Talk:Messages (Apple)

Messages an enhanced and rebranded iChat?

After verification, the beta release of Messages is numbered 6.1 (11D1069). That is in continuation to iChat's version numbers. Also, many files in the Messages bundle are actually named ichat or variant of ichat. This all suggest that "Messages" is simply a rebranding of the original "iChat" application, similarly to the previous "iChatAV" to "iChat" rebranding. In that case, it might be more appropriate to rename the iChat page to Messages (application), and simply add release "6.1" in the History section.

Mjameswh (talk) 17:34, 17 February 2012 (UTC)

If that's the case, renaming the iChat page would make sense to me, although, given that iOS has an application named Messages - NOT iMessage (that's the name of the service) - perhaps it should be "Messages (Mac OS X)" or something such as that, or calling it "Messages (application)" and using it to describe both the Mac OS X and iOS versions along the lines of the Safari (web browser) page. Guy Harris (talk) 19:00, 17 February 2012 (UTC)

You're right about iMessage vs Messages, thanks. Now about merging pages... I'd say that the "Messages (Mac OS X)" vs "Messages (iOS)" option just don't seems right... Mainly because Mac OS X and iOS are two platform, just the same as Mac OS X, Windows and Linux are three, yet we don't have three almost identical pages for every software distributed on multiple platform with slightly different UI. This would undoubtedly lead to discrepancies in information displayed on these distinct pages. Also, considering how Apple is moving toward having duplicates of all its applications between Mac OS X and iOS, taking this approach would set a bad example for future Apple software pages. So the approach used on the Safari's page seems to me as the best option. This will require a little more text rework, and require moving the "iChat" page to "Messages (application)", which I can't do at current time (not yet allowed to move pages, not enough edits). The iMessage page should also be reedited, since it contains several "software/product vs service" mistake: use of the software infobox, display of an icon and a screenshot (which could be labeled as an example of a client of the iMessage service), categorized as "Instant messaging client", use of the "iOS Based product" template, and so on. I can take care of those. And one last thing... Seeing that Safari's page is "Safari (web browser)", maybe "Messages (messaging application)" would be better suited? Mjameswh (talk) 20:32, 17 February 2012 (UTC)

What you say makes sense. (Note: if iChat is moved to "Messages (messaging application)", you wouldn't need somebody's help to do any of the moves.) Guy Harris (talk) 21:47, 17 February 2012 (UTC)

Well, I was mainly concerned about maintaining the iChat's page history and discussion intact, which goes a long way, while the Messages (application) is only three edits old. Anyway, I will edit the iChat page for now, and whatever is the best course of action can wait until the text has been merged. Mjameswh (talk) 21:53, 17 February 2012 (UTC)

Of the IM clients listed on Comparison of instant messaging clients, Coccinella has "(Instant Messenger)", Empathy, naim, Pidgin, and Trillian have "(software)", Fire and Psi have "(instant messaging client)", and Zephyr has "(protocol)" (the page is about both the protocol and the initial client). Guy Harris (talk) 21:58, 17 February 2012 (UTC)

BTW, if iChat gets renamed to be the page for the OS X Messages app (which it sounds as if would be the right thing to do, given what you indicate about the Messages beta and given that it'd preserve the history), and is made the page for the iOS Messages app as well, it should probably include the history of the iOS app, which started out, as I remember, being called "SMS" when it handled only SMS - it was renamed Messages (in iOS 3.0, I think) when it was extended to support Multimedia Messaging Service (MMS) as well. Guy Harris (talk) 22:07, 17 February 2012 (UTC)

Funny, I was thinking exactly the same, just a few moments ago. I have began editing the iChat page, but time is up on my part for today, so I had to save my changes at this point (they pretty much include all the text that was in the Messages (application) page. This means the Messages (application) could be deleted at this point, then the iChat page can be renamed to Messages (???) (I'd vote for "instant messaging client", just as the category since it sounds more formal and more neutral). I guess this conversation should also be copied to, or at least linked from, the new Messages(???) talk page. Mjameswh (talk) 23:03, 17 February 2012 (UTC)

I don't think iChat should be renamed or moved without a fuller discussion. iChat remains unchanged for the majority of OSX users still, both in terms of the branding, the UI, and the protocols it uses. This is a similar situation to the Ubuntu and Ubuntu Netbook Remix articles. Technically they have been merged, but since the purpose of an encyclopedia is not just to describe the present situation but the past, there is information worth retaining in both articles. Thanks, Steven Walling • talk 00:52, 18 February 2012 (UTC)

