Talk:List of UK singles chart Christmas number ones

Dates

When calculating what was the Christmas number one, bear in mind that the week ending date (used by many reference books etc) is not the same as the date the chart was released (Tuesdays until October 1987, Sundays after that). The latter should be used in determining what was number one on Christmas Day. Usually it doesn't make any difference, but on a few occasions it does. I've listed them here, should you be sad enough to want to know:

1980: St Winifred's School Choir: reached number one in chart week ending 27 Dec, actual date reached number one 23 Dec

1985: Shakin' Stevens: reached number one in chart week ending 28 Dec, actual date reached number one 24 Dec

1986: Jackie Wilson: reached number one in chart week ending 27 Dec, actual date reached number one 23 Dec

1990: Cliff Richard: reached number one in chart week ending 29 Dec, actual date reached number one 23 Dec

Additionally, in 2005 Shayne Ward's That's My Goal wasn't confirmed as the Christmas number one until the new Top 40 was unveiled on Christmas Day. So arguably for most of the day it was still Nizlopi at number one. It depends how pedantic you want to be about it! MFlet1 12:29, 19 December 2006 (UTC)

-

I Have to agree somehow, that the list above is the correct xmas no1, even totp and VH1 has All those 4 as the Xmas no 1. Shakin stevens was the 1985 XMas no1.

if you can Complain at VH1, TOPT and other music channel then please do, but you will lose there have the 4 above list as the xmas ones. I dare say wiki will not agree and continual to be the only place one web to be wrong, so much for the clean up campaign to have the correct infomration.

UK Christmas Charts is not a true source as Data of Sales,Units & Streams is taking before Xmas

Tradionally to Modern times the christmas charts is a week early and not as accurate as it should be as the data of sales & Units is taking before the 1st Day Of Christmas which is the 25th December and does not contain any traces of christmas Week or the big Day, just becuase of the week ending, it valid, but it should be after Christmas Day the Christmas Charts not before.

Shakin' Stevens was #1 in Christmas 1985

As stated above, Shakin' Stevens was OFFICIALLY Christmas #1 in 1985 with Merry Christmas Everyone, the wiki article is erroneous. A further example is http://www.everyhit.com/christmasnumber1.html Quote - "A technical note; the Christmas Number One does not always synchronise with the dates elsewhere as they refer to 'week ending' chart dates. These are the real Christmas Number Ones". The wiki article is bogus and should be ammended (i dont have enough posts to do so). —Preceding unsigned comment added by AaronTownsend (talk • contribs) 10:09, 11 December 2009 (UTC)

Done. Please give references so it can stay that way, simply saying it's true isn't enough even if it is.  GARDEN  11:49, 11 December 2009 (UTC)

2007/2008

This must be someone's idea of a joke- Wikipedia can't announce the holder of the Christmas Number One three weeks, or a whole year before the charts are published. If no-one has any arguments, I can change this? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.104.175.7 (talk) 03:26, 8 December 2007 (UTC)

Not only are they predicting the Christmas number-one, they're predicting the song that will be given to next year's X Factor winner! Wikipedia is not a crystal ball. ^anemone│_projectors 14:49, 8 December 2007 (UTC)

Weeks at No.1

Why does this list weeks at No.1? This isn't important, it's to do with what was No.1 for the single week of Christmas - or specifically Christmas Day.--Tuzapicabit (talk) 19:52, 8 October 2008 (UTC)

Its used alot within the industry to compare number ones.(82.8.216.208 (talk) 21:09, 19 December 2009 (UTC))

Before or after

The opening section says "Christmas number one singles are those that are at the top of the UK Singles Chart on the nearest Sunday after Christmas."

Shouldn't this say "nearest Sunday before Christmas"? In fact, and to prevent any ambiguity, shouldn't it say "on the Sunday before Christmas Day"? ~~ Peteb16 (talk) 18:54, 21 December 2008 (UTC)

Yeah, probably. I'll go fix that. Garden. 21:16, 21 December 2008 (UTC)

Yes, the Sunday before Christmas day. Basically, whatever is No.1 ON Christmas day. Although some people dispute the fact that the chart for the week after Christmas are actually the sales from Christmas week, but this is not the official line. --Tuzapicabit (talk) 17:56, 23 December 2008 (UTC)

"Basically, whatever is No.1 ON Christmas day." Then the ten incorrect entries must be changed. See my posting "At least ten errors". I list the actual number 1 on Christmas Day. The Spice Girls have NEVER had a number 1 on Christmas Day. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.217.237.19 (talk) 01:18, 24 December 2011 (UTC)

WP:OR dictates this isn't a good idea. The entries at the moment are all sourced and therefore, for our purposes, correct. — Joseph Fox 08:28, 24 December 2011 (UTC)

Change a link?

