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Talk:26 December 2024 Israeli attack on Yemen

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Requested move 26 December 2024

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The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: moved. There a consensus in favour of 26 December 2024 Israeli attack on Yemen. Best, (closed by non-admin page mover) Reading Beans, Duke of Rivia 05:37, 3 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Operation Tselilei HaKerem → 2024 Sana'a International Airport strikes – Article title is certainly not WP:COMMONNAME nor compliant with WP:NPOV Mason7512 (talk) 21:50, 26 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Alternatively, we could merge this article into December 2024 Israeli airstrikes in Yemen. Mason7512 (talk) 22:59, 26 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Agreed that it's non compliant with WP:NPOV but still oppose the requested name change as the strikes included multiple more targets other than the Sana airport Waleed (talk) 01:17, 27 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Good point. Would 26 December 2024 Israeli attack on Yemen be a suitable alternative? (modeled off of 20 July 2024 Israeli attack on Yemen, also an article about multiple attacks on a single day in Yemen by Israel) Mason7512 (talk) 01:23, 27 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It'd certainly be better than the current title or the nomination Waleed (talk) 02:40, 27 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Support this Abo Yemen✉ 06:33, 27 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Support this alternative DeadlyRampage26 (talk) 07:41, 28 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Support this option as NPOV (we don't usually use op names from one side). Selfstudier (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose, There are many articles titled "Operation..." That's its name, so I don't understand why change it? (By the way, that's also its name on Hebrew Wikipedia.)Eladkarmel (talk) 17:32, 28 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
That name is exclusively used by the Israeli government/military, who are the perpetrators of this event, so using it is framing the events with their version, therefore violating WP:NPOV guidelines. (I would also argue that it implicitly endorses the perspective that the events were purely military, but that is less concrete) Secondly, it is by no means the WP:COMMONNAME in English. The only English-language sources I can find that refer to the events as "Operation Tseliei HaKerem" (not just offhandedly) are Israeli, which 1) are a small minority of sources describing the events and 2) subject to media censorship by the military and government.
Regarding the Hebrew article, that is not relevant to this disscussion, just becasue it is named something in another wiki does not make it compliant with guidelines. If I could communicate in Hebrew, I would nominate that article to be moved as well, but he.wiki is very insulated, and it's not surprising that many articles violate WP:NPOV in favor of the Israeli government. Mason7512 (talk) 18:02, 28 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
+1 Selfstudier (talk) 18:18, 28 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
+2 Abo Yemen✉ 18:21, 28 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
+3 Waleed (talk) 01:58, 29 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
+4 Rajoub570 (talk) 07:32, 30 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
+5 DeadlyRampage26 (talk) 10:05, 30 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

GA?

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@M Waleed try nominating this for GA no? Abo Yemen✉ 14:15, 4 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

@Abo Yemen, I nominated the article for GA per your suggestion Waleed (talk) 15:18, 4 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
would suggest that you find some pics to show the damage of the attack and also put this up at WP:PR too just to iron out the small mistakes. Good luck anw! Abo Yemen✉ 15:45, 4 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
any public domain imagery available? Waleed (talk) 16:31, 4 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
I've seen CCTV footage of the bombing of the airport which should fall under c:Template:PD-CCTV Abo Yemen✉ 16:45, 4 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
Can you provide me the footage Waleed (talk) 16:56, 4 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
ima look for it and upload it either later or tomorrow Abo Yemen✉ 17:46, 4 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
 Done @M Waleed Abo Yemen✉ 07:06, 5 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
Thnx Waleed (talk) 07:07, 5 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
WP:GOCE and not WP:PR 🤦‍♂️ Abo Yemen✉ 07:07, 5 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

GA Review

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GA toolbox
Reviewing
This review is transcluded from Talk:26 December 2024 Israeli attack on Yemen/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Nominator: M Waleed (talk · contribs) 15:17, 4 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Reviewer: Gog the Mild (talk · contribs) 15:08, 7 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]


I'll have a look at this. Gog the Mild (talk) 15:08, 7 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Good Article review progress box
Criteria: 1a. prose () 1b. MoS () 2a. ref layout () 2b. cites WP:RS () 2c. no WP:OR () 2d. no WP:CV ()
3a. broadness () 3b. focus () 4. neutral () 5. stable () 6a. free or tagged images () 6b. pics relevant ()
Note: this represents where the article stands relative to the Good Article criteria. Criteria marked are unassessed

I will do some copy editing as I go. If you disagree with or don't understand anything, could we discuss it here? Thanks.

