Talk:Lists of music venues

United States

Shall we fork US venue into List of music venues in the United States? ---Another Believer _(Talk) 17:33, 4 July 2016 (UTC)

Fair enough. Count me in. (very late answer, pardon me) ---Cabocla (talk) 10:29, 12 February 2017 (UTC)

Another one (even later) to the discussion, and this also makes sense to me, and would resolve a problem brough up over at the helpdesk. TiggerJay (talk) 15:38, 9 December 2024 (UTC)

+1 - Can we do this soon? I tried to edit the page today and it was awful.

Perhaps we can also fork by continent. JuxtaposedJacob (talk) | :) | he/him | 10:05, 21 December 2024 (UTC)

@Another Believer, I think we've established consensus; should we do this? JuxtaposedJacob (talk) | :) | he/him | 17:27, 26 December 2024 (UTC)

Pinging @Tiggerjay per Help Desk discussion. JuxtaposedJacob (talk) | :) | he/him | 17:45, 26 December 2024 (UTC)

I'm in favor of splitting out. If someone wants to do the necessary work following the complete procedure at: WP:PROPERSPLIT TiggerJay (talk) 17:56, 26 December 2024 (UTC)

I'll take care of it. JuxtaposedJacob (talk) | :) | he/him | 20:58, 26 December 2024 (UTC)

Looks like I did the diffs wrong here and here; I clicked publish on the wrong page. JuxtaposedJacob (talk) | :) | he/him | 21:28, 26 December 2024 (UTC)

@Tiggerjay, List of music venues in the United States displays Alabama weirdly, could you take a look? Thanks! JuxtaposedJacob (talk) | :) | he/him | 22:22, 26 December 2024 (UTC)

Can you define "weirdly" it looks okay on my end. However I do think we probably want to retain section breaks for each state, instead of simply one long table/list. TiggerJay (talk) 17:25, 27 December 2024 (UTC)

I agree with the split. I have the gadget/preference/whatever enabled that keeps the headings with the relevant content, and alabama stays with the whole list, as opposed to just its state. That makes me think Alabama as a heading is defined one level too high, a hypothesis also supported by the dissimilarity between it and the other headings’ appearances. JuxtaposedJacob (talk) | :) | he/him | 22:36, 27 December 2024 (UTC)

List of music venues in the United States List of music venues in North America List of music venues in South America List of music venues in Africa List of music venues in Asia List of music venues in Oceania List of music venues in Europe

Sources and redirect pages + "unknown" tags

Hello there, I'm passing by just to humbly remind you that there are many "unknown" tags throughout the page which could be filled in. Helping with this page doesn't include only adding countless names of venues. :)
And speaking of that, please don't forget to add reliable sources to venues with no Wikipedia page existent.
Thank you! ---Cabocla (talk) 10:29, 12 February 2017 (UTC)

Inclusion

Hello all, I have a proposal. I think that the city/country-specific music articles have an issue with their inclusion criteria: namely, they are indiscriminate collections of venues; I could theoretically add every elementary and middle school with an auditorium to these lists. I also think that there is an issue with WP:DUE because only a few cities and countries have these articles, and the cities especially are biased towards the US/Canada. Further, the citations on these articles are lacking.

Countries: Netherlands, Singapore

Cities: Los Angeles, Denver (only a section), Portland, San Antonio, Montreal, Toronto, Melbourne

I think that the lists should be considerably shortened to only include venues above 1,000 people. This would be in line with the top-level continent (and United States) articles that I split from List of music venues (now a redirect) a few days ago. I could see the argument for making the inclusion criteria lower, like 500 or something, but that would raise the issue of the top-level lists being biased towards high-occupancy venues (because of the longstanding inclusion criteria) and also getting considerably larger.

I also think that they should then be merged into the top-level articles to avoid the issues with WP:DUE. However, I could also see the argument for just making them a section of the larger articles on the city, but that still runs into the WP:DUE issues.

A good compromise might be to merge only the 1,000+-person music venues into the top-level articles and include a (preferably prose) section on the relevant articles for smaller, yet notable, venues. Let me know what everyone thinks!

JuxtaposedJacob (talk) | :) | he/him | 16:47, 29 December 2024 (UTC)

In my opinion, I think its ok if the different lists have their own inclusion criteria. For example, the one that I wrote (List of music venues in Toronto) shouldn't exclude notable and important venues like Lee's Palace, The Axis Club, or Horseshoe Tavern just because of their capacity. Editors can use common sense to not include a school auditorium, for example. Clearly, sources will not describe such places as primarily music venues.

Per the DUE issues, the issue is that not enough of these list articles exist. For example, we should probably have list articles for London and NYC as they are some of the world's most popular concert cities. The sourcing exists and these pages greatly benefits the readers since it makes information more in depth and easier to find. They also split off from the main list in an intuitive way (by cities with the most venues). These articles should adopt summary style, with the higher level lists always pointing to the lower level when applicable. — PerfectSoundWhatever (t; c) 19:38, 29 December 2024 (UTC)

Re: "I could theoretically add every elementary and middle school with an auditorium to these lists". Not really because those are not independently notable. The lists should only contain notable music venues, so I don't think there's a need to set arbitrary inclusion criteria based on capacity. ---Another Believer _(Talk) 20:19, 29 December 2024 (UTC)