Note that the Hallelujah link is stale, due to a rewording on the target page, can this be changed? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.170.169.227 (talk) 17:35, 26 December 2008 (UTC)

OK, done it myself (page was locked) 86.170.169.227 (talk) 23:15, 31 December 2008 (UTC)

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1985

Its SEEM wiki has MAJOR ERROR

http://en.wiki.x.io/wiki/Merry_Christmas_Everyone

That was the xmas one in the UK, yet it list as WHITNEY WHO? even Totp had it was xmas no1,

please get it right, —Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.204.127.90 (talk) 22:49, 22 November 2009 (UTC)

Correct, Shakin' Stevens was #1 in Christmas 1985

As stated above, Shakin' Stevens was OFFICIALLY Christmas #1 in 1985 with Merry Christmas Everyone, the wiki article is erroneous. A further example is http://www.everyhit.com/christmasnumber1.html Quote - "A technical note; the Christmas Number One does not always synchronise with the dates elsewhere as they refer to 'week ending' chart dates. These are the real Christmas Number Ones". To echo what another user said - "When calculating what was the Christmas number one, bear in mind that the week ending date (used by many reference books etc) is not the same as the date the chart was released (Tuesdays until October 1987, Sundays after that)".

The wiki article List of Christmas number one singles (UK) is bogus, Houston was not #1 Christmas '85, and should be corrected (i dont have enough posts to do so).AaronTownsend (talk • contribs) 10:09, 11 December 2009 (UTC)

UK

Is the christmas number one that big a deal outside the UK? There's still potential for an article about this phenomenon from a purely UK perspective (and separate from the UK singles chart article, but if it's not that significant outside the UK, then probably not at this heading. (Also, if it's not a big deal elsewhere, then the List of christmas number ones is redundant). Bonalaw 09:45, 18 Aug 2004 (UTC)

No idea. I created it under this heading because I was trying to avoid a UK-only article and encourage people to fill in the details of their country. Surely there is somewhere else that sees them as a "special" number one? If not then we can just rename it. violet/riga 10:15, 18 Aug 2004 (UTC)

I was referring to List of Christmas number one singles in that reply, oops! violet/riga 11:06, 19 Aug 2004 (UTC)

I don't see why there's two articles. List of Christmas number one singles should be merged in here. Mintguy (T)

They should be kept seperate imo - people should be able to link to the meaning of a Christmas #1 without going to a huge page containing all the songs. The list is supposed to cover international Christmas #1s (though there is debate as to whether it is recognised outside the UK). Admittedly this article needs fleshing out - perhaps we can find some quotes from people that have achieved a Christmas #1 or some other interesting facts. violet/riga 11:06, 19 Aug 2004 (UTC)

Should we also have a list of US Christmas No. 1 hits? (AndrewAnorak (talk) 16:08, 27 December 2007 (UTC))

Non-christmasness

We could mention perhaps the fact that in recent years Christmas no 1s have rarely actually mentioned Christmas? Morwen - Talk 01:28, 19 December 2005 (UTC)

Though not for lack of trying, it seems, given the existence of Bring Back...The Christmas Number One GeeJo _{(t) (c)} • 23:14, 16 January 2006 (UTC)

TV Influence

Just thought it might be an idea to make a point that programmes such as the xfactor etc are gurranteeded as christmas number one on the back of the shows publicity. This has taken the enjoyment out of the guessing game and leaves other records with little or no chance of getting the festive top spot (82.2.126.224 10:25, 10 December 2006 (UTC))

This is definitely what happened in 2002 and 2005, have any other years had reality show winners release their first single for Christmas? — AnemoneProjectors (talk) 19:19, 10 December 2006 (UTC)

Dates

Someone added a sentence to say that some singles which are popularly believed to be Christmas number one were not, amongst others "Merry Christmas Everyone" by Shakin' Stevens and "Reet Petite" by Jackie Wilson. This is incorrect.

Bear in mind that many reference books etc use the week-ending date of the chart which is not the date the chart was actually released. For example the Shakin' Stevens record is often listed as having reached number one on 28 Dec 1985, but in fact that chart was released on Christmas Eve, meaning it was the Christmas number one. MFlet1 09:50, 19 December 2006 (UTC)

"Merry Christmas Everyone" by Shakin' Stevens and "Reet Petite" by Jackie Wilson were both xmas number ones. The chart dates are week ending dates for the Saturday following the Sunday the chart was announced. Phildav76 14:51, 28 December 2006 (UTC)

US Punctuation

What is it with you americans with your fetish for punctuation? Is 'Christmas number-one single' valid grammatically? No. You act as if 'number' and 'one' can't stand independently. Really, you're bastardising a nice language. Why don't you all go and start speaking SPANISH instead?

Sadly it's not just an American thing: you'll find similar abominations widespread in British journalism nowadays.Contains Mild Peril (talk) 05:45, 2 February 2009 (UTC)

Redundant

This article feels like a shell. It overlaps with List of Christmas number one singles (UK) and has less information; everything that matters in this article could easily be added to the opening paragraphs of List of Christmas number one singles (UK). I vote for deleting this article (complete with its odd "number-one" punctuation) and leaving List of Christmas number one singles (UK). -Ashley Pomeroy (talk) 16:21, 29 March 2009 (UTC)

1985

Its SEEM wiki has MAJOR ERROR

http://en.wiki.x.io/wiki/Merry_Christmas_Everyone

That was the xmas one in the UK, yet it list as WHITNEY WHO? even Totp had it was xmas no1,

please get it right, —Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.204.127.90 (talk) 22:49, 22 November 2009 (UTC)

Correct, Shakin' Stevens was #1 in Christmas 1985

As stated above, Shakin' Stevens was OFFICIALLY Christmas #1 in 1985 with Merry Christmas Everyone, the wiki article is erroneous. A further example is http://www.everyhit.com/christmasnumber1.html Quote - "A technical note; the Christmas Number One does not always synchronise with the dates elsewhere as they refer to 'week ending' chart dates. These are the real Christmas Number Ones". To echo what another user said - "When calculating what was the Christmas number one, bear in mind that the week ending date (used by many reference books etc) is not the same as the date the chart was released (Tuesdays until October 1987, Sundays after that)".