Or perhaps it's similar to Ethereal and Wireshark - they're the same app (trust me, I've been a core developer for ages), even though the repository moved at the same time the name was changed (nobody worked on the Ethereal repository, or put out an Ethereal release, after the rename/move, and all the developers moved over to the new repository). It's not as if, at the same time the iChat page is renamed, all the discussion of the application when it was called iChat will be removed; the article will still contain all the stuff it contains now, it'll just indicate that, as of Mountain Lion, the app is called Messages (and should also discuss the iOS app, which was renamed from "SMS" to "Messages" when MMS support was added). Yes, there is currently a period of overlap where you can have "iChat" and "Messages" on the same machine, but it's not quite like Ubuntu vs. Ubuntu Netbook Remix, where it appears they were intended to be two separate flavors of OS and were offered as separate releases until they were merged; this is arguably more like running a beta of a new release of, say, Safari on your machine. Guy Harris (talk) 09:35, 18 February 2012 (UTC)

I think that this article works well at the moment, because it's in beta. When it's released in the summer, it may be best to merge it with the iChat page (which currently lists Messages as a version of itself. It is however, linked to this article), but we'll have to wait and see. I personally think that they separate applications, and that it just reuses much of its predecessor's code in a similar way that Mountain Lion will reuse much of Lion. Also, having them separate would mean that this article could, as previously mentioned, detail much of the iOS version's history. For now, I've extended this article slightly and added a couple of new sources to make it a bit more compliant. --drewmunn (talk) 16:08, 18 February 2012 (UTC)

I've moved the software infobox for iOS Messages from iMessage here, and updated it, as well as moving some of the iOS Messages stuff from iChat (in which the changes to incorporate Messages have been undone, so it's an iChat-only page, and there was never an iChat for iOS) to here. Guy Harris (talk) 19:36, 18 February 2012 (UTC)

I just stumbled across these two pages, and could not help but think the exact same thing. I strongly believe this is merely a re-branding. Neither Calendar or Contacts got a new page, why should Messages? DanielDPeterson + talk 21:42, 14 June 2012 (UTC)

Imessage

Shouldn't this page be merged into iMessage because they both have the same content so shoulder we merge this page in to iMessage — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2.217.97.16 (talk) 17:35, 16 May 2012 (UTC)

No, Messages (application) and iMessage do not have the same content, so they should not be merged. Messages (application) is a page about the Messages applications on iOS and OS X; iMessage is about Apple's iMessage service, which is one of the services supported by the Messages applications (iOS Messages also supports SMS and MMS, and OS X's Messages also supports Yahoo! Messenger, AOL Instant Messaging, and Google Talk, as the page about Messages says). Guy Harris (talk) 18:05, 16 May 2012 (UTC)

MacBook waking up sound effect

Is there any way to disable the sound effect Messages.app makes whenever I wake up OS X? --Makkachin (talk) 01:03, 19 May 2014 (UTC)

{{Infobox OS component}} vs. {{Infobox software}}

See my comment in the "{{Infobox OS component}} or {{Infobox software}}?" section of Talk:News (Apple). It pertains to iOS (and macOS) bundled apps in general, not just Messages or News in particular. Guy Harris (talk) 23:09, 22 September 2017 (UTC)

And please continue discussion there, not here; we don't need two separate discussions on this topic. 23:17, 22 September 2017 (UTC)

Updated macOS screenshot of Messages

I mean, my goodness, a screenshot from OS X Mountain Lion?!?!? That was 11 years ago! I don't own a mac so I can't take it, but maybe update the screenshot, a lot more features have been added to messages for Mac. TheBoip (talk) 00:05, 13 November 2023 (UTC)

Done. OHIO 97876 (talk) 02:12, 11 January 2024 (UTC)

Reverted by another user as a violation of WP:FAIRUSE. Please be more careful. --Yamla (talk) 10:55, 11 January 2024 (UTC)

does it follow the criteria? OHIO 97876 (talk) 12:07, 11 January 2024 (UTC)

You provided no fair-use justification at all. --Yamla (talk) 19:12, 11 January 2024 (UTC)

How do you do that? OHIO 97876 (talk) 00:32, 12 January 2024 (UTC)

See WP:FAIRUSE. --Yamla (talk) 01:52, 12 January 2024 (UTC)

Jabber support

When was Jabber support removed? Messages (Apple)#macOS version says Jabber (and AIM/Yahoo Messenger/Google Talk) support was retained in the transition from iChat to Messages, but doesn't mention it again after that. I would guess that Jabber support was removed in Big Sur when the macOS codebase was replaced with the iOS codebase using Catalyst, but it would be great to have this documented. Lily Ballard (talk) 20:53, 15 March 2024 (UTC)