

"After reflecting on this incident, Brian's eyes were brimming with tears." Can we change this? It sounds awkward to me. SKS2K6 02:32, 27 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

What about changing brimming to brimmed? Still.. It sounds kinda passive. 19:29, 27 October 2006 (UTC)

Hwanhee/Fany

I think Fany's official name should be HwanHee and make Fany as a nickname. According to the Korean pronunciations, HwanHee is correct. 20:43 Nov 5, 2006

But his official "English-isation" is Fany. SKS2K6 05:14, 6 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Well, not officially. I think Brian gave him that nickname in the early years, but it became more "official" as the term "Fany" was used in the album Sea of Love. I don't know. Fany's just so much more convinient. I mean, Brian's real name is Joo Min Kyu, but we don't really refer to him by Joo, you know? mirageinred 20:24, 6 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

So the real official name is HwanHee and his nickname is Fany. I've never heard HwanHee refered as Fany in Korean shows. (Korean doesn't have "F" sound) Koreans call him HwanHee, then we should call him HwanHee. If we ask "Do you know Fany?" to Koreans, they won't know what we are talking about. I never knew HwanHee was called Fany until I watched HwanHee on YouTube. BTW I am Korean. (even if my writing kinda makes you think that I am not one >_>) How about changing wiki entries to "Even though HwanHee is the real name, just for convinience's sake, we call him by his nickname, Fany?" LOL this sounds weird. I gotta improve my English. >_< Nov 10, 2006

Well, Brian IS Brian. He's American, after all. As for Fany/Hwanhee...it's Fany in the booklets. BTW, I added a heading on here, just so it looks cleaner. :P SKS2K6 19:21, 10 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Well, I'm Korean too, and lived in Korea for nine years. Obviously he is more commonly referred to as Hwanhee in Korea but this is an English wikipedia, and Fany is more americanized. Also, if you see look at their album pictures, Hwanhee is written as "Fany" in English. I wish I had a picture. mirageinred 22:55, 10 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The topic above brings us to another question

Should we address Brian Joo by his surname (usually preferred in formal writings) or Brian (his stage name)? mirageinred 01:10, 11 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

This is a problem on many of the K-pop articles. I'd say...well, if FTTS was in North America or Europe, Brian would simply be his English name; therefore, Joo would be used. But in Korea, since it is his "stage name" (only because it's not Korean), I think it's okay to use Brian...but we're on the English wikipedia, so I don't exactly know what the standard would be in this case. SKS2K6 01:17, 11 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Edit: I know that with stage names, the subject used is the stage name and not the official surname, like with Madonna (entertainer).

I guess we're going to simply call him Brian. mirageinred 02:06, 11 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Featured article

I'm going to nominate this article for featured article after I specify the references section. Chances are probably slim since it has such high standards, but you never know. mirageinred 02:21, 12 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Maybe try A-Class first. SKS2K6 20:03, 24 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Hmm... the article is indeed above average, but there are some problems yet:

Without some references, certain parts of the text appear original research. Examples are:
1. Since their 1999 debut single "Day by Day," they have enjoyed consistent success with hits such as "Sea of Love," "Missing You," and 남자답게 (Like a Man).
2. Their popularity slowly climbed with the release of their sophomore album 약속 (The Promise) in 2001.
Also, some rewording is needed in paragraphs for a better text flow. While I can help with some sentences, I am not native so I can't really say when the article reached "perfect flow". In example:
Fany performed by himself. Poppy ballad "Sea of Love," the lead single, became a summer hit. Their sophomore single "Condition of my Heart" was written by American singer Brian McKnight and showcased much heavier style than the lead single. The single signaled the duo's musical transition from bubblegum music to R&B.

The paragraph is rather short, but has 4 sentences, with the "single" word repeated four times.
The images need a fair use rationale, otherwise they may be deleted in the future, especially the promotional one.
I think the list of singles is needed too.