The wiki article List of Christmas number one singles (UK) is bogus, Houston was not #1 Christmas '85, and should be corrected (i dont have enough posts to do so).AaronTownsend (talk • contribs) 10:09, 11 December 2009 (UTC)

UK

Is the christmas number one that big a deal outside the UK? There's still potential for an article about this phenomenon from a purely UK perspective (and separate from the UK singles chart article, but if it's not that significant outside the UK, then probably not at this heading. (Also, if it's not a big deal elsewhere, then the List of christmas number ones is redundant). Bonalaw 09:45, 18 Aug 2004 (UTC)

No idea. I created it under this heading because I was trying to avoid a UK-only article and encourage people to fill in the details of their country. Surely there is somewhere else that sees them as a "special" number one? If not then we can just rename it. violet/riga 10:15, 18 Aug 2004 (UTC)

I was referring to List of Christmas number one singles in that reply, oops! violet/riga 11:06, 19 Aug 2004 (UTC)

I don't see why there's two articles. List of Christmas number one singles should be merged in here. Mintguy (T)

They should be kept seperate imo - people should be able to link to the meaning of a Christmas #1 without going to a huge page containing all the songs. The list is supposed to cover international Christmas #1s (though there is debate as to whether it is recognised outside the UK). Admittedly this article needs fleshing out - perhaps we can find some quotes from people that have achieved a Christmas #1 or some other interesting facts. violet/riga 11:06, 19 Aug 2004 (UTC)

Should we also have a list of US Christmas No. 1 hits? (AndrewAnorak (talk) 16:08, 27 December 2007 (UTC))

Non-christmasness

We could mention perhaps the fact that in recent years Christmas no 1s have rarely actually mentioned Christmas? Morwen - Talk 01:28, 19 December 2005 (UTC)

Though not for lack of trying, it seems, given the existence of Bring Back...The Christmas Number One GeeJo _{(t) (c)} • 23:14, 16 January 2006 (UTC)

TV Influence

Just thought it might be an idea to make a point that programmes such as the xfactor etc are gurranteeded as christmas number one on the back of the shows publicity. This has taken the enjoyment out of the guessing game and leaves other records with little or no chance of getting the festive top spot (82.2.126.224 10:25, 10 December 2006 (UTC))

This is definitely what happened in 2002 and 2005, have any other years had reality show winners release their first single for Christmas? — AnemoneProjectors (talk) 19:19, 10 December 2006 (UTC)

Dates

Someone added a sentence to say that some singles which are popularly believed to be Christmas number one were not, amongst others "Merry Christmas Everyone" by Shakin' Stevens and "Reet Petite" by Jackie Wilson. This is incorrect.

Bear in mind that many reference books etc use the week-ending date of the chart which is not the date the chart was actually released. For example the Shakin' Stevens record is often listed as having reached number one on 28 Dec 1985, but in fact that chart was released on Christmas Eve, meaning it was the Christmas number one. MFlet1 09:50, 19 December 2006 (UTC)

"Merry Christmas Everyone" by Shakin' Stevens and "Reet Petite" by Jackie Wilson were both xmas number ones. The chart dates are week ending dates for the Saturday following the Sunday the chart was announced. Phildav76 14:51, 28 December 2006 (UTC)

US Punctuation

What is it with you americans with your fetish for punctuation? Is 'Christmas number-one single' valid grammatically? No. You act as if 'number' and 'one' can't stand independently. Really, you're bastardising a nice language. Why don't you all go and start speaking SPANISH instead?

Sadly it's not just an American thing: you'll find similar abominations widespread in British journalism nowadays.Contains Mild Peril (talk) 05:45, 2 February 2009 (UTC)

Redundant

This article feels like a shell. It overlaps with List of Christmas number one singles (UK) and has less information; everything that matters in this article could easily be added to the opening paragraphs of List of Christmas number one singles (UK). I vote for deleting this article (complete with its odd "number-one" punctuation) and leaving List of Christmas number one singles (UK). -Ashley Pomeroy (talk) 16:21, 29 March 2009 (UTC)

Grammar

Could someone with an account please change "From 2005 to 2008, the winner of the talent competition..." to "From 2005 to 2008, the winners of the talent competition..." to pluralise "winner" 90.212.251.246 (talk) 19:06, 20 December 2009 (UTC)

• Done Thanks, DotComCairney 19:10, 20 December 2009 (UTC)

Picture of Rage?

We seem to have thumbnails of selected artists, presumably ones who's chart-topping is considered most notable. As there's space for one more, does the Wikipedia community think a picture of them, with a caption briefly explaining the extraordinary circumstances surrounding their grabbing the top spot? Quantum Burrito (talk) 22:54, 20 December 2009 (UTC)

Importance

As a U.S. resident who looked this up after hearing about the RATM thing, I think this page would benefit from some kind of explanation as to why the UK's number one single on Christmas is such a big deal. Is it some kind of tradition or something?

