Talk:Assassination of Pim Fortuyn

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predicted to win

I can't read Dutch - can someone clarify the sentence in the opening sentence, that he was predicted to win? He was expected to get elected, sure, but since he was the leader of the LPF, "win" suggests he would have been elected Prime Minister, no? The LPF had no seats and with the swell of support after Fortuyn's election, they managed to elect 26 of 150. - 206.126.92.209 (talk) 12:12, 6 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Apparently both listed sources for this claim are interviews with Wim Kok (then prime-minister). The claim that he was predicted to win seems to revolve around polls held before the elections. Getting 26 out of 150 seats as a new party is viewed in the Netherlands as almost impossible. It would therefor be likely for the new coalition cabinet to include the LPF (as they were one of the largest parties at the time). D(r)ead End (talk) 12:53, 6 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

In the context of elections in The Netherlands, "to win" means winning more seats than any other party. Traditionally, the leader of the party that wins the most seats in the Second Chamber (Tweede Kamer, House of Representatives) will be invited to form a government. This, however, is not a rule or law, but merely a tradition. In the 2002 elections, the Pim Fortuyn party became the second-largest party in the Second Chamber. The leader of the party who won the most seats in the elections, Jan-Peter Balkenende of the Christian-Democrat CDA, was invited to try and form a new government. It was his (and his party's) choice to approach the Pim Fortuyn List and the Liberal party (VVD) to join a coalition government. He could have opted instead to ask the Social-Democrat party (PvdA) to join the CDA and VVD in a coalition, but the political landscape of the time made a government coalition of CDA, PvdA and VVD highly unlikely. Had the Pim Fortuyn party gained more seats in the election than the Christian-Democrats, their leader would most likely have been invited to try to form a government. (82.171.32.73 (talk) 15:39, 6 May 2014 (UTC))[reply]

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Merge assassin page

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section. A summary of the conclusions reached follows.

The result of this discussion was Don't merge. Wouldlouse (talk) 16:08, 29 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

@Captain Cornwall, MagicatthemovieS, FMSky, Chipmunkdavis, Robby.is.on, Splatterxl, and NFSreloaded: I propose merging Volkert van der Graaf into Assassination of Pim Fortuyn. Volkert is not notable beyond the assassination and their page can be trimmed and inserted into this page as a perpetrator section. Wouldlouse (talk) 19:24, 3 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose. Major political assassinations are one of the examples given for WP:CRIMINAL and WP:BIO1E where there may be an exception, "The victim of the crime is a renowned national or international figure, including, but not limited to, politicians or celebrities", and "The assassins of major political leaders, such as Gavrilo Princip, fit into this category, as indicated by the large coverage of the event in reliable sources that devotes significant attention to the individual's role", which this fits. There seems to be enough here to justify an independent article. PARAKANYAA (talk) 15:17, 4 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

I could understand merging for now, as these articles are quite poor, but looking at the coverage there very clearly is enough for him to have his own article non duplicative of the event. But I am not sure if a merger for now is the best way- I would still vote oppose. If it is merged for now it can be split again in the future, and he passes the relevant guidelines. PARAKANYAA (talk) 02:29, 10 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Support - Only in the first two sections of the article about Van der Graaf is he discussed separately from the assassination, those eight sentences are essentially the basis of a Perpetrator blurb. The rest of the article, dealing with the investigations and the trial, also seems to fit better with the article about the crime itself. --NFSreloaded (talk) 07:55, 6 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Strong oppose. Discussing about what is in the article right now instead of what it could be is meaningless and not forward-thinking. A brief Google search can find many sources on van der Graaf, therefore a lot of room for expansion that does not belong here. Additionally, the proposer clearly didn't read CRIME; it allows for a standalone article of the perpetrator if the target was a renowned national figure, of which Fortuyn is. Also, 1E specifically exempts highly significant events, e.g. Mehmet Ali Ağca, Mark David Chapman, etc. all have separate articles instead of a section at Attempted assassination of Pope John Paul II and Assassination of John Lennon. This most certainly falls into a "highly significant event". The article doesn't really convey just how important this assassination was. Political violence is extremely uncommon in the Netherlands, and the murder of a populist firebrand seemingly about to win the election sent shockwaves around the world. 2A02:C7C:2DCE:1F00:2163:5D0B:DB94:CBCA (talk) 03:13, 16 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.