That is all I can think of right now. You need someone that is english native to proofread the article, as in some sections it is choppy (some small sentences one after other when a longer one would work better). And add some more references, especially when you see one or two paragraphs that do not have them (like in 2002-2004: Musical transition, where the first paragraph has no references and the second has one but that does not reference the first half of the second paragraph). Good luck! -- ReyBrujo 17:19, 24 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I think I should clarify the fair use rationale: you need a stronger claim for the images, explaining why the images are used here. And if possible, see if you can find a free image for the duo, that would really help the article, even if it has not the quality of the current promotional images. -- ReyBrujo 17:21, 24 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Addendum: I have contacted user pen.c at Flickr to see if it is possible to change the copyright information for www.flickr.com/photos/pen_c/278718885/. While not as good as the promotional images, a free image would really be appreciated. Let's see what she answers. -- ReyBrujo 17:31, 24 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Reybrujo, thank you so much for your help. It would be great if the page had a free image. As for the singles, I don't think the duo released any. In South Korea, releasing singles is still a new practise to the music industry. However, the duo did promote 2~3 songs from each album if that was what you meant. mirageinred 18:12, 24 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

It was a pleasure. I did not know about the singles, maybe it would be good to explain that in the future. -- ReyBrujo 18:23, 24 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Singles in K-pop are basically what songs the group promoted. Those can be listed (although the songs that were "comeback special" only do not count). SKS2K6 20:54, 3 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Fany Hwang or Hwanhee?

I know this was discussed before but I am getting skeptical as I am planning to start his page. Should the page be named "Fany Hwang," "Fany," or "Hwanhee?" mirageinred 20:12, 19 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

GA Reassessment

This discussion is transcluded from Talk:Fly to the Sky/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the reassessment.

As part of Wikipedia:WikiProject Good articles' Project quality task force ("GA Sweeps"), all old good articles are being re-reviewed to ensure that they meet current good article criteria (as detailed at WP:WIAGA.) I have determined that this article needs some work to meet current criteria, outlined below:

The lead does not adequately cover the entire contents of the article (WP:LEAD)
The maintenance tags at the top of the article are entirely correct: huge swaths of the article are entirely unsourced. Some of it is potential BLP issue ("On a variety show, both members recalled this incident as an emotionally hard time for them. Fany was especially shocked, because he was on the same vehicle with his manager just hours before the incident.") and should be removed as it sounds hard to verify anyhow.
File:Fly to the Sky - Day By Day.ogg, File:Fly to the Sky - Condition of My Heart.ogg, File:Fly to the Sky - Like a Man.ogg do not have strong fair use rationales in the article as required by WP:NFCC.

I am placing the article on hold for seven days awaiting improvements. Keep me appraised in this space. Der Wohltemperierte Fuchs^(talk) 23:04, 21 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

As there has been no substantial action towards the above, I am delisting the article. Direct any further comments or questions to my talk page. Der Wohltemperierte Fuchs^(talk) 19:58, 27 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Reference links

A lot of the reference links are no longer working. Would someone be able to replace them?--TerryAlex (talk) 15:47, 6 June 2014 (UTC)[reply]

External links modified

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So, what's with that criticism section?

There are lots of weasel words ("critics said..." which ones?), citations that don't match up with the text (like the very first citation, which doesn't even have any criticism of the group), and it's probably WP:UNDUE. Weirdly enough, months ago I removed a similar (but more obvious) undue weight violation on Brian Joo's page (didn't help that it was a BLP). At first I was thinking of making a "critical reception" section with both positive and negative information, but I'm already juggling a lot and the option to blow it up and start over is looking a little tempting. I don't think this is a BLP violation like on Brian's page, nor am I crusading for all negative opinion on Fly to the Sky to be shot into space. This just isn't up to cuff with a good article. (Not literally, but it was previously a GA almost 20 years ago, when I assume standards were waaay different.) Wuju Daisuki (talk) 00:06, 6 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]