--Agreed, I came here looking for the same information and was disappointed. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.58.155.129 (talk) 22:03, 21 January 2010 (UTC)

Unfortunately a lot of Wikipedia editors think that people only read articles if they are already somewhat familiar with the subject. AnemoneProjectors (talk) 22:22, 21 January 2010 (UTC)

Yes, agreed, why is this not explained? What's the point of an encyclopedia article if it doesn't even explain the topic? 173.178.252.161 (talk) 02:36, 5 March 2010 (UTC)

Ya, someone who knows should update this article. I mean, what about Easter #1 singles or New Year's #1 singles? There must be some significance to being a "Christmas number one" that makes this encyclopedia worthy. I'm thinking of asking to have the whole article removed. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.99.251.171 (talk) 21:50, 4 October 2010 (UTC)

Where's the list of #1 singles on Saint Swithun's Day? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Dutchman Schultz (talk • contribs) 22:03, 24 July 2010 (UTC)

I've added a little bit about why Christmas number 1 is perceived as important in the UK. Boleslaw (talk) 03:23, 13 December 2010 (UTC)DB

"Many of the Christmas number ones were also the best-selling song of the year"

This is pedantic I admit but the number of Christmas #1's that were actually the best selling song of the year is less than 10. Does this really qualify for "many of the Christmas Number ones"? (90.220.96.205 (talk) 02:59, 5 December 2010 (UTC))

"Love Actually"

I've never seen this film, but more than one previous editor has written that the Christmas Number 1 is a theme in this film, and the film is very popular, I think this information should be kept. I think it should be kept because, on the talk page, people have asked for information to show why the Christmas Number 1 is noteworthy. So I have reverted the removal of this information, and put it in a new section "Cultural references". Boleslaw (talk) 16:09, 14 December 2010 (UTC)DB

Taking it out again. See WP:TRIVIA.  f o x  18:29, 14 December 2010 (UTC)

Mess!

What the hell has happened here? This article is about the Christmas No.1, but it seems to be cluttered with the Christmas No.2s as well! I see that the other article was merged but come on, this is ridiculous! The Christmas No.2 is hardly notable - and yet, here they all are given equal importance - perhaps I should just put the whole Christmas top 10? Some notable No.2s can perhaps be mentioned in a separate section afterwards (and the reason why), but they probably amount to about three.--Tuzapicabit (talk) 02:16, 2 July 2011 (UTC)

I've done my best here; regarding number twos, having a section afterwards makes it look even worse, believe me. And we couldn't really use one or two of the number twos as it strikes as a bit "what about x, and y, and z..." and we'd end up with all of them anyway. If I had my way they wouldn't be mentioned at all, but I don't.  狐 Déan rolla bairille!  08:53, 2 July 2011 (UTC)

Actually I think it looked better in the separate section (having viewed the history). It kept it apart, which causes less confusion. I think all the #2s should be scrapped with maybe a prose paragraph afterwards on notable #2s.--Tuzapicabit (talk) 01:22, 3 July 2011 (UTC)

Agree about removing the number 2s. If there have been any notable Christmas runners-up (as covered by multiple reliable sources) then they can be mentioned, briefly (they shouldn't be given undue weight in a list of number 1s). Merging a list of runners-up here, without as far as I can see any prior notification to the talk page of this list, made this featured list much worse (it lost the sortability, for instance). The information doesn't have to be retained here just because some AfD thought it would be a good idea, if the consensus at this article is that it ought not to be kept. Bencherlite^Talk 12:19, 4 July 2011 (UTC)

I'll happily remove the number twos. A paragraph after the list is not a good idea, by the way - before, certainly.  狐 Déan rolla bairille!  20:36, 4 July 2011 (UTC)

Removed, refs for adding some stuff into the article bit of it:

 狐 Déan rolla bairille!  20:51, 4 July 2011 (UTC)

Yes, that's much better. While we're about it though, can I ask if there's a reason for the total weeks at No.1 section? If this is about what was No.1 at Christmas, then surely only that particular week is significant in this article. Total weeks at No.1 for each of these songs is available elsewhere.--Tuzapicabit (talk) 23:58, 5 July 2011 (UTC)

Move discussion in progress

There is a move discussion in progress on Talk:List of number-one singles (UK) which affects this page. Please participate on that page and not in this talk page section. Thank you. —RM bot 19:30, 16 September 2011 (UTC)

At least ten errors in the Wikipedia list

The source for the UK has always - to my knowledge - been Guiness's Hit Singles. I have the 16th edition with every number 1 from 14th November 1952 to 28th December 2002. Pages 30-42.

There are quite a few incorrect entries in the Wikipedia list.

Here are the corrections.