  • Why does the still in the infobox have source information, but the video clip from which it was taken not?
Not addressed.
Lead: "an Israeli Air Force aircraft struck multiple targets"; article: "were carried out by 25 Israeli Air Force warplanes". The lead now refers to a single aircraft, the article to 25.
  • "sent out a series of strikes". Is it known if the strikes were by aircraft, missiles or drones (or some combination)? If it is, it would be helpful to say.
  • "Israeli airstrikes in Yemen in December 2024". You have already told the reader what year it is, no need to repeat it.
  • "the Houthi Movement in Yemen". Link the Houthi Movement and Yemen; it is usual to link at first mention in the lead and in the main article.
Not addressed.
  • "According to the Saudi state-owned Al Arabiya news channel, it targeted Sanaa International Airport". I assume that the 25 aircraft did the targeting? In which case "it" should be 'they'.
  • "with claims that some targets were civilian." Claims by whom?
Not addressed.
  • "took out" is not very encyclopedic. Perhaps 'destroyed' or 'badly damaged'?
Not addressed.
  • "as well as three strikes on the port of Hodeidah and the Haziz and Ras Qantib power stations." Is that three strikes on each, or one on each for a total of three?
Not addressed.
  • "and another person was killed at Ras Issa port." You haven't mentioned an attack on Ras Issa port.
  • "the Yemeni Air Force-SPC" is a mouthful, is this one entity?
Not addressed.
  • "captured during the Yemeni civil war". Who were they captured from and who by? Were they military aircraft? If so, say so.
Not addressed.
  • "three of these aircraft were reportedly destroyed." Who reported this?
  • "Al-Dailami Air Base was also reportedly struck." When you write "reportedly" you need to either state who reported it, or delete "reportedly" and state the thing as a fact.
  • "Naval tugs". Why the upper-case N? And in the infobox.
Not addressed.
  • "The death toll later rose to six, with an additional 40 being wounded." See MOS:NUMNOTES, "Comparable values near one another should be all spelled out or all in figures, even if one of the numbers would normally be written differently".
  • "the Houthi Movement launched a ballistic missile at Tel Aviv, causing sirens to sound across central Israel." What happened to the missile?
  • Suggest you reverse the order of the two paragraphs in "Responses" and run them together.
  • Infobox: "Ras Iffa Port"; main article: "Ras Iffa port". Be consistent.
I have fixed this. Gog the Mild (talk) 18:37, 7 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Spot checks

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8: "Houthi Movement owned media outlet Al-Masirah reported that at least four people were killed, and 16 others injured in the attacks". The source given states 3 killed and 14 injured.

Not addressed.

13: " Several aircraft of the Yemeni Air Force-SPC captured during the Yemeni civil war were also amongst the targets". The source given states that the aircraft are fighter jets, but makes no mention of the Yemeni Air Force, the SPC , or of them having been captured.

Not addressed.
  • The first paragraph of the "Strikes" section is completely uncited.
Not addressed.

Gog the Mild (talk) 19:09, 7 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Comment: I object to this article getting GA status due to how recent the topic is. This article could significantly change within the next few weeks with more indepth reporting, political fallout occuring, and its legacy on the ongoing conflict. This article would hardly count as being stable. GGOTCC (talk) 03:47, 8 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
This article is about a bombing which is happened 2 weeks ago. I dont think anything about this specific bombing is going to change anytime soon (or later). You are probably confused with December 2024 Israeli airstrikes in Yemen Abo Yemen✉ 07:07, 8 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
GGOTCC, it seems fine to me. If the principle you are suggesting were broadly applied then Wikipedia would never have a biography of a living person. The "Wiki" part is there because we can respond rapidly to new information. And WP:GAR is there for GAs which don't. Gog the Mild (talk) 15:31, 8 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
@Gog the Mild, hope you're doing fine, I've looked into the problems pointed out by you and have done my best to fix them, if there's anything that's missing or that I have forgot to fix please let me know Waleed (talk) 18:09, 8 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
Hi M Waleed. Most of the points I raised in my initial run through have not been addressed. I have indicated above where you still need to respond. Gog the Mild (talk) 10:47, 12 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
@Gog the Mild, two of the three concerns have been addressed, as for the SPC fighter aircraft, the SPC is the "government" of the Houthi forces and any aircraft under the Houthi operation are automatically under the operation of SPC air force Waleed (talk) 11:51, 12 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
for context there are two different governments in Yemen and both have the same govt institutions with the exact same names so we have to differentiate between them somehow Abo Yemen✉ 11:54, 12 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
More spot checks
  • 8: I can't see the "Sanaa International Airport which took out the airport's control tower" mentioned as a target. (Try source 5.)
  • 15: checks.
  • 5: almost none of the "Background" section is covered by this.
  • 6: much of the information in the paragraph cite 6 claims to cover does not seem to be there. Eg, I can't find mention of the number of aircraft (to support "were carried out by 25 Israeli Air Force warplanes") nor support for "The operation was aimed at maximizing damage while also maintaining an element of surprise."
Summary
  • The prose, MoS, images and several other areas now, IMO, meet the GA criteria - see checklist at top.
  • I checked two citations on my first run through and both had serious issues; in addition one paragraph was not cited at all. I have checked a further four, with three having serious issues. Given these I am going to fail this nomination. I would suggest that every cite is carefully checked against the text it is supposed to support before renomination. Gog the Mild (talk) 15:22, 15 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
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