• 1959 wiki entry correct but also a tie for number 1. "With What do you want, Adam Faith"
• 1961 Wiki entry incorrect. Danny Williams made number 1 on 28th December. The corect Christmas number 1 is Tower of Strength, Frankie Vaughn.
• 1980 Wiki entry incorrect. St Winifred's made number 1 on 27th December. The correct Christmas number 1 is (Just Like)Starting Over, John Lennon.
• 1985 Wiki entry incorrect. Shaking stevens made number 1 on 28th December. The correct Christmas number 1 is Saving all my love for you, Whitney Houston.
• 1986 Wiki entry incorrect. Reet Petite made number 1 on 27th December. The correct Christmas number 1 is Caravan of Love, The Housemartins
• 1990 Wiki entry incorrect. Saviour's Day made number 1 on 29th December. The correct Christmas number 1 is Ice Ice baby, Vanilla Ice.
• 1996 Wiki entry incorrect. Spice girl's made number 1 on 28th December (2 become 1). The correct Chistmas number 1 is Knockin' on Heaven's door/Throw these guns away. Dunblane.
• 1997 Wiki entry incorrect. Spice girl's made number 1 on 27th December (Too Much). The correct Chistmas number 1 is Teletubbies say EH-OH, by The Teletubbies.
• 1998 Wiki entry incorrect. Spice girl's made number 1 on 26th December (Goodbye). The correct Chistmas number 1 is To you I belong by B*Witched.
• 2002 Wiki entry incorrect. Girls Aloud made number 1 on 28th December. The correct Chistmas number 1 is Sorry seems to be the hardest word, Blue featuring Elton John.

Note therefore that Spice Girls have never had a Christmas number 1. The only acceptable definition of a Christmas number 1 must be number 1 on Christmas Day. The Wiki entries have come from someone with an incorrect source. Guiness have always been known as the correct and official version on this subject. Their book says it is in association with "The official UK Charts Company".

I don't know how to edit this page but I would like to say ^^^ all this above about spice girls is all true here is the links as proof by the Offical charts company who are the ones who create the charts and I have even phoned them and they said that spice girls have never been Christmas no 1 1996 link http://www.officialcharts.com/all-the-number-ones-singles-list/_/1996/ 1997 link http://www.officialcharts.com/all-the-number-ones-singles-list/_/1997/ 1998 link http://www.officialcharts.com/all-the-number-ones-singles-list/_/1998/

Now can someone please change the spice girls as it frustrates me that they where never no 1 on christmas so please fix this — Preceding unsigned comment added by BryDeca (talk • contribs) 21:58, 27 December 2014 (UTC)

It is quite likely that some of the Wiki entries from 2003-2010 are also incorrect.

I will not update this for a few days. First I want to be sure that everyone is in agreement. If people are not in agreement then I think the above should be mentioned. Anyone with this book (or any other in the series) can easily check the Wiki entries against the printed version. When they see that Wiki has at least 10 errors it sinks the reputation of Wikipedia as a correct source.

This is the source of the correct info. http://www.amazon.co.uk/Guinness-World-Records-British-Singles/dp/085112190X — Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.217.237.19 (talk) 01:13, 24 December 2011 (UTC)

Again, the sources we have are classed as reliable. Besides, the Christmas chart is not the chart before Christmas every time - it is occasionally the Sunday after Christmas Day. — Joseph Fox 08:39, 24 December 2011 (UTC)

Yeah, look like I'm right. The charts are "week ending sales" so will usually be after Christmas Day: http://www.everyhit.com/christmasnumber1.html — Joseph Fox 08:47, 24 December 2011 (UTC)

Then I think another list is necessary as myself and many others are more interested in knowing which song was actually number 1 on Christmas Day. What's the point of "List of UK Singles Chart Christmas number ones" if it is not the song that was actually number one on actual Christmas Day? I am not saying this list is incorrect just that it is not the list I was expecting to find. For a personal reason I wanted to know what song was number one on 25th December in a given year, this list does not give me that information. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.82.207.76 (talk) 00:29, 6 January 2012 (UTC)

We could possibly add these in as footnotes? Such as the ones already in the article to discuss double A sides? — Joseph Fox 06:26, 6 January 2012 (UTC)

Why are "Christmas number ones" notable?

Similar to the discussion above (http://en.wiki.x.io/wiki/Talk:List_of_UK_Singles_Chart_Christmas_number_ones#Importance), can someone add some information in the article regarding the notability of this topic? Looking at the detail provided it seems that there is some significance to this, which I don't understand. Without an explanation, I would / will nominate this article for deletion. I agree with many of the comments provided previously, which I will paraphrase:

• Why is the UK's number one single on Christmas such a big deal. Is it some kind of tradition or something?
• What's the point of an encyclopedia article if it doesn't even explain the topic?
• Where's the list of #1 singles on Saint Swithun's Day? Gfcvoice (talk) 14:13, 7 March 2012 (UTC)

Sure, we could add some or all of these reliable sources: Daily Telegraph, Metro, Daily Mail etc who all refer to the Xmas number one as "presitigous". Does that answer your question? The Rambling Man (talk) 14:24, 7 March 2012 (UTC)

Thanks for your quick response. The short answer is no, it doesn't really answer the question. Although those three sources state that "Christmas number one" is prestigious, they don't explain why. For readers like myself outside of the UK, there doesn't seem to be any reason why a "Christmas number one" is of greater importance than a number one single at any other time of the year. Another way to look at this is - if I were to start an article with "List of UK Singles Chart fist week of March number ones", I would expect that it would be nominated for deletion for being non-notable. Why are "Christmas number ones" notable? Gfcvoice (talk) 14:46, 7 March 2012 (UTC)

I've added those to justify "prestigious" in the lead, reworded a touch to include a ref that explains the volume of sales is highest at Xmas. I'll see if there's anything else I can dig up. It's not really up to me to explain why someone in the Daily Telegraph etc considers it to be prestigious. You certainly wouldn't stand a hope in hell of getting it deleted, the notability is proven by these sources. From a personal perspective (which is worthless I know, but hey...) the number one is talked about and bet on for weeks ahead of Xmas. We only have one "official" chart in the UK unlike the many Billboards etc so it's a bit like The Boat Race, a once a year oddity that gathers a large gamut of interest. If you can find any evidence that the Saint Swithun's Day number one is notable by multiple reliable sources covering it, then I'll write the list. The Rambling Man (talk) 14:56, 7 March 2012 (UTC)

Thanks for your response and your edits to improve the article. Although I don't think the articles referring to the number one as "prestigious" added much light on the topic, the "Have a chart-topping Christmas" article provided very useful information. That the "Christmas number one" is bet on for weeks ahead of Christmas is interesting, and of relevance to the topic's notability. Gfcvoice (talk) 15:03, 7 March 2012 (UTC)

The links were there to resolve your "citation needed" tag for the claim of prestige. Google news has the odd 20k hits over the past on our Christmas number one obssession. You could possibly learn even more there. The Rambling Man (talk) 15:08, 7 March 2012 (UTC)

Thanks for your response. I did a Google search (146 million results using the same search term you used) but unfortunately most results don't answer the "why" question. Although I did find one good article which said http://www.theedgesusu.co.uk/features/2011/12/20/the-christmas-number-one-whats-all-the-fuss/

"Maybe, then, the Christmas number one is nothing more than a self-fulfilling prophecy – an accolade to gain just to go down in history as the Christmas one. Or, more pessimistically, it is a time to cash in when people are spending more freely." Gfcvoice (talk) 15:19, 7 March 2012 (UTC)

Well it's certainly the case that in recent times, manufactured musicians from The X Factor have made artificially inflated sales on the back the likes of Simon Cowell and the subsequent backlash has resulted in oldie-but-goodie hits by artists like Rage Against the Machine rising to the top after many years. The Rambling Man (talk) 15:31, 7 March 2012 (UTC)

Arguably there was a time (1950's -80's and debatably the 90's) when it was notable in the sense that it took several millions copies of a single to be sold in order to qualify. Traditionally this represented the busiest time of year for the record industry so we're talking about a sizeable sum of money (some of which may even have made it to the artists concerned !). In 2021 its one of those things which people only care about out of tradition (and because the media still make a big deal out of it -arguably because it's a time of year when real news tends to be thin on the ground) so while its notability in the 21st century is highly questionable it it still qualifies as encyclopedic because people are still talking about it (for some reason) 109.158.138.213 (talk) 20:55, 19 December 2021 (UTC)

Spice girls to be changed to the real number ones.

Once again as a few people have say'd the spice girls were never as @fox has said there are more than just this here is his list

Here are the corrections.

• 1959 wiki entry correct but also a tie for number 1. "With What do you want, Adam Faith"
• 1961 Wiki entry incorrect. Danny Williams made number 1 on 28th December. The corect Christmas number 1 is Tower of Strength, Frankie Vaughn.
• 1980 Wiki entry incorrect. St Winifred's made number 1 on 27th December. The correct Christmas number 1 is (Just Like)Starting Over, John Lennon.
• 1985 Wiki entry incorrect. Shaking stevens made number 1 on 28th December. The correct Christmas number 1 is Saving all my love for you, Whitney Houston.
• 1986 Wiki entry incorrect. Reet Petite made number 1 on 27th December. The correct Christmas number 1 is Caravan of Love, The Housemartins
• 1990 Wiki entry incorrect. Saviour's Day made number 1 on 29th December. The correct Christmas number 1 is Ice Ice baby, Vanilla Ice.
• 1996 Wiki entry incorrect. Spice girl's made number 1 on 28th December (2 become 1). The correct Christmas number 1 is Knockin' on Heaven's door/Throw these guns away. Dunblane.
• 1997 Wiki entry incorrect. Spice girl's made number 1 on 27th December (Too Much). The correct Christmas number 1 is Teletubbies say EH-OH, by The Teletubbies.
• 1998 Wiki entry incorrect. Spice girl's made number 1 on 26th December (Goodbye). The correct Christmas number 1 is To you I belong by B*Witched.
• 2002 Wiki entry incorrect. Girls Aloud made number 1 on 28th December. The correct Christmas number 1 is Sorry seems to be the hardest word, Blue featuring Elton John.

Note therefore that Spice Girls have never had a Christmas number 1. The only acceptable definition of a Christmas number 1 must be number 1 on Christmas Day. The Wiki entries have come from someone with an incorrect source. Guiness have always been known as the correct and official version on this subject. Their book says it is in association with "The official UK Charts Company".

and here is the link to The Official Charts Company page on all number one's ever as you may see there is no spice girls as christmas number one.

http://www.officialcharts.com/chart-news/all-the-number-1-singles__7931/

And I must also point out that the website everyhit.com can not be used as a reliable source as they don't run the charts, The Official Charts Company do, So I would assume anyone would realize that what they have on there website is right. I have emailed them to change it too.

I would also like to point out I have phoned them myself and they have told me that in order for it to be classed as Christmas number 1 it has to be on Christmas day or the Sunday before that. Not the Sunday after that would be classed as the last number one of the year. which the spice girls have had. Never on Christmas have they had a number one on Christmas.

And last point to all who are wondering the reason this is so important to anyone in Britain is that we love Christmas number ones, As they are usually charity singles. But that is my personal thought's, I don't know about the rest of the UK.

92.29.36.88 (talk) 11:07, 11 March 2015 (UTC)

The Brits do have a peculiar fascination with the Christmas number one song, and I got a real kick out of seeing Killing in the Name rise back to number one in 2009 just to piss Simon Cowell off. That said, with such a fascination in the topic, how can it be that there is no reliable source that lists them? We shouldn't be the ones attempting to define the term or decide exactly which chart week counts.

As for your interpretation, you've used the end-date of the week as the start date. Taking "Rage Against the Machine" as an example, your source lists "26/12/09", while if I go to http://www.officialcharts.com/charts/singles-chart/20091220/7501 I can see that is the 20/12/09-26/12/09 chart.—Kww(talk) 14:37, 11 March 2015 (UTC)

The Christmas chart is the last one to be published prior to Christmas Day. For 2015 it will be the chart published on Sunday the 20th, which will be based on sales from the week leading up to the 20th. --Michig (talk) 19:10, 11 March 2015 (UTC)

Absolutely true, Michig, but the chart published on the 20th is labeled Dec 26th on officialcharts.com.—Kww(talk) 20:10, 11 March 2015 (UTC)

Correct. For the chart published on the Sunday they list it as applying from that Sunday until the Saturday afterwards (20th - 26th in the above case), which confusingly is the week after the sales that it is based on. --Michig (talk) 21:11, 11 March 2015 (UTC)

In response to the concerns of the OP, I concur, at least with regard to the stats on the 2002 number one. This page on Everyhit states that Blue were number one on the week prior to Christmas Day, yet Everyhit's own Christmas list seems to contradict this. Concerned. The Rambling Man (talk) 19:24, 11 March 2015 (UTC)

Let's see what we can find from contemporary news sources, shall we, rather than lists created later which may or may not be accurate with regard to dates. I struggle to find anything easily for 1980 and earlier, but the complaints about 1985 onwards raised above are, I'm afraid, wrong.

• 1985 - The Mirror "SHAKIN' STEVENS has topped the charts with Merry Christmas Everyone—and bashed the bookies for £10.000. Shaky has cost them that by pipping Band Aid for the No I spot this Christmas."
• 1986 – Daily Express "POP HISTORY was made yesterday when a song first released in 1957 leapt to the top of the Christmas charts. Reet Petite, by rock idol Jackie Wilson — who died nearly three years ago — pushed the Housemartins' Caravan of Love off the top perch."
• 1990 - Daily Express "[Cliff Richard's] record sales now exceed 300 million and he has just reached No 1 for the third successive Christmas, with his hit Saviour's Day."
• 1996 - Daily Express "THE Spice Girls have knocked the Dunblane song off the top of the pop charts. Their ploy in delaying the release of their single, 2 Become 1, for a week so as not to clash with the charity record Knockin' On Heaven's Door worked, sending it straight to No. 1. Bookmakers will now have to pay out heavily to punters who backed the group to top the Christmas chart. It is their third song in a row to reach No. 1."
• 1997 - The Mirror "THOUSANDS of seven year-olds were last night blamed for helping the Spice Girls become this year's Christmas No 1. ... [One record retailer said] 'It was a tight race. For a while it looked like it was going to be an Eh-Oh-awful Christmas. We can thank the Spice Girls for sparing us that.'"
• 1998 - BBC News "Thrice Spice for Christmas" reporting that the Spice Girls had scored their third consecutive Christmas number 1.
• 2002 - BBC News "Girls Aloud top festive chart" - so Girls Aloud, not Blue

So the Spice Girls have indeed had three number 1 hits, not none as alleged. Etc. Bencherlite^Talk 20:29, 11 March 2015 (UTC)

I guess one conclusion here is that we should begin (or continue) to question the reliability of Everyhit ... (upon which most of this article is based) The Rambling Man (talk) 20:39, 11 March 2015 (UTC)

Quite the opposite. Everyhit gets all of these right, according to the contemporary news reports I've found. It's The Official Charts Company page which needs to be treated with caution because it is not clear at first what the date means. The complaint about 1997, for example, is that the Spice Girls became no 1 on 27th December, and that the Teletubbies were the Christmas number 1, but that's not the case according to newspaper reports from the time. Bencherlite^Talk 20:47, 11 March 2015 (UTC)

Ok, perhaps it's because I'm SO TIRED, but it seemed to me that Everyhit contradicted itself, with their Chrimbo no. 1 page saying Girls Aloud for 2002 while their number one index which includes 2002 says "945 21 Dec Blue featuring Elton John Sorry Seems To Be The Hardest Word". I dunno, what's going on around here? The Rambling Man (talk) 21:03, 11 March 2015 (UTC)

P.S. Glad you and I are really dealing with the big issues on Wikipedia these days.... Mr Blobby anyone? The Rambling Man (talk) 21:05, 11 March 2015 (UTC)

Oh, I see now, but as long as the main Christmas list is correct, which it seems to be from this analysis, we're ok. And Mr Blobby? I know I've put on a few pounds over the years, but that's a bit harsh! Bencherlite^Talk 21:08, 11 March 2015 (UTC)

I guess the references (which are sparse) need to correct and if they conflict with one another, perhaps we could start to think about your refs, although I feel physically sick at the idea of using the Daily Express as a reliable source.... The Rambling Man (talk) 21:11, 11 March 2015 (UTC)

Try the Everyhit "date engine", which for e.g. 25 December 2002 says "Girls Aloud". Bencherlite^Talk 22:29, 11 March 2015 (UTC)

As I have already stated everyhit is not a reliable source as The Official Charts company are the regulators they are the ones who are right and if you have read the Guinness British Singles And Albums Which both The Official Charts Company and Guinness have written together, Both of whom are really reliable and most people have heard of and trust, If this entire page is based on what everyhit has to say I think the page should be taken down. And as for the links that you have posted as proof I can't see them and then again newspapers have always stated that spice girls have had 3 Christmas number ones but if you watch or listen to a music channel at Christmas which plays every Christmas number one (If it say's the official one, In conjunction with The Official Charts Company) You will hear the singles that I have mentioned. But I would like to point out if they don't have anything with The Official Charts Company on the channel they can show what ever they like, I have phoned them myself twice now and they have even said that channels can do this Unless it states what I have said then they have to show the true Number 1's.

Bencherlite, it's just that you are misreading the OCC chart. If you look at http://www.officialcharts.com/charts/singles-chart/19971207/7501 and http://www.officialcharts.com/charts/singles-chart/19971214/7501 you will see that the Teletubbies were #1 from 7 Dec to 20 Dec. The problem is that the chart covering 14 Dec to 20 Dec is listed as the December 20 chart, which causes confusion.—Kww(talk) 15:11, 14 March 2015 (UTC)

Plus as a last point, I shall repeat myself by saying that if this whole article is based off what newspapers, everyhit or websites that use them as a ref then this article is a big sham as The Official Charts Company are regulators of the charts they know who number 1 was.

Thanks.92.29.36.88 (talk) 14:48, 14 March 2015 (UTC)

It really doesn't seem like you are reading replies, as you persist in claiming that the OCC doesn't support the claims about the Spice Girls. Please look at http://www.officialcharts.com/charts/singles-chart/19971221/7501 and tell me precisely why you think that doesn't support the claim that "Too Much" by the Spice Girls was #1 on Dec 25, 1997.—Kww(talk) 16:54, 14 March 2015 (UTC)

• Official Charts list of Christmas no 1s - Spice Girls, Reet Petite, Moon River etc - all are correct. Happy now? Bencherlite^Talk 20:29, 14 March 2015 (UTC)

  Pow. End of discussion. The Rambling Man (talk) 20:40, 14 March 2015 (UTC)

Just to quickly jump in here... what the original question misunderstands about the Christmas number one is the dates given. The date given for a chart is the week-ending date (ie. Saturday) - this however is not the date the chart was released to the public. For example 1997's Christmas chart is dated 27 Dec 97 (two days after Christmas), but this actually came out on the previous Sunday (21 December 1997), so yes, The Spice Girls were number one on Christmas day that year.--Tuzapicabit (talk) 23:31, 24 July 2015 (UTC)

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CHRISTMAS NUMBER 1 ODDS – BETTING ON XMAS NUMBER 1 SONGS

Unless I am mistaken, there seems to be nothing about betting on the UK Christmas Number 1 in the history part of the article, which is one of the reasons why the UK Christmas Number 1 has become an such an institution in the UK (I suppose the fact that there was a Christmas TOTP and that Billboard didn't publish a chart around this time in America - the chart being 'frozen' and carried over for another week - is a reason why its more of a British tradition/craze than something Americans are bothered with). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.154.172.230 (talk) 12:49, 17 November 2020 (UTC)

done — Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.152.238.174 (talk) 14:57, 7 December 2020 (UTC)

(Unfortunately I can't ping because you don't have an account) - I'm really sorry but I'm going to have to remove a lot of this, since it goes into far too much detail about the "modern" Christmas number one stuff than should really be in a "history" section. It also uses a fair bit of original research, which is prohibited on Wikipedia. However, I think the rise in novelty songs' success is definitely worth mentioning, so I'll see if I can't massage that into the text. — 🦊 04:16, 8 December 2020 (UTC)

References

Vandalism again

The sockpuppet vandal who kept us busy around Christmas of 2020, with their obsessive and badly-written nonsense about the Christmas number one not being determined by sales on Christmas Day itself, seems to be making a comeback...though why they're thinking about it at this time of year is a bit of a puzzle. Mark and inwardly digest (talk) 22:17, 22 July 2023 (UTC)

Move discussion in progress

There is a move discussion in progress on Talk:UK Singles Chart which affects this page. Please participate on that page and not in this talk page section. Thank you. —RMCD bot 19:17, 12 March 2024 (UTC)